Bay 12 Games Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Poll

What Time Is It?

Space-Time
- 2 (14.3%)
Hammer Time
- 3 (21.4%)
Time...to die.
- 6 (42.9%)
Peanut Butter Jelly Time
- 3 (21.4%)

Total Members Voted: 14


Pages: 1 ... 42 43 [44] 45 46 ... 88

Author Topic: Industrialized Warfare: Salvios Thread / 1917 A.C. Cold Season (COMPLETE)  (Read 100404 times)

Taricus

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile

Fair point, but anything heavier isn't likely to be all that useful in street to street fighting on Harren Island.
Logged
Quote from: evictedSaint
We sided with the holocaust for a fucking +1 roll

Man of Paper

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Industrialized Warfare: Salvios Thread / 1913 A.C. Hot Season (Revision Phase)
« Reply #646 on: August 31, 2018, 04:01:36 am »

Year 1913 AC Hot Season, Design Phase


Proposal:  GBC-13 Gavrillium Bunker Cannon 'Scylla'
GBC-13 Gavrillium Bunker Cannon 'Scylla'
Named for the Greek monster with incredibly fast and hard-hitting bites from above, the GBC-13 is a 105mm emplacement weapon designed to be built into bunkers and used to deny large swathes of (open) terrain to the enemy. The gun fires a variety of rounds including Gavrillium incendiary (based on the M2 grenade) and HE as well as solid shot (can be deployed to defend coastlines against hostile naval activity). It is basically a field gun, firing at high velocities on direct lines, incapable of indirect fire. It uses the same alloys and Gavrillium gunpowder as the GA1b, though we can, of course, utilize rounds without Gavrillium powder if it is necessary to fire more rounds in a shorter length of time. The gun itself is not terribly complicated, the main difference from the GA1b being in the high velocity projectiles rather than the low velocities of a howitzer. The largest bunkers equipped with GBC-13s also make use of a central Gavrillium generator, which provides power to electric lighting, heating (where necessary), and generous numbers of fans where cooling is required. These generators are truly there, however, not to comfort the troops, but to produce a source of cold. A water system pipes water to all the GBC-13s in the bunker, running through water sleeves around the barrel and breech and then back to the generator, keeping the generator at operating temperature and cooling the cannons to allow them to fire faster.

Difficulty: Very Hard
Result: 7 (6+3-2) = Average

Ask and ye shall receive. At least, that is the case for the Scylla. It is a 105mm cannon designed for direct fire using HE and solid shot (we attempted GavShells but were restricted by time). The system has a maximum range of 10/15 kilometers (regular/gavpowder) provided there is direct line of sight. The bunkers the Scylla is deployed in are equipped with a single (relatively) massive 20-Rod GavGenerator (GavEngine? Interchangable at any rate) to supply power to the bunker's life "support" and QoL equipment. The Generator is stored in an insulated room called the "Ice Box" which contains pipes that circulate water to rubberized tubes connected to the water sleeve wrapped around the barrels of the Scyllas. These provide cooling for the barrel while also providing the heated water to the Ice Box to help keep temperatures cool. Ambient temperature in the room will continue to drop regardless as the Gavrilium rods deplete. Once they near depletion there is a window where the circulating water is still warm enough to keep from freezing and the water at the guns cool enough to keep them from overheating when the rods must be replaced. A small backup generator provides power to the creature comforts should the 20-Rod fail. With access to circulating water or without GavPowder the gun can be continuously fired at 5-8 rounds per minute depending on skill of the crew.

As the design calls for Ore, Gavrilium, and Chemical Compounds the Scylla is (Expensive) and [complex] without a source of Chemical Compounds.


------------


Proposal: LEA-13 Lifting Engine Aircraft
LEA-13 Lifting Engine Aircraft
Some of our scientists were experimenting with Caelium augmentations to Gavrillium engines, and discovered something strange. They didn't quite manage to make a better engine, as their only prototype for the "better engine" concept was smashed into the ceiling. Like good Salviosi engineers, however, they tested the new phenomenon until realizing that a properly heat-treated sample of Caelium (called Gravite because it's cooler that way) can be placed in the middle of a set of Gavrillium rods rotating around a common center, and will then produce a force relative to the strength of gravity---regardless of its altitude (unlike Caelium). This force always goes in the same direction relative to the piece, so a piece of Gravite held upside down inside the rotating rods will provide a downwards force, and a lifting engine turned slightly to the side will provide a force that both lifts the engine and moves it sideways.

To capitalize on this we have constructed the Lifting Engine, comprised of a Gavrillium motor and its heater spinning the rods-and-Caelium assembly to generate lift, bundled up into a neat package conveniently labelled "UP, NO REALLY, THIS WAY IS UP. DO NOT INVERT IF YOU LIKE YOUR BONES INTACT".

The LEA-13 is a simple contraption, using one of these new Lifting Engines attached to part of the neighbor's lawn chair collection a simple basket from a civilian hot-air balloon. A Ceramah radio is installed in the basket (powered by an alternator on the Gavrillium engine, saving the weight normally used for its generator), and a set of cute binoculars plus a camera are handed to the soldiers who offended their superior officers willing volunteer pilots, who can then use the high altitudes attained by the balloons to survey enemy positions, dispositions, and radio down to their commanders or (every soldier's favorite) their accompanying artillery battery, to deliver extremely accurate fire support. Well, extremely accurate on the second shot, anyway...Regardless, the LEA can be used tethered to the ground, or, by the daring pilot, untethered. Untethered LEAs can reach great heights and see very, very far, but of course it gets cold and breezy, and nobody likes calling in the Salviosi Merchant Marine's Rescue Division just to pick up a wayward LEA-13 and pilot when they inevitably drift really far off course.

Difficulty: Very Hard
Result: 4 (4+2-2) = Poor

The first step towards becoming airborne was designing a device capable of providing the ability to lift things, and so we began working with Caelium. What we found was that when molten Caelium was rapidly cooled within a strong magnetic field the side of the bar facing magnetic North during cooling became "dominant". The Refined Caelium (or "Gravite" as some have called it) pulls towards to direction of the Dominant side when exposed to a strong enough magnetic field and will hold it's position so long as the core is set to it's neutral upwards position and a small amount of power (much smaller than Caelium requires) is supplied. The power needed to maintain position is constant regardless of altitude, unlike Caeliums fluctuating requirements. However, during the process of forming Gravite it lost some of it's lifting power in regards to objects it is attached to. As a result an object "flown" with Gravite will require a greater initial energy supply to lift while requiring less to maintain altitude. Of note is the fact that, while power requirements for lifting against gravity drop as the core gains altitude, the engines will currently Overcool, lock up, and fail above 10km thanks to the very low ambient temperature, though we can't really deploy men that high up anyway. Reparations were paid for damage done to property by plummeting test engines. Also of note is that the Gravite core is currently fixed into position and so the whole engine must be shifted to change direction.

The second step was creating a device capable of carrying a pilot and of being attached to the engine. We stole a lawn chair procured a basket used with balloons and secured the engine above it. Two cables hang from the engine to give the passenger easy access to activating and deactivating the engine. Pulling one will start or stop the engine while the other alternates between high and low power. A LEA-13 with it's engine set for high power will continue to gain altitude until it reaches the end of it's tether (or the engine's current operating ceiling, but that'd be bad) or the engine is set to Low power, where the LEA-13 will be able to hover. Due to the nature of the engine, the LEA-13 rises faster the higher it goes, so the passenger needs to be mindful of where he is in relation to the Earth. The final appearance of the LEA-13 is a small basket fixed to a spherical metal casing approximately a meter in diameter which houses the engine. While this smaller profile would be harder to spot were it not for the glare on the casing, the whole thing is rocked fairly easily by high winds.

The passengers are equipped with binoculars and a camera, but installation of the radio was put off due to funds needing to go to aforementioned reparations. The cameras tend to be useless in the swaying basket, so a notepad and pencil are provided as well.

The LEA-13 costs 3 Ore, 2 Gavrilium, and 2 Caelium, making it (CHEAP).

We have also discovered Gravite, a Caelium-related material which is gravitationally aligned and will propel itself in the direction of the Dominant Side or Edge when sufficient power to overcome Earth's gravitational pull is supplied. [If that doesn't sound like what you wanted remember that we're mentally on the same page, it's just a little difficult to words when it comes to this wizardly resource stuff lately.]


------------


With the ability to rise into the skies and observe at a distance we have been granted an Espionage Credit with Special Rules. This Espionage Credit provides "tiers" you can select, which dictate what information you go for as well as modifiers for the Abberan's roll. You have until the End of the Revision Phase to decide how to utilize this. Results will be in the combat report. The options to choose from are as follows. Note that options have been reduced due to the Poor result of the LEA-13.

Peek: We opt not to hang around too long, gathering intel for a few minutes at a time so as to not give away our own positions. Provides -1 to your espionage roll but -3 to Abberas.
Light Observation: We have our LEA-13s deployed on a regular, if brief, basis. Provides no modifier to your roll, but a -1 to Abberas.
Moderate Observation: The LEA-13s are deployed more frequently at the risk of giving away our own positions. Provides +1 to your roll but no modifier for Abbera.

All results will reveal information on your opponents, with a high enough roll giving full knowledge of the opponent's armory. Information provided on lower rolls will be dependent on size of the design and frequency of use.

You have also successfully fulfilled our request for a large emplacement. As a result you now have a total of three (3) Revisions this Revision Phase. Do note that, as you are also deciding on your Espionage Credit options now, any revision made to the LEA-13 will not go into effect and alter the Espionage Credit retroactively.

IT IS NOW THE REVISION PHASE.




Spoiler: Designs (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Territories (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Resources (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Special Rules (click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: August 31, 2018, 08:36:52 am by Man of Paper »
Logged

Twinwolf

  • Bay Watcher
  • Probably hanging around Forum Games and Roleplay
    • View Profile

Senapang Pattern Rifle (Var.S): A sniper variant of the Senapang. When a new batch of Senapangs are produced, they are each tested for their accuracy at various ranges. Those that have the greatest marks are fitted with a long-range scope, and become Senapang Variant: Sniper rifles, and are given to the best marksmen in each squad in place of their standard service rifle. These snipers pick off enemies as they poke their heads out of their fortifications, or aim for high value targets when they foolishly enter their sightlines.

Retractable Roofs: As we saw, as good as the Armored Sled is, it has a weakness: The high ground. If one can get a solid angle they can fire down into the sled like shooting fish in a barrel. This won't do when we arrive at Harren. As such, I propose we revise the Armored Sled to include a roof. In order to not hinder soldiers getting out of the sled, the roof is built to retract with a crank on the inside, and a hatch in case that mechanism jams.

A couple revision ideas.

As for espionage, the question: do we value knowing the enemy’s arsenal or them not knowing ours more, and which way do we think they’ll answer. As mentioned in discord, we really don't have much we need to hide - the radio and the mountain suit, mostly. Maybe the Armored Sled. Even seeing the Mountain Suit, which they likely will due to it's ubiquity, they won't know about Fortification 4 or our ability to jump to it with revision because we've not used either. As such, we don't really mind them seeing unless our goal is to keep them guessing.

We only get up to moderate observation, which is a boost for us and nothing for them. This implies that, if they did better, they'd get options that give them bigger and bigger bonuses while also giving us bonuses. We don't know for a fact they did better, but it's best to assume the worst. Do we think they want to hide their cool stuff or see ours more?

Edit: Come to think of it, we're also not going to want them to see the SMG-12a... but I think it's probably worth the risk of them seeing it to get a peek at their list.
« Last Edit: August 31, 2018, 06:53:16 am by Twinwolf »
Logged
Sigtext!
Of course, Twin is neither man nor woman but an unholy eldritch abomination like every other Bay12er. The difference is they hide it better.
Quote from: Caellath on IRC
<Caellath>: Twinwolf, your thirst for blood has been noted.

Madman198237

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile

I'd go for maximum screwing-with-them; just hide our stuff. It gives them a -3 to their roll but only a -1 to ours. If they try to find out our armory, they're not likely to succeed but they'll make us more likely to succeed.

So, for revisions. Up-armor the sled and perhaps also motorize it, we could add a Caelium gun carriage to the Scylla and use it on the offense as well, we could attempt a recoil-absorption mechanism using Myomer (maybe better to save that for a design?), we could fix the Kerata, possibly using two revisions (one to fix armor, maybe using Gavrillium absorption armor as proposed earlier, and one to fix propulsion/the lifting structure).

I'd do one to fix the Kerata's propulsion, a sled upgrade, and a mobile version of the Scylla, giving us a high-power field gun and some armor capability. Next turn we'll probably want to deploy a breakthrough vehicle (AKA tank) to get past those pesky fixed defenses, and an aircraft because our present one *sucks*.
Logged
We shall make the highest quality of quality quantities of soldiers with quantities of quality.

Taricus

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile

The Caelium propulsion on the Kerata is best fixed by removing the entire damn thing from it, given that it's more or less the source of all the problems with it.

ArC-13c 'Turtle': In an effort to get the Kerata into a working shape, an overhaul of the vehicle is proposed. First to go is the notoriously unreliable caelium undercarriage, being replaced with a more conventional one which is intended to stop all the bucking nonsense with the vehicle. The second is the replacement of the regular steel armour on the vehicle with Caelium steel, with the roof now also being Caelium steel instead of canvas. Finally, given the poor positioning of the firing ports, the 'Turtle' omits them from the design entirely.
Logged
Quote from: evictedSaint
We sided with the holocaust for a fucking +1 roll

Rockeater

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile

It's feel extremely easy revision, we could just move the ports instead of removing them.
Logged
Damnit people, this is why I said to keep the truce. Because now everyone's ganging up on the cats.
Also, don't forget to contact your local Eldritch Being(s), so that they can help with our mission to destroy the universe.

Madman198237

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile

Ditching the undercarriages is simple and should allow us to thicken the armor while still replacing it with Caelium Steel and upgrading suspension or whatever. Moving the firing ports is a zero-difficulty task, I'd hope, since they're not exactly rocket science to make or install.
Logged
We shall make the highest quality of quality quantities of soldiers with quantities of quality.

Baffler

  • Bay Watcher
  • Caveat Lector.
    • View Profile

That all makes sense to me. We'll at least want to make motorized versions of the sleds. If we do that it also allows us a better chance of fixing the Kerata by offloading the troop carrying duty onto the sled and making it a more dedicated combat vehicle. How're these?

Pembawa Troop Carrier
An armored caelium sled adapted to be more suitable for combat use. Its pushing handles have been removed and the cab enclosed by a metal roof, and a pair of benches have been added along with a seat for a driver at the front. It is controlled by a simple wheel which controls the flow of power from the gav generator (made more powerful than the stock version) to the caelium foils that lift the vehicle, with a foot pedal to control speed. Forward motion is achieved by lifting the rear of the vehicle further off the ground, while turning and steering are achieved by feeding unequal amounts of power to different parts of the hull. A brake lever is also included, which allows the driver to cut power to the caelium completely without turning off the engine.

(Someone else could probably come up with a better solution tbh. It seems like it should be a fairly simple change to me but the propulsion system might be considered design-worthy. Certainly a kangaroo carrier type thing is better than having someone literally push the thing around in combat though.)

ArC-13c "Kerata" Armored Car
A series of changes made in attempt at addressing the Kerata's most serious issues, mostly by stripping down some of its more ambitious features. Manufacturing has been simplified by giving Guaranteed Motorization the plans for the purpose-built body (which includes the originally intended turret with LGG-12 mount, although the grenade projector has been removed,) and the caelium plates in the undercarriage have likewise been removed. Some attention was also given to making the firing ports more ergonomic, and passenger capacity was reduced from 8 to 4 to assist in this and to make room for the Kerata's weaponry. Finally, the canvas roof was replaced with a steel one.
« Last Edit: August 31, 2018, 12:50:18 pm by Baffler »
Logged
Quote from: Helgoland
Even if you found a suitable opening, I doubt it would prove all too satisfying. And it might leave some nasty wounds, depending on the moral high ground's geology.
Location subject to periodic change.
Baffler likes silver, walnut trees, the color green, tanzanite, and dogs for their loyalty. When possible he prefers to consume beef, iced tea, and cornbread. He absolutely detests ticks.

Madman198237

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile

I don't think Caelium's orientation matters, though. We'd need to be using a Lifting Engine for that, and that'd probably be a design to put one in there. What we COULD do, however, would be to add a Gavrillium Engine to the underside of the Armored Sled, losing the generator in favor of an alternator or whatever on the engine itself, reducing the power to the Caelium so the Sled doesn't quite float, and just using a regular old set of four wheels or a pair of caterpillar tracks to provide motion.
Logged
We shall make the highest quality of quality quantities of soldiers with quantities of quality.

Taricus

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile

Motorising the sleds kinda defeats the point of them. That, and there's not really a good way of propelling them forwards or the like, doubly so with their relatively small size.

Anyway, I can support your revision plans for the Kerata Baffler, though given the year it might be prudent to update the designation to ArC-13c
Logged
Quote from: evictedSaint
We sided with the holocaust for a fucking +1 roll

Maximum Spin

  • Bay Watcher
  • [OPPOSED_TO_LIFE] [GOES_TO_ELEVEN]
    • View Profile

I suggest we update the designation to "1913 Honda Kerata"
Logged

Baffler

  • Bay Watcher
  • Caveat Lector.
    • View Profile

I don't think Caelium's orientation matters, though. We'd need to be using a Lifting Engine for that, and that'd probably be a design to put one in there.

It actually does, or at least that's how I read it.

Quote
Gravite: An odd silver metal with a hint of green found within our volcanic mountains, Gravite is a newly discovered material that, once smelted into bars, will float a few millimeters off of any surface below it. Applying a current will cause the metal to rise higher proportionally to the power provided. The Gravite bars will shift around in the air if tilted, moving in the direction they're dipping towards at the same level their current has them set at.

So we can steer it that way using properties of caelium that we already know, at least in theory. A Lifting Engine would probably do a better job, but that would be more expensive than just putting in a bigger engine and redoing the power supply to the caelium foils. A tracked vehicle would be even simpler, but the Kerata has shown us it's not generally a good idea to use caelium for anything but caelium steel in something that isn't designed to hover. I'm really not sure how to call it.
Logged
Quote from: Helgoland
Even if you found a suitable opening, I doubt it would prove all too satisfying. And it might leave some nasty wounds, depending on the moral high ground's geology.
Location subject to periodic change.
Baffler likes silver, walnut trees, the color green, tanzanite, and dogs for their loyalty. When possible he prefers to consume beef, iced tea, and cornbread. He absolutely detests ticks.

Twinwolf

  • Bay Watcher
  • Probably hanging around Forum Games and Roleplay
    • View Profile

I think this is enough options to start voting.

Quote from: Voting Time
Revisions (3 Credits)
Senapang Pattern Rifle (Sniper Variant) (1): Twinwolf
Retracting Roofs (1): Twinwolf
ArC-13c 'Turtle' (0):
Pembawa Troop Carrier (0):
ArC-13c "Kerata" Armored Car (1): Twinwolf

Espionage
Peek (-1 to us, -3 to Abbera) (0):
Light Observation (-1 to Abbera) (0):
Moderate Observation (+1 to us) (1): Twinwolf
Logged
Sigtext!
Of course, Twin is neither man nor woman but an unholy eldritch abomination like every other Bay12er. The difference is they hide it better.
Quote from: Caellath on IRC
<Caellath>: Twinwolf, your thirst for blood has been noted.

Maximum Spin

  • Bay Watcher
  • [OPPOSED_TO_LIFE] [GOES_TO_ELEVEN]
    • View Profile

I haven't decided on revisions yet, but I think it's a very good idea to accept a little bit of hardship to screw with the other side more.

Quote from: Voting Time
Revisions (3 Credits)
Senapang Pattern Rifle (Sniper Variant) (1): Twinwolf
Retracting Roofs (1): Twinwolf
ArC-13c 'Turtle' (0):
Pembawa Troop Carrier (0):
ArC-13c "Kerata" Armored Car (1): Twinwolf

Espionage
Peek (-1 to us, -3 to Abbera) (1): Maximum Spin
Light Observation (-1 to Abbera) (0):
Moderate Observation (+1 to us) (1): Twinwolf
Logged

Taricus

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile

Quote from: Voting Time
Revisions (3 Credits)
Senapang Pattern Rifle (Sniper Variant) (2): Twinwolf, Taricus
Retracting Roofs (2): Twinwolf, Taricus
ArC-13c 'Turtle' (0):
Pembawa Troop Carrier (0):
ArC-13c "Kerata" Armored Car (2): Twinwolf, Taricus

Espionage
Peek (-1 to us, -3 to Abbera) (2): Maximum Spin, Taricus
Light Observation (-1 to Abbera) (0):
Moderate Observation (+1 to us) (1): Twinwolf
Logged
Quote from: evictedSaint
We sided with the holocaust for a fucking +1 roll
Pages: 1 ... 42 43 [44] 45 46 ... 88