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[10ebbor10]

10ebbor10, does it mean that those railguns have no EP cost? Also, can we add even more railguns by spending E and reducing amount of missiles?

Yes to both.

[Happerry]

REVISION
Upgrade IAC Teams (0):
Rockbreaker Missile (2): Chiefwaffles, Happerry

[Chiefwaffles]

Y'know, looking at the specifications, the Talon's railguns are actually a really nice boon for us.
For comparison, the Raven has to drop three (1/3 total) of its missiles in order to fit one Phoenix gunpod. And the Phoenix isn't necessarily all that great itself - it's classified as a "light railgun".
The Talon, in addition to its 18 missiles, fits 2 upgraded railguns. So not only are its railguns better, but it can fit twice the number of these railguns as a Raven equipped with one phoenix, without losing any missiles.

I'm pretty excited to see it in action.

[Madman198237]

REVISION
Upgrade IAC Teams (0):
Rockbreaker Missile (3): Chiefwaffles, Happerry, Madman

[Blood_Librarian]

its also 50% more expensive.

[Madman198237]

50% more expensive, FAR more than 50% more effective.

[Blood_Librarian]

You are correct.

[Chiefwaffles]

If we were to assume that one Phoenix gunpod is worth the same amount of imaginary arbitrary "combat points" that the 3 missiles it replaces (though it'd probably be worth more/is a different niche) and we don't even include the fact that the Talon's railguns are notably upgraded over the Phoenix gunpod, then the Talon is as lethal as two Ravens.
But again, that's a simplified version. The Talon's railguns are upgraded, and the Talon will be able to use them much more effectively than a Raven can use its Phoenixes, thanks to increased agility and better armor.

So not only is the Talon more deadly than two Ravens, it's much more durable (considering Ravens had no actual armor) and muuuuuuuch more maneuverable.


Personally, I think we should opt to use all Talons when possible. Ravens would still have a niche use in cases where the aliens are spreading out and sending a Talon somewhere is overkill, but when possible I just think Talons are flat-out better by an exponential factor.

[Chiefwaffles]

DOSSIER: AC-03 "MIMIC"
SECURITY CLASSIFICATION: X-1

Aliases
"Mimic"
"Skin Crawler"

Description
Large, man-shaped "octopus"-like land creature, able to near-perfectly mimic any object or entity similar or less in size. Able to mimic well-dressed humans, corpses, and additional objects. Body has numerous grasping tentacles, each capable of wielding equipment and weaponry such as individual plasma pistols.


Abilities
- Near-perfect mimicry of any existing object equal or lesser in size.
- Numerous tentacles capable of wielding weaponry.
- Immense physical strength and close-combat skills.
- Capable of grappling and attaching self to objects, such as the ceiling, for combat and ambush usage.
- Intelligence unknown.
- Vocal capabilities unknown.


Behavior
The exact intelligence level of an AC-03 is unknown, but observations have revealed that they are capable of tactics such as ambushing. They can skillfully wield multiple instances of alien weaponry in their numerous tentacles, each to the level of an AC-01 ██████'s abilities.

As seen in both combat encounters with AC-03s, their preferred method of engagement is ambushing our squads in close proximity. An ambushing AC-03 can neutralize a high number of operatives in CQC while unarmed at very high speeds before they can be eliminated. They mostly utilize the factor of surprise to their advantage via camouflaging capabilities.

Each individual AC-03 is extremely deadly, and a small number can eliminate entire XCOM squadrons.


Tactical Considerations
Amendment: Deployment of new Tactical Awareness Visor Mk. 2 is predicted in tests to be able to recognize and locate camouflaged AC-03 entities before they can strike. Use recommended in all engagements where AC-03 presence is suspected. Do not allow use of the TAV2 to decrease vigilance against camouflaged AC-03s, as exact effectiveness of the TAV2 is not yet known at this point in time.

No current method of recognizing AC-03 entities prior to de-camouflaging is known at this time. All XCOM Operatives are to maintain extreme vigilance at all times in operations where an AC-03 presence is either confirmed or expected. Operatives are to be spread out yet within visual distance, allowing for reaction time in case of sudden AC-03 attack. Direct melee encounters with any AC-03 entity reliably lead to near-immediate death, and operatives are to prioritize eliminating known AC-03s even at high risks of friendly fire against
ongoing victims of an AC-03 close-proximity attack.
Distance is to be maintained from AC-03s at all times. At range, AC-03s equipped with plasma weaponry can be dangerous but are similar to AC-01 ██████ in behavior and threat rating. At CQC ranges, the AC-03's limbs and physical strength allow it to reliably and easily overpower XCOM Operatives. Do not attempt to ever engage an AC-03 at close range. If an AC-03 is dangerously close, do not attempt to run away - it can outrun humans; instead, move away at reasonable speeds while prioritizing elimination of the AC-03 with an XH-2 ██████.
Operatives are to not "check" suspicious objects and entities for a camouflaged AC-03. There exist no known reliable methods of detecting an AC-03, and attempting to check for their presence directly will waste operatives' time.

Civilians in the proximity of a site with confirmed AC-03 presence are to be detained and brought to the nearest maximum-security classified holding cells of sponsor nations, in order to be analyzed for possible AC-03 infiltration. If a civilian can be proved with absolute certainty to not be a camouflaged AC-03, they may be released via standard XCOM Civilian Detainee Procedures.


Central Officer's Note
It may be possible that the aliens are utilizing Mimics to infiltrate high-value targets. We have no evidence of this, but the opportunity is obvious. Mimics are perfectly capable of passing as humans, allowing them access to anywhere a civilian could go. We don't believe a Mimic would be able to pass through standard security authorization (at least, not for a while) required to have any influence whatsoever on the XCOM project, but considering their capabilities they could possibly be able to locate VIP humans that are some degree of sympathetic to the aliens or that hold anything against XCOM.
I recommend watching for suspicious activity by sponsor nations and for consideration of authorizing XCOM investigation into the matter. It would also be prudent to investigate the Mimics' speech capabilities - can they talk like humans?


Encounters
Operation Crossroads: First encounter. After elimination of conventional AC-01 ██████ opponents, AC-03 Mimics camoflauged as humans and other regular objects ambushed on-site XCOM operatives. Two friendly squads succumbed before combined Skyranger and XH-2 ██████ fire eliminated all known AC-03 entities.
Operation Glass Pyre: During elimination of enemy forces, two AC-03 Mimics camoflauged as corpses and one wielding plasma pistols hiding underneath a ceiling ambushed and eliminated all on-site operatives, resulting in Code Black.
Operation Forgotten Jester: Preliminary unmanned reconnaisance revealed AC-03 Mimic presence on-site, transporting abductees to alien craft while un-camoflauged.

[10ebbor10]

Revision: Rockbreaker Missile
The new Rockbreaker missile is just a general improvement of its prior version. The same size as an old Rockslide, it uses an unstable small elerium power core (kind of like the XH2's) to replace the payload, allowing for greater damage against airborne craft. Thin alien alloy "armoring" on the missile doesn't and shouldn't allow it to survive any directed attempts at destruction of the missile, but should allow the missile to withstand conditions such as the anti-missile plasma shield for the times needed to hit its target.

It should be able to survive their plasma shielding (and we hope but not expect that the alloy coating allows for very limited armor penetration before detonation). And while we can't spend much time making a proper elerium warhead, even an unstable power core should do notably more damage than the prior conventional explosives.

TL;DR: Put an unstable alien power core as the warhead and super-thin alloy coating around our missiles to survive plasma shielding. Counters their missile counter while being some degree better at doing damage when they hit.

Very Hard : 5 - 2 = 3  Buggy Mess

The Rockbreaker missile replaces the conventional warhead of previous missile iterations with a volatile Elerium. And when the research department says volatile, they really mean volatile. A significant part of development time was spend on mandatory training for our personnel, ensuring that no one drops, bump or otherwise disturbs the ammunition, as any significant shocks or heat will result in detonation.

Armoring the missiles has gone somewhat better. Coating stuff in alien alloys is not that complex an operation, even though the rarity of the material does drive up the cost.

UFO DETECTED

Craft: 1 Small Lander, 1 Medium Lander, 1 Alien Fighter
Units: Skin crawler, Drones Sectoids
Destination: Australia
Altitude: Landed and engaging unknown enemy

We've spotted another large alien force landed in Australia, consisting out of 3 craft. Contrary to previous alien operations, they've know landed in an abandoned mine. UAV footage has shown an ongoing conflict between an unidentified armed group and the alien forces. Mimics (or Skincrawlers), sectoids and drones appear have all engaged the enemy, supported by what appears to be a sort of heavy mortar on top of the medium lander.

From what we can see, the aliens appear to be winning handedly, with enemy being pushed back or annihilated. Our information on the progress of combat is limited, as the alien fighter took down our drone.

Spoiler: Technology (click to show/hide)

Vehicles

Raven (Interceptor) : Way beyond the bleeding edge of technology, the Raven is far beyond any other jet fighter ever build on Earth. With upgraded avionics, adjusted tracking, and advanced pulse detonation engines, the Raven is capable of pursuing even high speed alien craft. If needed, it can use it's avalanche missiles to shoot down any intruders.   Cost :   2  VP
      - Rockslide Missiles : An upgraded targeting system, that increases missile effectiveness.
      - Ground Combat Package : Replaces half of the Raven's Avalanche missiles with high tech air-to-ground SMART missiles

Talon (Interceptor) : Integrating copious amounts of Alien Technology, the Talon is grav-wave propelled, heavily armored interceptor. Has 18 hard points for missiles and 2 nose mounts, fitted with a railgun by default.  Cost :   3  VP

Skyranger (Troop Transport) : World's first supersonic troop transport. The Skyranger is high speed, heavily armored troop transport, capable of deploying and retrieving a single squad of soldiers in various situations. Cost : 1 VP    [1 Free Skyranger available]
 
Equipment

Basic XCOM Rifle : XCOM's standard rifle. Cutting edge, custom designed, yet still affordable. Part of standard equipment.
Cost : 0

XH-2 Railgun Rifle : An effective semi-automatic rifle. Fires a powerful railgun round with tremendous velocity and penetrative power. In addition, it's equipped with a smart SCOPE to allow it to identify enemy drone targets.
Cost : 1

Basic XCOM Grenade : A simple grenade. Activate, throw, explode. Part of standard equipment.
Cost : 0

BASIC XCOM PISTOL : A simple, highpower pistol. It packs a pretty heavy punch, making it an effective if chalkenging sidearm Part of standard equipment.
Cost : 0

Phoenix railgun pod : A modular gun pod containing a light railgun. Relatively low firerate, but decent armor penetrating capability. Can be attached to Skyrangers and Ravens, though the latter looses 4 of it's missiles to make room. Cost: 1 EP for 3

Rockbreaker Missile: A missile coated in a very thin alien alloy and equipped with a volatile destabilized elerium powercell as warhead. Will detonate if exposed to shock or heat. Cost : 1 EP for 8.

TAV-2: A cobbled together combat visor that can identify and highlight aliens, including disguised ones. Fragile, cobbled together and decidly unergonomic.
Cost : 1 EP

Training Program

Rookie Training Program : A basic introduction to the entire Xcom project. The absolute minimum that any soldier needs to know to operate successfully at XCOM. Cost : 1 Unit Points.

NOTSOFTER training regimen : A hard, effective international training regime, that gives our soldiers the tools and capacity to deal with aliens. Trains forces to a standard marginally higher than that attained by most special force units Cost : 1 Unit Points.

Inter Agency Cooperation teams : As part of ties developed through the NOTSOFTER training regime, we now have the capability of drawing upon special force teams. They're not as well suited to fight aliens as we're however, and nations will object if we keep losing them. Cost 1 Unit Point    [SPECIAL : Can't use XCOM GEAR, No vehicle needed for deployment when used in North America or Europe]

Mission Profiles

Interception : A simple mission profile that focuses on intercepting an alien vessel as soon as it's detected, destroying it before it can do any damage to any innocent people.

Down and Capture : A more complicated mission profile that focuses on downing an alien vessel (or waiting for it to land), and then storming it with ground forces.

Combined Arms : A mission profile that integrates air and ground forces to storm UFO's, using aerial bombing, reconnaissance and strafing runs when available to take out enemy strongpoints or UFO armor.

XCOM Resources

Island Mountain HQ [An isolated, hidden underground base on a remote island in the Aegean]
       - UFO Power Core
       - Railgun Defenses
       - Heuristic radar
       - Improved production
Aereal reconnaissance program : A simple program that allows us to requisition drone reconnaissance on suspected UFO sites.

6 VP
3 UP
4+1 EP

2 Alien Equipment Token, 1 Unit experience Token, 1 VP Token

Spoiler: PANIC METER (click to show/hide)

Africa
---> Egypt
---> South Africa
---> Nigeria

Asia
--->Australia
--->China
--->India
--->Japan

Europe
--->France
--->Germany
--->Russia
--->United Kingdom

North America
--->Canada
--->Mexico
--->United States

South America
--->Argentina
--->Brazil   X

Intercept Phase

Turn 7

Challenge: Command has decided to catalogue our enemies equipment. The side which manages to make the best description/analysis of a piece of enemy equipment may win a price.

AABBCCDD

[Strongpoint]

It wasn't the best way to spend revision point. We have Phoenixes for trading EP for increased aerial capability.

Lets go for some more complex tactic than "create direct counter for X" and try to look at our EP\VP\UP situation next time.

[Madman198237]

It wasn't the best way to spend revision point. We have Phoenixes for trading EP for increased aerial capability.

Lets go for some more complex tactic than "create direct counter for X" and try to look at our EP\VP\UP situation next time.

You're making some bad assumptions:
1: That using EP is universally the same in air and ground categories, regardless of what we spend it in.
2: That better missiles fill the same role as more railguns
3: That letting missiles get evaporated in a plasma shield is fine so long as we invent drink holders or some such crap that makes something else "better".
4: That the particular thing you're complaining about WASN'T an attempt to make the best use of our points.

[Strongpoint]

1: That using EP is universally the same in air and ground categories, regardless of what we spend it in.

Fail to see what in my words looks like that assumption

2: That better missiles fill the same role as more railguns

They do. More or less

3: That letting missiles get evaporated in a plasma shield is fine so long as we invent drink holders or some such crap that makes something else "better".

Invent non crap. I got it, my designs are awful. It is irrelevant. Having no creativity, just bruteforcing "hard counter" without even trying to produce original ideas and cunning plans is not only boring as hell, it is not very effective.

4: That the particular thing you're complaining about WASN'T an attempt to make the best use of our points.

I am complaining that it wasn't such attempt. Every design should be an attempt to make the best use of our points. But hey, why think about such thing when the most obvious way to play is to go for another hard counter.

[Madman198237]

1: That using EP is universally the same in air and ground categories, regardless of what we spend it in.

Fail to see what in my words looks like that assumption

2: That better missiles fill the same role as more railguns

They do. More or less

3: That letting missiles get evaporated in a plasma shield is fine so long as we invent drink holders or some such crap that makes something else "better".

Invent non crap. I got it, my designs are awful. It is irrelevant. Having no creativity, just bruteforcing "hard counter" without even trying to produce original ideas and cunning plans is not only boring as hell, it is not very effective.

4: That the particular thing you're complaining about WASN'T an attempt to make the best use of our points.

I am complaining that it wasn't such attempt. Every design should be an attempt to make the best use of our points. But hey, why think about such thing when the most obvious way to play is to go for another hard counter.

Eh, wasn't phrased well. I blame sleep deprivation.

1. You're assuming that any EP we spend to improve aircraft is the same as any other EP...i.e., if we buy railguns it's just as effective as if we replace our missiles with better missiles.

2. This is so horribly false I don't even know why you'd bother. Railguns give our craft more staying power at the cost of alpha-strike killing power...and also require us to outmaneuver them, or be close enough in maneuvering capability.

3. I didn't actually intend that as a jab about your designs in particular, just the concept of "it's only completely broke so don't fix it", which is what not fixing missiles would've done for us. Any other design, so long as our aircrafts' main punch is out of commission, is just as relevant as a cupholder.

4. Yeah, that phrasing sucked. Sorry. Anyway, I'm telling you that, while you're complaining that it wasn't effective use of points, that it WAS probably the most effective way to make our points matter.

On being "innovative" or whatever instead of doing the "obvious" thing:
Look, it doesn't matter how innovative or forward-thinking we are if we lose all the battles NOW. Yes, it would be cool to advance tech in cool ways. No, a revision is not the thing to do it with, and ABSOLUTELY NO, is it a good plan to just ignore the enemy figuring out how to almost-hard-counter our missiles.

At a certain point, it doesn't matter how obvious it is if we need to get it done anyway. If you didn't like the plan to improve our technology (because this revision DID improve our tech) that was proposed, why not propose something else to fill the gigantic gaping hole in our air power (the basically-hard-countered missiles)? Or, you know, vote at all.

[Strongpoint]

If you didn't like the plan to improve our technology (because this revision DID improve our tech) that was proposed, why not propose something else to fill the gigantic gaping hole in our air power (the basically-hard-countered missiles)?

I consider Talon a big enough jump in our airpower to not go for missiles\other aerial weapons for a quite some time. Some of 24 fired missiles in the last turn did hit their targets, 2 talons will carry 36 ensuring that more will hit + they are better in dogfighting with integrated railguns, armor and better performance in the air.

Why would I propose anything that I don't consider necessary?

Or, you know, vote at all.

There are 5 active players in this thread, voting when three votes went to one proposal is a waste of digital ink