Bay 12 Games Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Author Topic: Military: I forgot why I ever stopped playing DF. . until now  (Read 3565 times)

Haytrid

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile

I *really* love DF and support on Patreon.  I recently dove back in and can manage the day to day workings of a fort well enough.  That being said, I now remember why I rage-quit last time. . . .military.

I have read the wiki, watched video tutorials. . . . I just can not get the dorfs to put on their uniforms.

I made them all nice full sets of copper armor and they prefer to put on pig tail boots.  I have followed suggestions to have them remove all amor and put back on, disbanded the squad and recreated it. . . . they just run around with partial mis-matched crap again.

I feel that maybe I'm missing something basic, maybe that pig tail boot is better than copper?  I have included a link to my save, maybe someone could take a look and make some recommendations or recommend a more comprehensive tutorial on JUST uniforms.

Isn't the military development arc coming around soon?

Thank you!

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/19M3QKbdP49NK1S0EU558QsfodOucNuTl?usp=sharing
Logged

Killgoth

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Military: I forgot why I ever stopped playing DF. . until now
« Reply #1 on: March 01, 2019, 10:57:24 am »

I haven't played the last few versions, but isn't there an option on the military screen about wearing armor over clothes or instead of clothes?  Try checking/unchecking that option.  Pretty sure you want them to wear the armor instead of clothes. (but again it has been a while, so try playing with that option)
« Last Edit: March 01, 2019, 11:01:02 am by Killgoth »
Logged

Superdorf

  • Bay Watcher
  • Soothly we live in mighty years!
    • View Profile
Re: Military: I forgot why I ever stopped playing DF. . until now
« Reply #2 on: March 01, 2019, 12:12:42 pm »

There's a well-known bug that messes up the relation between military and civilian uniforms something awful. Soldiers set to wear their armor over their clothing will not wear the proper boots or gauntlets over their existing handwear/footwear.

The quick-and-dirty solution is to tell your soldiers to "replace clothing" with armor. That said... hm.

I've done some testing, and can now conclude: if your fortress doesn't have any mittens, shoes, or boots available, your soldiers will wear all their armor just fine even with "over clothing", donning shirt, breastplace, and greaves over their clothing and replacing their caps with helms. This requires some micromanagement to get right, but provides your soldiers with a (meager) additional layer of protection.

They'll even wear socks and gloves under their armor. Just not mittens, shoes or boots.
Logged
Falling angel met the rising ape, and the sound it made was

klonk
tormenting the player is important
Sigtext

Vindcara

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Military: I forgot why I ever stopped playing DF. . until now
« Reply #3 on: March 01, 2019, 12:56:53 pm »

On this topic, when dwarf fortress says "r: Over clthng", does that mean "dwarves are currently set to wear armor over clothing" or "press r to change settings, so that afterward dwarves will wear armor over clothing" ?
Logged

Superdorf

  • Bay Watcher
  • Soothly we live in mighty years!
    • View Profile
Re: Military: I forgot why I ever stopped playing DF. . until now
« Reply #4 on: March 01, 2019, 01:24:04 pm »

It does indeed mean "dwarves are currently set to wear armor over clothing".
Logged
Falling angel met the rising ape, and the sound it made was

klonk
tormenting the player is important
Sigtext

Haytrid

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Military: I forgot why I ever stopped playing DF. . until now
« Reply #5 on: March 01, 2019, 07:07:31 pm »

I am afraid I forgot to mention that I did mess with the toggle of over/replace clothing.  It seems even with the replace option, my dorfs chose to wear inferior pieces (I think pig tail is inferior to copper) that had I *think* the same garment layer as the copper I had forged for them.  The status was the same result "missing metal greaves", "Missing metal boots", etc.

I assume I can take the "choose specific gear" option for each dorf but that seems like a lot of work and I do have some upgraded metal pieces I looted from invaders that I would prefer they choose over the copper autonomously.
Logged

Superdorf

  • Bay Watcher
  • Soothly we live in mighty years!
    • View Profile
Re: Military: I forgot why I ever stopped playing DF. . until now
« Reply #6 on: March 01, 2019, 08:06:19 pm »

Huh... I cracked open the save and "replace clothing" worked just fine. The militia commander outfitted himself in shining steel...

Spoiler: Shining steel (click to show/hide)

and ahhahaha hoo boy did he ever need it. This fortress is glorious.

Ahem. Anyway. I don't see the problem here? Your dwarves equip themselves just fine, just so long as they know they're not supposed to wear civvies underneath.

I note you asked for a tutorial of some kind in the OP. Though it's perhaps not quite as narrow-focused as you'd like, I was able to find a wiki page on the subject. The stuff on equipping bone/shell armor and leather shields seems a wee bit outdated, but the rest looks solid. Notably, there's a decent troubleshooting section near the bottom.

Good luck. It really is a wonderful fort you've created.
« Last Edit: March 01, 2019, 08:23:12 pm by Superdorf »
Logged
Falling angel met the rising ape, and the sound it made was

klonk
tormenting the player is important
Sigtext

Loci

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Military: I forgot why I ever stopped playing DF. . until now
« Reply #7 on: March 01, 2019, 08:48:45 pm »

I am afraid I forgot to mention that I did mess with the toggle of over/replace clothing.  It seems even with the replace option, my dorfs chose to wear inferior pieces (I think pig tail is inferior to copper) that had I *think* the same garment layer as the copper I had forged for them.  The status was the same result "missing metal greaves", "Missing metal boots", etc.

"Replace clothing" is a per-position setting, not a per-squad setting. If you toggle all your dwarves to replace clothing they will muster up armored or naked.
Logged

Haytrid

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Military: I forgot why I ever stopped playing DF. . until now
« Reply #8 on: March 01, 2019, 11:24:38 pm »

First of all. . . . wow, thank you for the support and input in my lonely post Superdorf, Loci, and Vindcara.

::Superdorf::  I find it odd that Moldath equipped that, I let it run for a month, with those settings, before I posted this and they did nothing.

Dorfs will be dorfs.

Thank you all, truly appreciate your time and attention.
Logged

Saiko Kila

  • Bay Watcher
  • Dwarven alchemist
    • View Profile
Re: Military: I forgot why I ever stopped playing DF. . until now
« Reply #9 on: March 05, 2019, 02:15:41 am »

I've done some testing, and can now conclude: if your fortress doesn't have any mittens, shoes, or boots available, your soldiers will wear all their armor just fine even with "over clothing", donning shirt, breastplace, and greaves over their clothing and replacing their caps with helms. This requires some micromanagement to get right, but provides your soldiers with a (meager) additional layer of protection.

They'll even wear socks and gloves under their armor. Just not mittens, shoes or boots.

True, but I wanted to add that it is possible to have gauntlets or high boots equipped even when shoes or mittens are available, and without messing with options, it just requires some luck and perseverance. Once the offending part rots, they will often equip the proper part (for example shoes rots away, they equip metal high boots) and stay that way.

Also I use "Over clothing" and "Exact matches" on my citizen soldiers, and "Replace clothing" + "Exact matches" on mercenaries: mercenaries need "Replace clothing" to get rid of their own armour, which is usually low quality, and they don't have rights to common property (clothing).
Logged

anewaname

  • Bay Watcher
  • The mattock... My choice for problem solving.
    • View Profile
Re: Military: I forgot why I ever stopped playing DF. . until now
« Reply #10 on: March 06, 2019, 10:33:10 am »

I've done some testing, and can now conclude: if your fortress doesn't have any mittens, shoes, or boots available, your soldiers will wear all their armor just fine even with "over clothing", donning shirt, breastplace, and greaves over their clothing and replacing their caps with helms. This requires some micromanagement to get right, but provides your soldiers with a (meager) additional layer of protection.

They'll even wear socks and gloves under their armor. Just not mittens, shoes or boots.

True, but I wanted to add that it is possible to have gauntlets or high boots equipped even when shoes or mittens are available, and without messing with options, it just requires some luck and perseverance. Once the offending part rots, they will often equip the proper part (for example shoes rots away, they equip metal high boots) and stay that way.

Also I use "Over clothing" and "Exact matches" on my citizen soldiers, and "Replace clothing" + "Exact matches" on mercenaries: mercenaries need "Replace clothing" to get rid of their own armour, which is usually low quality, and they don't have rights to common property (clothing).
The "over clothing" does seem to work for the shoe/boot conflicts after some time. My theory is that the dwarf's civilian uniform had a change to the sock or shoe, and after they took off the old shoe, they put on the higher value "shaped" item first, which would be the exceptional copper boot, not the no-quality pigtail shoe.
Logged
Quote from: dragdeler
There is something to be said about, if the stakes are as high, maybe reconsider your certitudes. One has to be aggressively allistic to feel entitled to be able to trust. But it won't happen to me, my bit doesn't count etc etc... Just saying, after my recent experiences I couldn't trust the public if I wanted to. People got their risk assessment neurons rotten and replaced with game theory. Folks walk around like fat turkeys taunting the world to slaughter them.

Sanctume

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Military: I forgot why I ever stopped playing DF. . until now
« Reply #11 on: March 06, 2019, 11:33:09 am »

It sucks that I have to wait for mittens/gloves, socks/shoes to rot because dorf who came with these will keep wearing them. 

I do a 2-tier Uniform when I have a functioning armorer is able to stock full of available armors. 

The first tier is enough to get the squad training with some armor that will not conflict with existing civilian clothes.
Basic Uniform: Metal Helm, Metal Mail Shirt, Metal Greaves; "Over clothing" and "Exact matches".

The second tier is to force them to strip naked and get rid of those civilian clothes.
Armor Uniform: Metal Helm, Metal Shirt, Metal Greaves, Metal Gauntlets, Metal High(Low) Boots; "Replace clothing" + "Exact matches"

Then I have specific weapon uniforms, e.g.
Axe Uniform:  Armor Uniform + Metal Shield, Metal Breasplate, Battle-Axe.

In order to micro manage this portion:
1 door-locked room, 11x11 room with Armor stockpile inside.
Order squad to station here. 
Lock door.
Remove station.
(I think) m-e-U to assign Axe Uniform to Squad with Shift+Enter. 
At this point, they should all strip and pick up all available armors. 
« Last Edit: March 06, 2019, 11:35:33 am by Sanctume »
Logged