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[KittyTac]

You're not calling the shots here, and not actually making decisions.

[Egan_BW]

By that definition making decisions is a thing that's impossible. So I'm just gonna use the definition of decision-making that can include deterministic processes like me, because otherwise it's simply not a useful concept. Just like free will!

[Max™]

More accurately: the future exists, as does the past. Time is a direction, we are just wired to treat each instant we notice being aware as the only one that exists, which is kinda like assuming the location you're at is the only one which exists.

Much as there are other positions in space around you, there are other positions in time, and what you see as your self while reading this is just a slice of a weird 4-dimensional wormthing.

Critically, the slice of myself writing this could define a plane of simultaneity which overlaps with a slice of yourself, but it is not the slice that is reading this post right now, and the slice of myself which could overlap with your current self is one I can not see yet, but I have no reason to think he doesn't exist, so why should I assume the earlier slices of myself don't exist? I remember being them, but I am not them anymore, am I?

[KittyTac]

By that definition making decisions is a thing that's impossible. So I'm just gonna use the definition of decision-making that can include deterministic processes like me, because otherwise it's simply not a useful concept. Just like free will!

Yeah, the thing about free will does not make any real difference.

[Lunardog15]

but we are talking right? that would be impossible with out free will would it not?

[wierd]

Robots can talk to each other. I have seen the youtube videos. Computers exchange useful symbols with each other as well, which serves the same purpose.

The thing is not that we are talking. It is what we are talking ABOUT, and the impetus for talking about it.  Most of the time, humans follow very formulaic processes when choosing topics of discussion. This is the very reason why propaganda exists, and works so well.  Most human communication is not as willful as people believe it to be.

[KittyTac]

but we are talking right? that would be impossible with out free will would it not?

What we say is also pretty much possible to predict.

[McTraveller]

Eh, the universe isn't deterministic at the quantum level.  That is, for the same inputs and starting state, the result will not be the exact same.  There has been some recent research that is suggesting that neural activity involves quantum effects so, in fact, "decision making" is not deterministic after all.

So thinking isn't really deterministic - it's probabilistic at least.  And once you have consciousness, it's probable (heh) that the conscious process can influence probabilities, so we do, in fact, likely have "free will" for all practical definitions of it.  (Now enter Calvin versus Armenius...)

[KittyTac]

Eh, the universe isn't deterministic at the quantum level.  That is, for the same inputs and starting state, the result will not be the exact same.  There has been some recent research that is suggesting that neural activity involves quantum effects so, in fact, "decision making" is not deterministic after all.

So thinking isn't really deterministic - it's probabilistic at least.  And once you have consciousness, it's probable (heh) that the conscious process can influence probabilities, so we do, in fact, likely have "free will" for all practical definitions of it.  (Now enter Calvin versus Armenius...)

I know about that. But if thinking was controlled by quantum mechanics, we would have pure RNG thoughts and not the rather coherent thoughts we have.

[taat]

Free will isn't really about being deterministic, people wouldn't call randomness free will either, unless of course they believe in quantum magic which allows the fractal soul to manipulate probability.

I'm really quite sure that when people use the word "free will" they mean that decisions made by humans are somehow special, for example by not having to follow the rules everything else has, like having an immortal soul that can make changes from the comfort of the spirit plane. It doesn't actually mean anything other than "I am a human and I am important. Believe me."

[scourge728]

People like to say America should switch to a year round school, the problem is we have a lot of schools with no air conditioning and a lot of areas that regularly get over 100 in the summer... which seems like a great way to get heat stroke in a concrete building with very few windows and no real way to dissipate heat, and being forced to run around in such conditions

[Hanslanda]

Survival of the fittest at work.

[Pancakes]

I'd imagine it would work similarly to how you can fireproof dwarves. Melt off the fat, and you're good to go! Though I cannot think of as many uses for a fireproof human, let alone a schoolchild, as I can a dwarf. Maybe American schools are an IRL dwarven day care center, minus the dwarves...

Wait a minute, it all makes sense now!

[Lunardog15]

can potatoes(or other plants)  be sentient ? hrmmmmmmmmmmmm....

[Egan_BW]

Probably, though if you've modified one enough for that to be the case it would be debatable whether or not it's still a potato.