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[PatrikLundell]

I've never seen goblins use any mounts except beak dogs (and their appearance was a huge step forward). I've thus assumed the failure to acquire them would be due to the failure for the gobbo civs to appoint beast tamers. However, when using DFHack to look into a save and listing what exotic pets goblin civs have access to I found quite a few critters that I believe are legal as mounts (cave dragons, giant cave swallow, giant cave toad, giant olm, giant bat) as well as critters that clearly aren't (such as cave hopper).
Should available exotic pets that can be used as mounts also be available as mounts, or is there a separate process to make pets useful as mounts (e.g. through a beast tamer)?

[deathpunch578]

I think that the exotic animal mounts is a fall back if the goblins can't get beakdogs (world gen strange-ness).
goblins ride in on animals that are possible, the reason vermin are labeled exotic animals is because they aren't domesticated and can't be bought at embark.

[PatrikLundell]

Hm, so if beak dogs get nuked out of (raw?) existence other mounts can be considered? Interesting thought.
I didn't mean to imply all exotic pets goblins get ought to be exclusively for mount purposes, but I wasn't exactly clear on that (riding a gremlin would be rather difficult, if that was the case).

[FantasticDorf]

Goblins require [MILITARY_STRATEGY] nobles to go out and tame creatures, mainly cave creatures because of their [USE_CAVE_ANIMALS] tag.

The only present one in the goblin civilisation is the goblin general who is a generated fixture, due to bugs and the like sometimes they don't respawn again and other times they are too busy.

Adding more nobles to the goblin's societal structure will lighten the goblin general's responsibility between leading armies & taming animals, and i found this out by modding a goblin civilisation to be playable & to a good standard.

[deathpunch578]

Hm, so if beak dogs get nuked out of (raw?) existence other mounts can be considered? Interesting thought.
I didn't mean to imply all exotic pets goblins get ought to be exclusively for mount purposes, but I wasn't exactly clear on that (riding a gremlin would be rather difficult, if that was the case).

let me tell you, you got it wrong. the goblins don't ride gremlins, the gremlins ride the goblins.
the goblins carry the gremlins on their backs, then they throw the gremlins at dwarves once the dwarves are in sight.

[PatrikLundell]

@FantasticDorf: I thought it was [BEAST_TAMER] that was required, but could it be both tags are required?
Anyway, do you say the general (or modded additional noble) is require to propagate suitable critters to mounts, as the exotic pet lists were populated suitably (and differently) for the 3 goblin civs I had in the save I looked at?

[Shonai_Dweller]

What is [BEAST_TAMER]? That's not a vanilla tag.

[FantasticDorf]

[BEAST_TAMER] doesn't exist as far as im sure anybody is aware of. Thats for pre-world activation update [TAME_EXOTIC] dungeon keepers nobles that used to be a in-site prequisite to allow you to tame exotic animals. Nowadays since that system was reworked you can tame any animal with the tags and [PET_EXOTIC] only means it has to be tamed exclusively in worldgen & fortress mode.

Your DF knowledge may be out of date as dungeon masters haven't been in the game since v0.28x and the torch was passed on

Anything with [MOUNT] or [MOUNT_EXOTIC] is egible to be ridden, though [MOUNT_EXOTIC] means that it wont be first choice. Combining mount & [COMMON DOMESTIC] will allow [COMMON_DOMESTIC_MOUNT] on the entity file to select all egible common domestic mounts.

Beak dogs are [COMMON_DOMESTIC] and mounts but separated by [EVIL] which goblins [USE_EVIL_ANIMALS] works for them, and obviously because beak dogs are [EVIL] unless other races like dwarves also have [USE_EVIL_ANIMALS] they can't access them.

[PatrikLundell]

It's my mind that's confused. The tag I was thinking of is indeed [TAME_EXOTIC]. Sadly, my knowledge can't be that out of date (only plain wrong) as I know next to nothing about anything before 0.40.X. If I understand it correctly, the [TAME_EXOTIC] tag is just a remnant from a previous system, and no longer serves any purpose?

OK, so if I understand it correctly, a goblin civ will use a single mount breed. The first choice is a [COMMON_DOMESTIC] one, which in vanilla boils down to the single item list of beak dogs (due to their evilness). If there's no [COMMON_DOMESTIC] mount available, the search continues down to the list of [MOUNT_EXOTIC] ones. Since beak dogs rarely or never suffer spontaneous unfortunate accidents, they'll always (as in "every world currently") be the goblin mount if they use one (as some sieges do not contain mounts).

(I think the above rephrases what you're told me).

Thanks for setting me straight.

[FantasticDorf]

Primarily yes, but in the rare instances they do tame animals other creatures may be egible & brought along for sieges.

You could make this more/less likely using the new [ANIMAL] entity controls.