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Author Topic: Knights of the Skies: Kolechia Thread - Early Summer 1916, Production Phase  (Read 55536 times)

Jilladilla

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Re: Knights of the Skies: Kolechia Thread - Early Spring 1915, Design Phase
« Reply #570 on: July 16, 2018, 09:35:30 pm »

Quote from: V(oteb)ox Populi
Prospect Scout-Bomber:
Levib IIa Bomber Biplane:
Levib IIb Bomber Biplane: (2) Kashyyk, Doomblade
Levib IIc Bomber Biplane: (3) NUKE9.13, Rockeater, Jilladilla
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Kashyyk

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Re: Knights of the Skies: Kolechia Thread - Early Spring 1915, Design Phase
« Reply #571 on: July 17, 2018, 05:16:06 am »

Since we'll soon be coming to a point where the Feather has been entirely replaced, I've been thinking about different ways to use our obsolete planes. I had a couple of ideas (likely needing dice to set up), but both of them are rubbing up against the rules, so wanted everyone's and especially Cnidaros's thoughts:

1) Air Force Museum: By providing examples of technology for members of the public to view, they'll be more invested in our cause and we'll slowly gain prestige. Adding more than one instance of an item shouldn't give any additional benefit.
2) Training School: Issuing old planes to new pilots, and putting them through exercises away from the front we should be able to safely provide them some experience before they go into combat. Assigning experienced squadrons and aces as trainers could accelerate the process. Naturally, we'd have to have a plane available per pilot.

 I really want something like these, although I experienced Wands Race so know the issues inherent in letting people design better infrastructure.
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NUKE9.13

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Re: Knights of the Skies: Kolechia Thread - Early Spring 1915, Design Phase
« Reply #572 on: July 17, 2018, 06:19:57 am »

Something like this :

Quote
On the prototype, the lower wing reportedly featured flaps along the trailing edges, that partly emulated the manner of operation of "single-acting ailerons" in only "coming up" from their "down" position at rest, as the aircraft accelerated during takeoff; these possessed a limited angle of depression and were not directly controlled by the pilot, instead being actuated by a set of 12 adjustable rubber bungee cords.[7]

This is from the bregeut 14. Apparently flaps were a later invention than I thought.
Hmm. And the production model didn't even use them. I dunno, maybe we shouldn't. We could add them with a revision later, perhaps.
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Cnidaros

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Re: Knights of the Skies: Kolechia Thread - Early Spring 1915, Design Phase
« Reply #573 on: July 17, 2018, 02:33:58 pm »

I'm giving your side a bit longer to decide between the Levib IIb or c and finalise the design, but update should be out tomorrow. Also, you might want to decide on what to requisition (or not) for this phase.

Since we'll soon be coming to a point where the Feather has been entirely replaced, I've been thinking about different ways to use our obsolete planes. I had a couple of ideas (likely needing dice to set up), but both of them are rubbing up against the rules, so wanted everyone's and especially Cnidaros's thoughts:

1) Air Force Museum: By providing examples of technology for members of the public to view, they'll be more invested in our cause and we'll slowly gain prestige. Adding more than one instance of an item shouldn't give any additional benefit.
2) Training School: Issuing old planes to new pilots, and putting them through exercises away from the front we should be able to safely provide them some experience before they go into combat. Assigning experienced squadrons and aces as trainers could accelerate the process. Naturally, we'd have to have a plane available per pilot.

 I really want something like these, although I experienced Wands Race so know the issues inherent in letting people design better infrastructure.

Number 2 is right out as earlier stated, but 1 is interesting. You could dedicate a revision die to setting up an air force museum, although it might be a little pretentious to brand it as such when your air force is less than a year old.
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Nirur Torir

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Re: Knights of the Skies: Kolechia Thread - Early Spring 1915, Design Phase
« Reply #574 on: July 17, 2018, 02:35:19 pm »

Quote from: V(oteb)ox Populi
Prospect Scout-Bomber:
Levib IIa Bomber Biplane:
Levib IIb Bomber Biplane: (3) Kashyyk, Doomblade, Nirur
Levib IIc Bomber Biplane: (3) NUKE9.13, Rockeater, Jilladilla

No requisition: (1) Nirur
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10ebbor10

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Re: Knights of the Skies: Kolechia Thread - Early Spring 1915, Design Phase
« Reply #575 on: July 17, 2018, 02:37:37 pm »

Quote from: V(oteb)ox Populi
Prospect Scout-Bomber:
Levib IIa Bomber Biplane:
Levib IIb Bomber Biplane: (4) Kashyyk, Doomblade, Nirur, 10ebbor10
Levib IIc Bomber Biplane: (3) NUKE9.13, Rockeater, Jilladilla

No requisition: (1) Nirur
Reverse-requisition (Give) Tracer Bullets to the Army (1) 10ebbor10
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Nirur Torir

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Re: Knights of the Skies: Kolechia Thread - Early Spring 1915, Design Phase
« Reply #576 on: July 17, 2018, 02:39:47 pm »

Quote from: V(oteb)ox Populi
Prospect Scout-Bomber:
Levib IIa Bomber Biplane:
Levib IIb Bomber Biplane: (4) Kashyyk, Doomblade, Nirur, 10ebbor10
Levib IIc Bomber Biplane: (3) NUKE9.13, Rockeater, Jilladilla

No requisition: (0)
Reverse-requisition (Give) Tracer Bullets to the Army: (2) 10ebbor10, Nirur
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Chiefwaffles

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Re: Knights of the Skies: Kolechia Thread - Early Spring 1915, Design Phase
« Reply #577 on: July 17, 2018, 02:41:15 pm »

Quote from: V(oteb)ox Populi
Prospect Scout-Bomber:
Levib IIa Bomber Biplane:
Levib IIb Bomber Biplane: (4) Kashyyk, Doomblade, Nirur, 10ebbor10
Levib IIc Bomber Biplane: (3) NUKE9.13, Rockeater, Jilladilla

No requisition: (0)
Give Tracer Bullets to the Army (3) 10ebbor10, Nirur, Chiefwaffles
Requisition Torpedo from Navy (1): Chiefwaffles
A torpedo would be nice for helping the navy. And I don’t think giving the army tracer bullets would cost our requisition action.

[/quote]
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Quote from: RAM
You should really look to the wilderness for your stealth ideas, it has been doing it much longer than you have after all. Take squids for example, that ink trick works pretty well, and in water too! So you just sneak into the dam upsteam, dump several megatons of distressed squid into it, then break the dam. Boom, you suddenly have enough water-proof stealth for a whole city!

Kashyyk

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Re: Knights of the Skies: Kolechia Thread - Early Spring 1915, Design Phase
« Reply #578 on: July 17, 2018, 03:34:38 pm »


Quote from: V(oteb)ox Populi
Prospect Scout-Bomber:
Levib IIa Bomber Biplane:
Levib IIb Bomber Biplane: (4) Kashyyk, Doomblade, Nirur, 10ebbor10
Levib IIc Bomber Biplane: (3) NUKE9.13, Rockeater, Jilladilla

No requisition: (0)
Give Tracer Bullets to the Army (4) 10ebbor10, Nirur, Chiefwaffles, Kashyyk
Give Tracer Bullets to the Navy (1): Kashyyk
Requisition Torpedo from Navy (2): Chiefwaffles, Kashyyk

The navy might like tracers for their AA machine guns too.
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Jilladilla

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Re: Knights of the Skies: Kolechia Thread - Early Spring 1915, Design Phase
« Reply #579 on: July 17, 2018, 04:08:32 pm »

I believe, if I remember correctly, we can put specifics on our requisition? We don't give a damn about range soooo.

Quote from: V(oteb)ox Populi
Prospect Scout-Bomber:
Levib IIa Bomber Biplane:
Levib IIb Bomber Biplane: (4) Kashyyk, Doomblade, Nirur, 10ebbor10
Levib IIc Bomber Biplane: (3) NUKE9.13, Rockeater, Jilladilla

No requisition: (0)
Give Tracer Bullets to the Army (4) 10ebbor10, Nirur, Chiefwaffles, Kashyyk
Give Tracer Bullets to the Navy (1): Kashyyk
Requisition Torpedo from Navy (3): Chiefwaffles, Kashyyk, Jilladilla
  -We don't give a damn about range, would rather have light, short range torpedo over a heavier long range one (1): Jilladilla
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Kashyyk

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Re: Knights of the Skies: Kolechia Thread - Early Spring 1915, Design Phase
« Reply #580 on: July 17, 2018, 04:34:43 pm »

Quote from: V(oteb)ox Populi
Prospect Scout-Bomber:
Levib IIa Bomber Biplane:
Levib IIb Bomber Biplane: (4) Kashyyk, Doomblade, Nirur, 10ebbor10
Levib IIc Bomber Biplane: (3) NUKE9.13, Rockeater, Jilladilla

No requisition: (0)
Give Tracer Bullets to the Army (4) 10ebbor10, Nirur, Chiefwaffles, Kashyyk
Give Tracer Bullets to the Navy (1): Kashyyk
Requisition Torpedo from Navy (3): Chiefwaffles, Kashyyk, Jilladilla
  -We don't give a damn about range, would rather have light, short range torpedo over a heavier long range one (2): Jilladilla, Kashyyk
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Nirur Torir

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Re: Knights of the Skies: Kolechia Thread - Early Spring 1915, Design Phase
« Reply #581 on: July 17, 2018, 06:27:11 pm »

Quote from: V(oteb)ox Populi
Prospect Scout-Bomber:
Levib IIa Bomber Biplane:
Levib IIb Bomber Biplane: (4) Kashyyk, Doomblade, Nirur, 10ebbor10
Levib IIc Bomber Biplane: (3) NUKE9.13, Rockeater, Jilladilla

No requisition: (0)
Give Tracer Bullets to the Army (4) 10ebbor10, Nirur, Chiefwaffles, Kashyyk
Give Tracer Bullets to the Navy (2): Kashyyk, Nirur
Requisition Torpedo from Navy (4): Chiefwaffles, Kashyyk, Jilladilla, Nirur
  -We don't give a damn about range, would rather have light, short range torpedo over a heavier long range one (3): Jilladilla, Kashyyk, Nirur
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Cnidaros

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Kolechia Design Phase, Early Spring 1915

Levib IIb Bomber Biplane:
Dropping things on people is hard. Or maybe it's just that none of our aircraft are designed to do so? Perhaps designing a dedicated 'bomber' would be wise. This was the thought process that led to the Levib. The Levib is a size or two larger than both the Feather and the EFM, is a wooden-framed biplane, and is powered by two V8 engines mounted on the wings.
The engines in question are RE-18L-V8s produced by Revolutionary Engines (Founded during the Year Of Revolutions, with the slogan "More revolutions per minute than even the Kolechian government!"). They are water-cooled, with the two four cylinder banks at a 90° angle. The crankshaft is solid steel, whilst the cylinder blocks are made of aluminium to reduce weight. They produce considerably more power than our rotary engines, with an equivalent or slightly better power/weight ratio. (Making rotary engines this powerful would mean increasing the torque caused by the spinning engine, making the plane harder to control). The engines have four-bladed propellers mounted to them in a puller configuration, and should result in respectable speeds, despite the considerably increased bulk of the Levib- though the focus is on lifting a heavy payload, not racing through the skies.
Said bulk consists of room for three crew members- from front to back, a pilot, bomber, and gunner. The gunner has access to two machine guns on a swivel mount allowing him to fire to all sides, as well as upwards. The bomber is free to focus on bombing/observation, with access to a bomb sight that compensates for height, airspeed, and windspeed (entered manually with dials and sliders). Once a target has been acquired, he can release any number of bombs attached to the underside of the craft on bomb mounts, which are adjustable to a wide variety of munitions, with a capacity of 450kg.
The Levib should be classified as a Medium Bomber. Its range should be more than sufficient for tactical missions of all sorts, whilst some bomb capacity can be sacrificed for extra fuel tanks to enable longer-ranged 'strategic' missions.

Time: 6 | Progress: 2 | Expense: 3

Having completed work on the Equilibrium, Kolechian engineers keep up the momentum as they move immediately to begin the design of the Levib Bomber Biplane. The bureaucratic experience from months of work on the EFM pays off, in the form of a quick and streamlined plan to get the Levib into production quickly. However, the developmental expenses are higher, due in part to the larger size of the Levib. For the ease of bookkeeping, the final proposal submitted is referred to as the Levib Bomber Biplane, instead of the Levib IIb.

Levib Bomber Biplane | 2/14 progress | 3 PP per die | Rushed 0 times | 3 PP invested



Effectiveness: 5 | Cost: 4 | Bugs: 2

The Levib Bomber Biplane is larger by far than the Feather and EFM, as befitting the KPAF’s first dedicated bomber. It’s a three-seater, with a crew of pilot, bombardier and gunner, each in their own individual cockpits. In terms of overall construction, it retains the canvas-over-wooden-frame structure of the Feather and EFM. Long, wide wings give the Levib lots of lift to aid its role as a bomber.

The most major change to the biplane layout are the two engines in nacelles, located between the wings on either side rather than in the nose. These are V8 engines produced by Revolutionary Engines, who are ironically supported by the current government despite their name. While providing a decent power-to-weight ratio, their location on the wing increases drag, as well as necessitating that fuel lines be run out to them from the tanks in the fuselage. Turning four-blade tractor propellers, these engines give the Levib just enough thrust to get off the ground. However, poor design of the fuel lines mean that engines cut out due to fuel starvation often.

The Levib’s main purpose is to drop bombs, and this is reflected in the large number of integrated bomb mounts along the underside of its fuselage, along with a couple on the wings. For the sake of versatility and forward compatibility with future armament, these mounts are nothing more than metal hooks that can be individually disengaged by the bombardier to release bombs (or mortar rounds, at the moment). While very simple, there are perhaps better ways to make bomb mounts. In total, the Levib carries up to 420 kg of munitions. Plans for adding the capability to swap bombs for fuel tanks were mulled over, but ultimately shelved due to the complexity of running out fuel lines to each mount. As it stands, the Levib has enough range to undertake tactical missions, though not as much as a lightweight Feather.

Another innovation befitting the Levib’s role as a bomber is the position of bombardier, and his bomb sight. The bombardier is an airman solely responsible for aiming and dropping the bombs, along with observing where they land. To assist in this, the Levib has a primitive bomb sight, which resembles an enlarged scope pointing downward with an adjustable reticle. This bombsight takes into account the altitude and airspeed, manually inputted by the bombardier with dials, to adjust the reticle to compensate for these factors and predict where the bombs will land.

In terms of defensive guns, the Levib sports two Type 11 LMGs on a single swivel mount, operated by the rear gunner. This configuration provides good firepower against a single target, while covering the rear arc. The mount also allows for some degree of elevation to fend off enemies attacking from above.

Construction and first flights of two models are completed this month. From preliminary trials, the Levib is rather slow – which is less a fault of engine power, and more a fault of the bomber’s overall layout and the large number of externally carried “bombs” along its fuselage creating drag. The Levib is also, as expected, less than manoeuvrable, suffering particularly from extremely slow roll response when fully loaded. The fuel line design issue results in several heart-stopping moments during test flights, but unlike any other aircraft in the KPAF, the Levib can still fly with one engine inoperative, albeit with much difficulty due to asymmetric thrust, and only by jettisoning the bombs. Its bombsight does provide a marked improvement in accuracy, especially in low wind conditions. To achieve a good number of hits, however, the bomber must fly at medium altitudes – high altitude bombing is simply too inaccurate to be of use at the moment. Nevertheless, being able to carry nine times the bombload of a Feather should certainly give KPAF bombing efforts a shot in the arm.

Levib Bomber Biplane: The KPAF’s first bomber, it’s a twin-engine biplane with a crew of three: pilot, bombardier and rear gunner. The Levib can carry up to 420 kg of bombs mounted under the fuselage and wings, dropping them with the aid of a bomb sight that accounts for altitude and airspeed. It’s powered by two RE-18L-V8 engines between the wings on either side but is rather slow. To defend itself, the Levib is equipped with two Type 11 LMGs on a swivel mount operated by the rear gunner, covering the aircraft to the rear and a little above. Cost: 7/3



Requisition: Naval Torpedo

After a short debate about the viability of requisitioning the navy’s only battleship, the design team settles on asking for a torpedo from the Kolechian navy instead. The specifications requested are for a light, short-range torpedo, but the navy only has a single model of torpedo currently in production. The K-4524 Torpedo, other than sporting a complete disregard for naming standardisation, is also the navy’s best weapon for allowing small boats to sink large ships. It’s a 700kg torpedo with about 2 km of range, operating at a relatively speedy 33 knots. The K-4524 is powered by a kerosene wet-heater engine, with a 200 kg explosive warhead.

K-4524 Torpedo: A 700kg deck-launched torpedo with 2 kilometres of range at 33 knots, the K-4524 is a reliable design already in use by the Kolechian Navy on its destroyers and torpedo boats. The torpedo is powered by a kerosene wet-heater engine, with a 200kg explosive charge. Cost 2 PP.

In addition, the manufacturing details of tracer rounds are turned over to both the Army and the Navy. While the navy doesn’t see much use for them currently, the army is interested, and the 7.6mm tracer rounds are immediately put into mass production for infantry use. Hot tempers in the army’s top ranks have cooled from this gesture, but they haven’t quite forgiven the KPAF from withdrawing just yet.



It is now the Revision Phase, Early Spring 1915. You have 2 dice remaining to spend on Revisions or bank for the next turn.

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NUKE9.13

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Alright. I think we might need a full design to get a proper air-droppable torpedo, but having one to tinker with should make that easier. For now, do we have anything we want to revise and deploy this turn, or should we work on the Levib's flaws?
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TopHat

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The two which come to mind are fixing the magazine of the Oracle camera and stabilising the Dogbite rounds. The latter puts them closer to being revised into useful bombs and could be handed to the Army for brownie points as well.
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