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Author Topic: That First Werecreature....  (Read 3351 times)

anewaname

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Re: That First Werecreature....
« Reply #15 on: August 31, 2018, 02:43:07 pm »

I do essentially the same thing that Staalo is suggesting... keep some expendable animals near the entrance (small animals are better because they flee better and so, survive longer, and not inside the entrance, because you want them able to flee away from the inner fort), and ensure I have either a raise-able bridge, or a couple of doors that can be locked to buy time (while the were is destroying the doors, your dwarfs build a wall on the inside to seal it). I do this initially because it is low cost in dwarf-work-hours. I also use SoundSense so I hear the combat sounds to get the fastest warning possible.
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There is something to be said about, if the stakes are as high, maybe reconsider your certitudes. One has to be aggressively allistic to feel entitled to be able to trust. But it won't happen to me, my bit doesn't count etc etc... Just saying, after my recent experiences I couldn't trust the public if I wanted to. People got their risk assessment neurons rotten and replaced with game theory. Folks walk around like fat turkeys taunting the world to slaughter them.

Mort Stroodle

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Re: That First Werecreature....
« Reply #16 on: September 01, 2018, 12:53:02 am »

As long as your military holds it off long enough to keep the majority of your dwarves out of harm's way before it turns back, you're fine. Take some of the individual bedrooms dug out for dwarves and convert it into a makeshift "hospital", with just the beds in a hospital zone. Then when the injured militia dwarves are brought to the hospital, just wall in any dwarves that were bitten in the fight. With your infected dwarves quarantined, the infection will be compeletely contained. The better security system you have though, the fewer dwarves will be killed or bitten, and the less losses you'll incur. Step one is to be notified as early as possible when a werebeast is on the map. Statues are good because werebeasts will topple them, sending out a notification (I like to use statues of terrified dwarves to roleplay a feasible distraction). Putting one-tile pens around the map with single animals inside to spot the werebeast is also a good strategy, and chained dogs outside your entrance is a must for protection against were chinchilla, kobold, and kea alike. Then you can try to block it with a drawbridge, but you might not see the beast until it's too late for this. If that doesn't work, send in the militia. Leather armor can be built early and can lessen the devestation of werebeasts, but weapons are most important.

Also, if you're making a fortress in a world where a PREVIOUS fort of yours was taken over by werebeasts, DON'T. Make a new world. Your earlier citizens will imigrate and you'll find yourself with sneaky wererhinos in the base.
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Saiko Kila

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Re: That First Werecreature....
« Reply #17 on: September 01, 2018, 05:48:09 am »

It probably has been discussed before, but for the life of me, the search feature doesn't give me some good results.
I have played over 50 games in DF and when the 1st werecreature appears, it all goes south.
[...]
Guys I'd love some insight please.
I know losing is !!fun!! but it would be nice if I would not lose "again" next time from that 1st werecreature.

I must say you were unlucky if the werebeasts. Really unlucky (50 times? I haven't played that many forts in my life). Just after reading this post I had my FIRST werebeast in my current fortress, and it was in year 9, in mid-autumn. It killed one freshly naturalised elf, and bit a scholar visitor (who was later credited with the kill of the werebeast, since he was the last to punch it before it bled out, and being bitten himself, carried the curse out into the world), but it was dispatched by a single trained soldier with a pickaxe. The werebeast missed every hit directed at the soldier, because he was trained so well, and lost several limbs to the pickaxe.

So apart from the wood-collecting elf and the cursed visitor there were no casualties, despite sizeable lumbering operation, 300 citizens, 150 visitors and hundreds of animals. This it to be expected with well trained military. But it still was my mistake, because I already have walls with a dozen of gates, but neglected installing the watchdogs near the gates. I don't care about thieves (they all target the same artefact deep in the fortress, so all will fail), but have forgotten about the possibility of beasts.

Installing animals near gates (either a chain or pasture) is the best detection method. There are known solutions for watchtowers, which have animals safely kept (e.g. behind windows, raised above ground to prevent building destroyers), but they have relatively short range, I'm not sure how well they work in current version.

Obviously you need a way to keep closed, as stated in other posts it is enough to be able to turtle for a short period (two days).

Only biting by werebeast transfers the curse (in vanilla), so if someone was bit, he is cursed, but if was only hit or scratched then not (but to be sure isolate them anyway).

Also, the werebeasts attack only if you have population of 20+, so if they are your main nemesis, you can try to build defences before hitting this number.
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mikekchar

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Re: That First Werecreature....
« Reply #18 on: September 02, 2018, 12:54:07 am »

My werebeast strategy, which has never failed me:  If you have animals near the werebeast, burrow all your dwarfs behind a door or two (as mentioned previously).  Move your squad so that they are together (and have their weapons, etc), but still behind the door(s).  As soon as the werebeast turns back, run out and kill them (OK, I occasionally fail to get them before they get off the map, but it's pretty rare).

In the case that there are no animals nearby, choose *one* of your dwarfs that you like the least.  Put them in the military if they aren't already.  From the squad menu you can station single dwarfs (this is super useful, although the UI is a bit confusing).  Station the dwarf near the werebeast.  This will buy you enough time for the rest of your dwarfs to turtle.  If the dwarf survives (only happened a few times for me), inspect the combat logs closely for bites.

If the have a bite, a few days before the full moon (to give them time to have a drink, pray, or whatever) station them out of sight of any other dwarfs.  I usually just station them at the side of the map.  A stationed werebeast will not move unless they see another creature.  Even if the happen to see some wildlife, if they are at the side of the map, they will always kill it before getting to close to the fortress (because werebeats are super fast).  And then they will just stand there.

If you had bad luck and you manage to potentially infect more than one dwarf, send them to opposite sides of the map (you've got 4 sides -- if you manage to potentially infect more than 4 dwarfs, then that's poor planning, not poor luck).

Never be afraid to sacrifice a single dwarf to a werebeast.  A single casualty in a werebeast attack is cheap (as you probably already know).  Always be afraid of sending an entire squad to fight a werebeast.  That will bring down your whole fortress.
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Bumber

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Re: That First Werecreature....
« Reply #19 on: September 02, 2018, 06:10:33 am »

Statues are good because werebeasts will topple them, sending out a notification (I like to use statues of terrified dwarves to roleplay a feasible distraction).
Maybe you could build an automated trap? Not sure if they'll go for support beams, but you can definitely do stuff with fluids above doors.
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THE xTROLL FUR SOCKx RUSE WAS A........... DISTACTION        the carp HAVE the wagon

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Fleeting Frames

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Re: That First Werecreature....
« Reply #20 on: September 02, 2018, 09:50:37 am »

Fastest is minecart on a ramp held back by floating door (1 step, vs fluid's 8-35), but any trigger that removes the path while not being destroyable has additional 100 step delay.

However, werebeasts take long enough to destroy buildings that with some baits you can slow them down 'till they revert and then catch them via a cage trap - such as what Sanctume did in his Vault fortress.

Statue has the advantage of cheapness and reusability, though I'm fond of floodgates for this purpose since they can be freestanding too, block sight, and do meaningful slowdown.

Bumber

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Re: That First Werecreature....
« Reply #21 on: September 02, 2018, 04:48:23 pm »

You could distract them with a second door while the trap springs. Or just suspend a bunch of magma over the door, with design considerations to make sure your surface won't burn. That's more late game, though.
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Reading his name would trigger it. Thinking of him would trigger it. No other circumstances would trigger it- it was strictly related to the concept of Bill Clinton entering the conscious mind.

THE xTROLL FUR SOCKx RUSE WAS A........... DISTACTION        the carp HAVE the wagon

A wizard has turned you into a wagon. This was inevitable (Y/y)?

Fleeting Frames

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Re: That First Werecreature....
« Reply #22 on: September 03, 2018, 03:28:46 am »

Magma seems like a pretty strong solution, if further distractions or cages are unavailable - indeed, even 1/7 magma will block pathing and stay around long enough for a bridge to raise and/or lower. If one goes for having magma workshops up topside before first caravan, it is just as easy as suspending water.

Dunamisdeos

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Re: That First Werecreature....
« Reply #23 on: September 04, 2018, 12:57:01 pm »

OK FIRST OF ALL FOLKS werebeasts can absolutely enter the map in stealth. Lest you forget, even tho most of the pics have expired.

Second, my method is you park some dogs out by the entrance to your fort. Be sure that there are cage traps both well in front and well behind the dogs. I usually have a long entrance corridor of some kind for this reason.

The werebeast will be detected or attack the dogs, thereby breaking it's stealth. Any dwarves unlucky enough to be very nearby will likely be mauled, but the thing will transform back after fighting the dogs and get caught in the traps. Then you can do whatever you want with it.
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Eric Blank

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Re: That First Werecreature....
« Reply #24 on: September 04, 2018, 02:39:02 pm »

I find its easiest to immediately set up a tiny shack with a door and a 1-tile hallway on the inside of it (so you can build a single wall to totally shut it off since werebeasts are building destroyers) immediately make that a burrow, and make that the only entrance to your underground fort, and pasture your animals in the four corners and sides around that, about 12+ tiles away. The werebeast will more likely than not either attack your animals first or be spotted by them, giving you a chance to order your dwarves indoors and lock it, build that wall behind the door and wait. I find the woodcutter is most likely to get caught outside so ill give him some combat skill with the axe and dodging, and sometimes they avoid being attacked altogether if the werebeast is too busy chasing animals around
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Deus Machina

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Re: That First Werecreature....
« Reply #25 on: September 04, 2018, 09:04:25 pm »

Werecreatures are the bane of my forts' existence.
I've just started immediately moating up or capping off the entrance, and conscripting any hunter. I never seem to get anyone that needs it quarantined in time, though.
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Dunamisdeos

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Re: That First Werecreature....
« Reply #26 on: September 05, 2018, 12:36:18 pm »

I always hunker down and raise a bridge until I get defenses in order.

It's the dwarvenly thing to do.
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Leatra

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Re: That First Werecreature....
« Reply #27 on: September 05, 2018, 03:00:46 pm »

I have the opposite problem. I want to have more werebeasts and vampires in my world but there is only one werebeast and 4 vampires alive, I think. I have to get really lucky to have one of them visit. I usually play young worlds though (current one is 150 years) so that's probably why.
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Dunamisdeos

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Re: That First Werecreature....
« Reply #28 on: September 05, 2018, 03:04:03 pm »

I usually play around there and have that problem sometimes, but usually I have enough. Wonder what the difference is.
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FACT I: Post note art is best art.
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FACT III: "All life begins with Post-it notes and ends with Post-it notes. This is the truth! This is my belief!...At least for now."
FACT IV: SPEECHO THE TRUSTWORM IS YOUR FRIEND or BEHOLD: THE FRUIT ENGINE 3.0

Leatra

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Re: That First Werecreature....
« Reply #29 on: September 05, 2018, 03:08:58 pm »

Probably just luck. All I know is that there needs to be at least one vampire/werebeast type, temples for mortals to get cursed in, and deities to do the cursing. I wish world generation gave us more options, but the myths and magic update will focus on this it seems. From the development page:

Quote
Magic settings: From none to ubiquitous

Randomness settings: From Earth-like world to standard fantasy to completely random

Hostility settings: No death or violence to regular settings to bleak and horrifying
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