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[~Neri]

Mutons are literally just. Mutons. They're in the genebanks. There is nothing particularly 'new' or 'hard' about making them. They're big, bulky, brawny, and have armor. That's all there is to them.

Where vipers on the other hand, Vipers are thinmen but without the tinkering needed to make thinmen stealthy and some humanbits added. They have venom sacks and the capacity to Spit it at extreme range naturally. They use some human DNA assuming we're going off of xcom2 lore. They wouldn't have breasts if they didn't for one. Vipers would require tinkering. Thinmen would require tinkering. (And frankly Thinmen are superior skirmishers compared to vipers. The whole 'jump buildings' thing is a pretty powerful ability.)

[Failbird105]

Actually I'm fairly certain it's explicitly mentioned in the in game autopsy that Vipers DON'T have breasts, they have suspiciously shaped venom sacks. Which means that a normal male viper would likely have them too.(the King doesn't count, he's anything but normal)

This has been my required input for the day.

[~Neri]

King didn't have em but he shot magic ice for some reason. Because being flash frozen and not immediately fucking dying totally makes sense.

[Failbird105]

Exactly, therefore he is a poor example of a common male viper and not representative of whether they have boobs.

[~Neri]

Lets not kid ourselves though. Vipers have boobs because Firaxis's designers like sneks with boobs for some reason.

I'd still rather have a frontline combat unit more than I'd like a skirmisher.

[Tyrant Leviathan]

We only need front line if fighting in city or invading their base. Think Vietnam and we are the North invading South. Pick our battles, and make sure to pick environments that benefit skirmishes until we develo front line tech.

Vipers: Scale Armor, poison and lasso tongue.

Thin Men: Super agile, death poison cloud and strong enough to one hand a plasma rifle.

Mutons: Only good for damage soak really.

[sprinkled chariot]

Chryssalids - 11 terrors out of 10

[~Neri]

Err. I don't know what history you think you've been reading but frontline troops are essential in all combat zones. There is a front line. In all combat zones. Skirmishers 'skirmish.' They skirt the 'edges' of the combat zone and engage from unexpected angles. In order to do that, they need an unexpected angle to engage from in the first place. Hence the 'front line.'

Vipers: Have functionally no armor. Scales are not armor when they're about as resilient as the average gecko.
Lasso: Because pulling a soldier to you when the soldier has a combat knife and a gun is totally a good idea outside of video games.
Poison is good but thinmen do it better.

Thinmen use carbines. Not rifles. Again thinmen are superior to vipers in every way that matters.

Mutons: Trained. Frontliners. Group mentality. Disciplined. Designed and bred for war. Capable of taking multiple hits and continuing fighting. Can punch out a human easily in a melee. Large and intimidating. Has Good, Full Body Armor. A reminder that we've received several GM hints that our 'lack of armor' is a problem.

Chryssalids are ambushes and skirmishers, best in close quarters environs such as urban centers.

[Tyrant Leviathan]

Chryssalids - 11 terrors out of 10

In Terror of the Deep there were flying octopuses who could do same trick, just they flew.

Edit: And what of Chimeras? They seem to basically be Mutons with basic healing factor.

[SamSpeeds]

How would we get armor without a design? I don't get it, unless it's biological, it's essentially a separate item that would logically require a design.

[Tyrant Leviathan]

Mutons in XCom have thick rhino like skin and sub dermal cybernetics to explain toughness.

[~Neri]

Do you see those 'big bulky metal plates' that Mutons wear? That's called armor.

[piratejoe]

Mutons are literally just. Mutons. They're in the genebanks. There is nothing particularly 'new' or 'hard' about making them. They're big, bulky, brawny, and have armor. That's all there is to them.

And this is an arms race. Which means anything we design can be determined with a dice roll, so, considering that Mutons are a mid game threat, and we are only on the second month, I would suspect them to be harder to make then the Vipers.

Vipers: Have functionally no armor. Scales are not armor when they're about as resilient as the average gecko.
Lasso: Because pulling a soldier to you when the soldier has a combat knife and a gun is totally a good idea outside of video games.
Poison is good but thinmen do it better.

Thinmen use carbines. Not rifles. Again thinmen are superior to vipers in every way that matters.

From the Xcom 2 wiki "Despite their resemblance to terrestrial snakes, the Viper is actually a wholly extraterrestrial species unmodified by human DNA. However, it retains the modified Thin Man's poison and high accuracy, combat abilities and intelligence." And, from the multiplayer, they have poison spit just like the thinmen had, so, I don't think thinmen do it better. It also never mentions just how tough their scales are, but a knife probably would be useful if you could manage to pull it out quick enough and use it after being pulled violently and quickly from where you where standing before having the equivalent of what a boa constrictor would do with a much larger snake done to you.

Chryssalids - 11 terrors out of 10

In Terror of the Deep there were flying octopuses who could do same trick, just they flew.

Edit: And what of Chimeras? They seem to basically be Mutons with basic healing factor.

They didn't fly actually, they only where on missions where you where under water so they could only swim.

[SamSpeeds]

Do you see those 'big bulky metal plates' that Mutons wear? That's called armor.

Ok, but would we not have to design that? If they're wearing it, it sounds like a separate item.

[~Neri]

Do you see those 'big bulky metal plates' that Mutons wear? That's called armor.

Ok, but would we not have to design that? If they're wearing it, it sounds like a separate item.

That would presumably come with the design. We aren't going to be designing a 'one size fits all' armor like the humies get to do. Because we are multiple different species+modifications to said species. Just fold shit into a given design. Implanted dermal plating is a good excuse. Ye never see em take off their armor at any point after all. Even during the Autopsies.

And this is an arms race. Which means anything we design can be determined with a dice roll, so, considering that Mutons are a mid game threat, and we are only on the second month, I would suspect them to be harder to make then the Vipers.

Mutons are midgame lorewise because the ayys don't expect significant resistance initially. So they simply don't field em.

From the Xcom 2 wiki "Despite their resemblance to terrestrial snakes, the Viper is actually a wholly extraterrestrial species unmodified by human DNA. However, it retains the modified Thin Man's poison and high accuracy, combat abilities and intelligence." And, from the multiplayer, they have poison spit just like the thinmen had, so, I don't think thinmen do it better. It also never mentions just how tough their scales are, but a knife probably would be useful if you could manage to pull it out quick enough and use it after being pulled violently and quickly from where you where standing before having the equivalent of what a boa constrictor would do with a much larger snake done to you.

I think you missed the 'Thinmen can jump buildings' thing. Vipers cannot do that. Mobility is the Absolute Most Important Thing for a skirmisher to have. Vipers cannot jump buildings. Thinmen can.

As a note. A reminder that TFTD xenos are not Ethereal Empire sourced. We don't have em in our genebanks.