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What Time Is It?

Space-Time
- 2 (14.3%)
Hammer Time
- 3 (21.4%)
Time...to die.
- 6 (42.9%)
Peanut Butter Jelly Time
- 3 (21.4%)

Total Members Voted: 14


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Author Topic: Industrialized Warfare: Salvios Thread / 1917 A.C. Cold Season (COMPLETE)  (Read 101825 times)

Taricus

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Given it's probable weight, it absolutely would be easily used by the power armour. Hell, it's possible that even the G3-12 would be usable by it without assistance.

Not to mention the armour could likely get in closer more rapidly because of the myomer allowing it to move faster too.
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Madman198237

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Most of the progress in warfare over the last two centuries has been in the form of "how to get further from your enemy yet still kill them"...so we really shouldn't bother trying to undo that in the name of getting closer to an enemy who is ALSO armored kind of like us. Also, the enemy has semi-auto shotguns. We don't want to get any closer than we have to even with the armor of an Avalanche suit.
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Twinwolf

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I do accept that we're gonna need some sort of answer to their aircraft, either as a new design (AA gun? New airship?) or revision (Fix the armor on the Perahudara or convert one of our existing guns to have an AA version). The best we can really do right now is loading up the Perahudara (or however you spell that :p) with FMJG ammo. Honestly, if we manage to win the research credit from this turn's contest, I think it'd be good to dump that on getting an actually good airship. That said, I think the city is where we can most get away without it for a turn, since there's cover everywhere and buildings to get high enough to take shots on it.

That said, I think now is a good time to do it. We have ubiquitous AP, and they don't. Our power armor, if it goes even averagely, will have greater capabilities than their equivalent since it actually enhances the abilities of the soldier rather than just strapping armor plates to them. The close quarters of the city is where it'll make the most difference, especially if we do run into their power armored men, and it locks down defensive positions harder than we'd be able to with standard infantry. It also has the non-direct-combat use of letting us use things with the capabilities of mountain suits right up on the front too, rather than just in the backline logistics. So, I think if we're gonna do power armor, Harren is the place to do it.
« Last Edit: October 04, 2018, 08:21:08 am by Twinwolf »
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Madman198237

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Perahudara is the original spelling unless I've been mistaken for like two weeks now, and FMJG isn't a magical solution to the substantial weaponry and armor present on the enemy airship. We need an answer in the form of a large gun, because anything else requires our slow bucket of an airship to get close to the enemy, while getting shot repeatedly by machineguns and a 155. That's not going to work.

As for now being a good time to do power armor:
Yes, we have ubiquitous AP and really good grenades, making their power-armor less than useful. They have ubiquitous shotguns. Not a great idea to get close to someone with shotguns, better to just spray them down with an SMG from a distance, which is something that power armor doesn't REALLY help with. Furthermore, city combat is all killzones (open streets filled with machineguns) and buildings, neither of which is good for power armor unless it's super-power-armor that can resist sustained machinegun fire. Yeah, it does give us armored infantry capable of holding places better, but our MGs already do that. Let's try to avoid getting said defensive places blown up from above, yeah? Because the GM has already described their airship as a "primitive AC-130", and a single antiaircraft gun revision isn't going to do squat against it. We don't need mountain suits right on the front lines, there's nothing useful they do anywhere close to the front. Artillery doesn't need to move up there, etc.
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Maximum Spin

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Super Pack Personal Aeronautic Equipment: This lightweight, backpack-sized device uses a caelium foil powered by a standard gavrillium engine to propel the user vertically to altitudes otherwise reached only by newfangled aeroplanes and soaring birds. With proper training, users can perform stealth boarding and direct engagement of enemy aircraft. Comes with an integrated breathing apparatus, but users are still trained to hold their breath for a long time, just in case.
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NUKE9.13

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See, I think power armour is exactly what you want in urban combat. Close spaces, loads of corners and hiding spots- you want to be able to tank an unexpected shot- power armour turns a deadly ambush into a minor annoyance. It might be worth trying for some added agility in the Avalanche to really make it excel in the city, now that I think about it. Someone suggested a grappling hook... with the research credit, that might be viable.
...probably not, though. At least not without decreasing the weight of the Avalanche considerably.
...wait, we can totally do that.
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Madman198237

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Except the default solution for both our armies is not "storm the hostile building full of guns and potentially full of sharp objects", but instead "hit it with an incendiary grenade and wait for the screaming to stop", since both sides have incendiary grenades and all the civilians have been evacuated.

Did we ever--oh good, we have bayonets. Now, the real question: Do we have SMG bayonets?
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NUKE9.13

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So, thinking about it more, whilst a grappling hook may be excessive, I think we can make our power armour a little more interesting (specifically more agile) than just an armoured Mountain. Here's my suggestion:

Quote
Rockslide Armoured Mobility Suit

The Mountain Myomer Lifting Suit was a triumph of engineering and proved what can be done if we combine the unique resources of our island. However, it is not fit for combat deployment due to it's exposed power supply and other factors. This must be remedied, as the potential applications are vast.

The basis of the Rockslide is, obviously, the Mountain. No need to reinvent the wheel. It is from this point that we begin to change things. The "Armoured" part of "Armoured Mobility Suit" comes in the form of Jumpsteel* armour. Plate armour covers most of the body, well constructed enough to provide strong resistance to bullets or even outright deflect them if they hit at the wrong angle. The plating is thicker around the vulnerable parts (the chest, and the engine, mostly) besides the joints, so as to ensure that it won't be easily penetrated. There are adjustments made to the engine and heating system so that it will not freeze the metal or the occupant of the suit during extended use. The suit can either be worn with a full helm for maximum protection at the cost of vision, or a open face helm for lesser protection but unobstructed vision.

But wait, there's more! Merely armouring a Mountain and making it combat-capable would be no challenge for experienced Salviosi engineers. So the Rockslide is not a mere "Lifting" suit, it is a "Mobility" suit- which is to say, a soldier wearing one will not be a slow, lumbering hulk, but will have the same- if not greater- range of motion as any unencumbered soldier. To this end, the Myomer "muscles" have been refined, to allow for a greater and more natural range of motion. This enables soldiers to run in the suit, as well as crawl, climb, and even jump.

Of course, jumping whilst wearing a suit that weighs (50-100?)kg is a tricky proposal. This is where the asterisk above comes into play, as the Jumpsteel used to armour the suit is no ordinary Caelium Steel: by altering the alloy somewhat (and insulating the plating from the wearer), it becomes possible to run current through to produce an effect similar to that of unalloyed Caelium. A downside is that the non-Caelium elements introduce significant inefficiencies, meaning this requires significantly more power- more than the small Gavengine in the Rockslide can reliably produce. Fortunately, we've postulated that it is possible to 'overcool' the Gavengine for brief periods (a few seconds), producing a burst of power sufficient to activate the Jumpsteel, thereby enabling Rockslide wearers to, indeed, jump- considerable heights, even. Long-distance flight is not possible, but jumping over small walls, from rooftop to rooftop, or up to second-floor windows, should be feasible.
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Taricus

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While the jumpsteel suit is good, I kinda feel like it's jumping the shark in regards to development. We'll want the Avalanche as an infantry suit as as a development milestone for power armour. Once that's done developing stuff like the jumpsteel is effectively just going up the special material property and applying it to the suit.
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Rockeater

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Should have  done it before, remove the reaserch credit from my vote
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Avalanche (4): Twinwolf, NUKE9.13, Rockeater, Taricus
-With research credit (3): Twinwolf, NUKE9.13, Rockeater, Taricus
-Without research credit (1): Rockeater
AAS-14 Perahudara Combat Refit (1): Madman
« Last Edit: October 04, 2018, 04:00:11 pm by Rockeater »
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Baffler

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Again I must agree with Madman. I'm not convinced power armor is even really all that desirable with armor like the Avalanche's in the face of their HMG or those anti-tank railgun things. The Perahudara refit on the other hand is essential. Without it they will have an absolute advantage in vehicles.

Quote from: Votebox
Avalanche (4): Twinwolf, NUKE9.13, Rockeater, Taricus
-With research credit (3): Twinwolf, NUKE9.13, Rockeater, Taricus
-Without research credit (1): Rockeater
AAS-14 Perahudara Combat Refit (2): Madman, Baffler
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Man of Paper

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Since baffler recently voted and stated reasoning I'll let you guys continue the discussion for another few hours. If nothing shifts by 10 or so (4 hours from now) then I'll be getting around to locking votes.
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Twinwolf

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My main thought for the armor is that now is the best time to do it, while they don't have the same kind of solid counter that we do (The AT rifle has reliability and I think accuracy issues so I don't see it as a major concern. While the machine guns do hurt, I think that the major benefit will be in close quarters). I accept that the Perahudara isn't solid enough to contest them right now, but I think it can be made to put up a fight in revision (perhaps a revision that replaces the ability to hold troops with a Scylla?). I think if we do a design for an aircraft it should be a new one rather than another revision on the Perahudara (not to say it shouldn't be revised, but if we want something dedicated to air superiority it should be something built for that).

As well, it was discussed in discord: They managed to make their air-corvette after several revisions, from a major disaster like the Kerata. So, it is possible we could get something that can actually have a chance of taking them down out of a revision with a decent roll, if not matching.

Apart from the design vote, I have an entry for the contest.

« Last Edit: October 05, 2018, 07:24:09 pm by Twinwolf »
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Man of Paper

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*slaps votebox*

You can fit so many proposals in this bad boy. Unfortunately it's locked now.
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Man of Paper

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Industrialized Warfare: Salvios Thread / 1914 A.C. Hot Season (Revision Phase)
« Reply #899 on: October 08, 2018, 12:53:19 pm »

Year 1914 AC Hot Season, Design Phase


Proposal: "Avalanche" Armored Lifting Suit
Avalanche Armored Lifting Suit

The Mountain Myomer Lifting Suit was a triumph of engineering and proved what can be done if we combine the unique resources of our island. However, it is not fit for combat deployment due to it's exposed power supply and other factors. This must be remedied, as the potential applications are vast.

The basis of the Avalanche is, obviously, the Mountain. No need to reinvent the wheel. It is from this point that we begin to change things, starting with general adjustments to make the suit more suited to the stresses and mobility required of combat over backline logistics. The "Armored" part of "Armored Lifting Suit" comes in the form of Caelium Steel armor. Plate armor covers most of the body, thick and well constructed enough to provide strong resistance to bullets or even outright deflect them if they hit at the wrong angle. The plating is thicker around the vulnerable parts (the chest, and the engine, mostly) besides the joints, so as to ensure that it won't be easily penetrated. There are adjustments made to the engine and heating system so that it will not freeze the metal or the occupant of the suit during extended use. The suit can either be worn with a full helm for maximum protection at the cost of vision, or a open face helm for lesser protection but unobstructed vision.

Avalanche-armored men will make for strong pointmen when we enter Harren, able to clear buildings and assault enemy entrenchments fearlessly compared to unarmored men and capable of carrying even heavy weaponry on their own to support their squads, as the need arises. They will be able to go places that our armored sleds cannot go or that we cannot bring heavy weaponry to with speed, providing a strong advantage in close combat. When we beat Abbera past Harren, they will serve to provide mobile covering fire for assaults or lead the charge in trench clearing as we take the fight to them. Should we be put on the defensive they can still provide strong support. Alternatively, if a heavily fortified position must be taken (and not shelled into dust), a team of these armored men ought to be a strong spearhead.

Difficulty: Hard
Result: 9 (6+4-1) 9 (6+4-1) = Above Average

Our engineers have successfully redesigned the frame taken from the Mountain to allow a greater range of movement, though some raw power was lost in the exchange. Even after the Caelium Steel Plate Armor is attached to the frame, range of motion is only truly limited by the wearer. There was an effective 10% loss in lifting power, but the protection of 20mm Caelium Steel Plates more than makes up for it. The chest and engine both have 25mm armor plating for some added protection.The helmet has a visor that can be locked in place with a pin in either a closed or flipped up position.

While their potential on the point of the spear cannot be understated, they also see use manning the various Sleds as well as defensive positions and emplacements. Avalanches provide much needed protection for our infantry, though there are some complaints of comfort on longer shifts in an Avalanche suit. But really, who would be comfortable standing in a trench night and day?

The "Avalanche" Armored Lifting Suit costs 5 Ore, 2 Gavrillium, 3 Caelium, and 2 Myomer, making it (EXPENSIVE) at this time.


----------------


Our forces will be engaging the Abberans imminently. In our final moments leading up to full-scale conflict you have one Revision this Revision Phase to fix any last minute issues. Also remember to continue working on your reason to fight and the recruitment posters.

IT IS NOW THE REVISION PHASE.


Spoiler: Designs (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Territories (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Resources (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Special Rules (click to show/hide)
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Spoiler: Abberan Armory (click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: October 08, 2018, 01:02:34 pm by Man of Paper »
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