Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Urist9876]

In the df wiki wrestling training is described as somewhat dangerous as it can cause injuries while sparring.
So I avoided wrestlers until now.
In this fort I have ran wrestling training over 10 years and only 1 minor injury so nothing to worry about.
What made it interesting is the huge stats the wrestlers gained after this training: incredibly strong, absolute indefatigable.
It looks like if you have the time it is very advantageous to start with wrestling training and only much later hand them weapons to train with those.

Anyone has similar experience? I might just have been lucky with the dwarfs that I choose for my wrestling squad (several were trained as wrestler when they immigrated to my fort).

[martinuzz]

I always start with training my dwarves without armor, shields or weapons, until they're at least proficient wrestlers.
Wrestling skill is real important, it enables dwarves to free themselves from being grabbed / bitten / impaled.

The wiki is wrong. Sparring accidents do not exist. Maybe there was a version long ago that had sparring accidents, but nowadays you can give the noobest noob dwarf an adamantine sword or silver warhammer and there will be no accidents.

[mavj96]

I haven't had an accident in a long time but I don't allow wrestling training. As I recall when it did happen a dwarf was thrown and landed on his head causing him to die.

[martinuzz]

That has nothing to do with wrestling. That was most likely a failed dodge, followed by a trip, a slip, and a bump.
Dodging can happen with any combat type. Unarmed, or armed.

There's this bug where military can dodge through walls, ceilings and floors. If there's a few z-level drop too close to your barracks, your dwarves can dodge into that and fall to their death.

WRESTLING IS AS SAFE AS ANY OTHER COMBAT TYPE. DO NOT SHY AWAY FROM WRESTLING JUST BECAUSE RUMOURS

[vjmdhzgr]

No you can definitely get minor injuries from wrestling training, as OP said they got 1 in 10 years. Weapon training never results in injury. It has to do with throwing being a wrestling move that can sometimes injure somebody if they're thrown too far and hit something. I'm not actually sure what they need to hit to get injured. I think normal hitting the ground doesn't hurt, and probably not walls either? Maybe it was getting thrown into other dwarves that caused the injuries. I'm not entirely sure, it's been quite a while, but you can get minor injuries while wrestle training.

That doesn't mean you shouldn't train wrestling, it's perfectly fine. As said above there was 1 minor injury in 10 years.

[Urist9876]

Thanks for answers.

So wrestling teaches you how to break free. Grant you skills when you drop your weapon. And makes you really strong and durable on top of that.

Also the biter skills were highest on my wrestlers (8 vs 4 biter when I compare wrestlers with my axe squad). I hope I don't have to rely on that skill though

[Sutremaine]

The old problem was that strong wrestling dwarves could throw their partner quite roughly, and the resulting skid along the floor was very much not the light tap of weapon-based sparring. I guess it's been fixed, because I have dwarves wrestling in nothing but clothing and have had no injuries. I can't find any sparring-related throws in the game log, so maybe they no longer perform the offending move during sparring sessions.

[h27kim]

I don't think there has been wrestling accidents since many versions ago.  I usually organize my militia into a sort of four step program, of which (armored) wrestling comes first.  I found that (even with danger room) armor (and biting/kicking) skill tends to be pretty hard to level up if the dwarves are equipped with a weapon or even just a shield. 

In the df wiki wrestling training is described as somewhat dangerous as it can cause injuries while sparring.
So I avoided wrestlers until now.
In this fort I have ran wrestling training over 10 years and only 1 minor injury so nothing to worry about.
What made it interesting is the huge stats the wrestlers gained after this training: incredibly strong, absolute indefatigable.
It looks like if you have the time it is very advantageous to start with wrestling training and only much later hand them weapons to train with those.

Anyone has similar experience? I might just have been lucky with the dwarfs that I choose for my wrestling squad (several were trained as wrestler when they immigrated to my fort).

[catoblepas]

If you make your training rooms out of a low density material like candlenut or feather tree wood should cut down on injuries from wrestling throws even further, I seem to recall the density of walls/floors etc having an effect on how much damage creatures take from impacts, such as occur from being thrown.

[anewaname]

If you make your training rooms out of a low density material like candlenut or feather tree wood should cut down on injuries from wrestling throws even further, I seem to recall the density of walls/floors etc having an effect on how much damage creatures take from impacts, such as occur from being thrown.

Yeah, I've read many references to flooring the barracks with low density wood to help reduce training injuries. As well as the references to flooring death pits with high density materials to cause more damage from the fall.

[Sarmatian123]

I don't start my militia until I get first master quality adamantine/copper weapons and (wooden?leather? next time I will go for adamantine) shields. Because, if I give them something crappy, it gets named and put into my artifact list anyhow. So copper/platinum for blunt attack and adamantine for anything with edge weapons. What perplexes me is, that I get those messages, that sword master becomes wrestler and wrestler becomes sword master constantly, until Dwarf gets legendary in his weapon skill. It seems even Dwarves with helms, chain mail and high boots are training constantly wrestling, leading striking, kicking, dodging, wrestling, shield, armor and what perplexes me something misc object using. My training schedule looks like 10-2-2-2-2-2-10-2-2-2-2-2, but it is sparring reports, what really eats all messages from announcements. So I have no clue why I should somehow particularly train my Dwarves in wrestling.

I made captain with his guard the most weakest 10 Dwarves I could find. I gave them adamantine crossbows, armors, leather/wooden shields, and I rather not have them unbelievably strong. So now, I am worried. Should I disable their training in barracks? Hm...

[hertggf]

I wouldn't recommend training without armor, it'll make it harder for you to raise your armor user skill later if
you train up dodge first.

[strainer]

Perhaps wooden floors could help in barracks ?

[jecowa]

I wouldn't recommend training without armor, it'll make it harder for you to raise your armor user skill later if
you train up dodge first.

Thank you for explaining the pros and cons of armor. I had been wondering what the point of training without armor would be. So first you have them wear armor to train their armor skill, then you remove their armor and that helps them learn to dodge?

[Immortal-D]

On the general subject of training nuances; Dwarves typically don't start with super-strength (though I have had a few odd migrants).  If you equip your rookies with a full kit of iron & steel, they will move with all the speed of a dwarven syrup roast.  I always start my militia with leather breastplate, cap, and greaves.  Metal gloves/boots is usually fine.  Once they reach Proficient in Armor and have mid-level strength, I switch to full metal.