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[Clément]

Use a filter script. Something like:

Code: [Select]

d.get_age() >= 10 && d.get_age() < 12

[Dutchling]

Thanks!

[Jazz Cat]

Got a bug report. Within the last week, my blacksmith "felt horrified this is an unknown thought, please report it!" The actual thought was that he was horrified reliving seeing a goblin's dead body.

However, there's a bigger bug I'd also like to report: Said blacksmith has also become haggard and drawn and has slipped into depression. According to DT, his stress level is 25.2k... but he's listed as "fine" in his description and his happiness grid square is colored in as "fine." In fact, all of my dwarves are listed as "fine," from my 25.2k blacksmith down to a -41k child who by all rights should be skipping through the hallways singing "hiho, hiho" at this point.

If it helps, Dwarfmonitor tells me I have nothing but the happiest two categories of dwarf, and CavernKeeper confirms that Urist McDepression's at ~25k stress.

[PatrikLundell]

The reason for the unknown thought is that Toady has split "seeing X die" and "seeing X's dead body" into two different thoughts, with the new one (dead body) added to the end of the type (https://github.com/DFHack/df-structures/issues/255).

[Clément]

Got a bug report. Within the last week, my blacksmith "felt horrified this is an unknown thought, please report it!" The actual thought was that he was horrified reliving seeing a goblin's dead body.

Already reported and partially fixed.

However, there's a bigger bug I'd also like to report: Said blacksmith has also become haggard and drawn and has slipped into depression. According to DT, his stress level is 25.2k... but he's listed as "fine" in his description and his happiness grid square is colored in as "fine." In fact, all of my dwarves are listed as "fine," from my 25.2k blacksmith down to a -41k child who by all rights should be skipping through the hallways singing "hiho, hiho" at this point.

If it helps, Dwarfmonitor tells me I have nothing but the happiest two categories of dwarf, and CavernKeeper confirms that Urist McDepression's at ~25k stress.

I have noticed that too. Stress values looks good but the happiness thresholds are wrong:

• > 500000: miserable
• 250000 - 500000: very unhappy
• 100000 - 250000: unhappy
• -100000 - 100000: fine
• -250000 - -100000: content
• -500000 - -250000 : happy
• < -500000: ecstatic

The stress values changed?

[Jazz Cat]

Stress values looks good but the happiness thresholds are wrong:

• > 500000: miserable
• 250000 - 500000: very unhappy
• 100000 - 250000: unhappy
• -100000 - 100000: fine
• -250000 - -100000: content
• -500000 - -250000 : happy
• < -500000: ecstatic

The stress values changed?

Are those the current thresholds in DT? Because that would explain it--there's an extra 0 in every number on that list, it looks like. Those range from -500k to 500k, but the numbers I'm seeing in my dwarves fit more in the -50k to 50k range.

[Clément]

Yes, this is the current thresholds. And I found the same values in an old Quietust's post.

I checked with this save (because it mentioned stressed dwarves). Stress goes from -100k (exactly, it must be the limit) to 48.9k. Lowest stress with a red arrow is 14.1k and highest stress without it is 6.3k. Is 50k stress the point when they become permanently insane? Dividing by ten looks right.

[strainer]

Phew the polarity here confuses me:

Lowest stress with a red arrow is 14.1k

14k happy but has a red arrow?

highest stress without it is 6.3k

Everyone less than 6.3k happy had red arrow ?

I guess that's wrong but cant figure out the implied signage.

I did do some torture testing to feel out the limits of the value, and got someone down to 100k stressed, but I got the creeps from all the dark stuff going down, and wiped the save before concluding that was the hard limit.

An idea is to divide the description ranges at 0. Since new arrivals start at 0 you can get indication immediately of which way they are trending. Otherwise if it takes till say +/-10k to leave the initial range, they can have picked up some momentum by the time they are noticed. Could have -9 to 0 = "not great", 1 to 10 = "not bad", and then the progressively warning descriptions beyond them.

With the latest complications to this stress mechanism, a review of the language seems appropriate. It could be confusing that the stress/happiness score puts a dorf in a "content" range at the same time as it can be "very unfocused by unmet needs".  "Psyche" might be a suitable theme for Therapist. I'm thinking of going with something like 'story' to indicate extreme values involve a special story in the units thoughts/memory to look into... *edit* or fresh from a thesaurus: "Muse"

[lethosor]

Phew the polarity here confuses me:

Lowest stress with a red arrow is 14.1k

14k happy but has a red arrow?

highest stress without it is 6.3k

Everyone less than 6.3k happy had red arrow ?

I guess that's wrong but cant figure out the implied signage.

Stress is the opposite of happiness. A higher stress value is more stressed and less happy. The numbers are stress, not happiness.

[strainer]

Stress is the opposite of happiness

I dont think so, linguistically but regardless, those quotes arent consistent. "highest stress without (red arrow) is 6.3k" so 6.4k and higher can have a red arrow...

Lowest stress with a red arrow is 14.1k

There are potentially red arrows from 6.4k thats *lower* than 14.1k

[Starver]

I read it (admittedly skimming it) as there are no red arrows on/below 6.3k stress (so <=6.3k is not sufficiently stressed), there are only red arrows on/above 14.1k stress (so >14.1k is sufficiently stressed, at least to 1DP) but that there were absolutely no data for values between, so the singular threshhold might be 6.3k<threshhold<=14.1k.  The exact value needs to be established through more checking/observation to find the state of a dwarf who progresses (either way) throughsome or all of that stress range.

(Or, if it's a range of tipping points (because the threshold isn't pure stress, but maybe stress - happiness) the odds are reasonable that the typical stress range for any given typical modification value lies wholly/mostly inside that range (extreme outlier non-stress modifiers might shift it below 6.3k for an arrow, or above 14.1k above for no arrow, but more data is needed) where there's an overlap of maybe/maybe not flipping into the danger zone.)



Basically, ‼science‼ is needed. By anyone with time and a suitably stress-inducing gamespace to play in.

[lethosor]

Stress is the opposite of happiness

I dont think so, linguistically

What? They are definitely not synonyms. They may not be exact opposites, but one certainly does not come with the other.

but regardless, those quotes arent consistent. "highest stress without (red arrow) is 6.3k" so 6.4k and higher can have a red arrow...

Lowest stress with a red arrow is 14.1k

There are potentially red arrows from 6.4k thats *lower* than 14.1k

The full quote:

Lowest stress with a red arrow is 14.1k and highest stress without it is 6.3k

I interpret this to mean that a dwarf without a red arrow has 6.3k stress, a dwarf with a red arrow has 14.1k, and there are no dwarves in between. The data is just from one save, so it's not unlikely that there would be big gaps like that.

[Clément]

Stress replaced happiness. But DT kept calling it "Happiness" and using the old adjectives.­

I should have checked the message before the thought list instead of the status icon. Here are the most stressed dwarves from the previous save and a few more.
48.9k, 37.1k, 35.4k, 29.7k, 29.6k, 28.6k: <name> has become haggard and drawn due to the tremendous stresses placed on her/him.
21.8k, 14.8k, 14.4k, 14.1k, 13.6k, 13.3k, 13.2k, 12.9k, 11.3k, 10.7k: Over the long term, <name> has been under a great deal of stress.
9.8k (x2), 9.5k, 8.8k, 7.1k, 6.9k, 6.3k, ...: no message

This is consistent with 10k and 25k thresholds. I don't have a save with a dwarf above 50k.

Least stressed dwarves don't have special messages.

[strainer]

To be sure do none of these have red arrows?

9.8k (x2), 9.5k, 8.8k, 7.1k, 6.9k, 6.3k

Perhaps arrows can take into account stress_vulnerability ?

[Jazz Cat]

Is there a config file somewhere we (the users) can go in and set to the more accurate threshold, or do we wait until the next release comes out?