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Author Topic: Mad Arms Race - Mereth Design Division (Fall 1965 - Final Design Phase)  (Read 82240 times)

m1895

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Re: Mad Arms Race - Mereth Design Division (Fall 1964 - Revision Phase)
« Reply #885 on: June 13, 2019, 10:17:36 pm »

Quote from: Votebox
RIP-AT: (2) TricMagic, m1895
ME-ODS-64 'KILLSAT': (1) Madman
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NUKE9.13

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Re: Mad Arms Race - Mereth Design Division (Fall 1964 - Revision Phase)
« Reply #886 on: June 14, 2019, 10:36:35 am »

Well, even though it was a bit of a breach of opsec for Tric to ask the question, the question has been asked, and the response so far has been (somewhat understandably), negative: Aratam is not interested in PEACE. So, RIP-AT it is.

Quote from: Votebox
RIP-AT: (3) TricMagic, m1895, NUKE9.13
ME-ODS-64 'KILLSAT': (1) Madman
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TricMagic

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Re: Mad Arms Race - Mereth Design Division (Fall 1964 - Revision Phase)
« Reply #887 on: June 14, 2019, 04:58:51 pm »

'Enter Accronym Here' Air Carrier

The ACE, an Air Carrier Extraterrestrial, still requires a better name.

The ACE is the high point of our current technology. Made using the same technique as used in Nanoseal Concrete, the metals used doesn't have a single flaw or impurity to weaken them. Beyond that, the ACE is a semi-flat Helicarrier. It has two Turbo-props contained in a sealed chamber open at the bottom. Likewise, two smaller ones exist on the front Port and Aft of the Helicarrier designed to assist it. And finally two exist on the back Port and Aft sides. These are powered by a GOFAST-M Generator. In addition, jets in the backside of the ACE act to give it sufficient forward thrust.

Unlike most of our craft, the X-wings are unviable, so we've gone over the numbers, and figured out a near similar solution, called the Y-Effect.

The Y-Effect states thus, that air that flows around a structure in flight must also flow under it. Therefore, a secondary level provides additional lift to the craft.

By placing a second level slightly angled on the back of the Helicarrier, we can induce the air to lift it, which further keeps it balanced automatically in the air, and provides more lift than simply a flat Helicarrier. Though this only applies when it's moving forward. To compensate, we've also increased the power and size of the back-bottom turbo-prop a bit, which lets us keep it leveled more easily. This also has the effect of making turns a lot more smooth due to the change in weight distribution.

Now, the ACE doesn't have to fly all the time. The insides contain a super buoyant wood made by DUC. Don't ask how they made wood that buoyant, cause their are a lot of words like water displacement reduction/increases, and air/helium/wood ratios.  Point is, our Helicarrier can float at sea, and use it's props to move. And once it fires up to full, it can get back up just fine.


Now, to the loadout. The Helicarrier mostly makes use of this DUC conceived Superconductor. It uses perfectly sealed tubes, wires of this superconductor metal, and ICE. Not just any ICE, but the original, slightly tweaked to bring the Superconductor down to the needed temperature, and maintain it. The original ICE didn't need to be replaced nearly as often as our current version. So these Cables called LISAs(Lightning Ice Superconducting Array) can be plugged up for perfect electrical transfer. No energy wasted means we can power the ACE no problem. It uses one main GOFAST-M Engine for powering the Turbines, and 2 smaller GOFAST engines for powering anything else, or reducing the load on the Main Generator.

As for weapons, it mostly uses Talons and RIP-ATs. We kinda went over budget on it, and so had to just use stuff we already had. On the bright side, none of those things boost it's total cost, so we can produce it just fine. The ACE makes use of all this, and has two Aircraft Runways, 1 on each level. As well as Ravenmind Radio for an ORACLE Command Node over our troops. It also has room for a single Gate nested in it's own room. Though like the others, this is taken from our own forces, and not always in one. So no extra cost. We can also have our missile launchers loaded on too... Still, only weapons on this thing com from our own army. It doesn't have any natural weapons fitted. Though some of the models do have Combat Plating. Even for SERF production, this thing is a lot of area to cover.


To Go with the ACE, the CIVILIAN Project. Needs a Backronym...


The Aratams are so kind to give us the ability to launch massive things into space right? The ACE doesn't have a single weapon on it, other than what we put on it. So why not use it?

The CIVILIAN Model focuses on everything needed for long term survival in space. Everything HOPE created, we can fit here. And we can fit a lot on here without the need to worry about carrying weapon supplies. From BREATH to FIG. The Ursa Polaris. Solaris Systems that can be set up in Space. The main thing about the CIVILIAN Model is survival. As such, the Turboprops have been removed for more traditional jets, and landing stabilizers added to allow landing and takeoff to and from the moon. Moreover, it can reenter atmosphere. So long as it's landing position is the ocean. Anywhere else will have the entire area burned away from the jets pulling it out of a dive fairly gently. Mostly due to a very long pull to minimize Gs.

While not strictly military, we can still refuel other Spacecraft. This Operation with the CIVILIAN Model, we can easily set up a long term base on the moon with how much it can carry. Strictly Civilian of course.



ACE Design for next turn? And it is very much a design..

Also the CIVILIAN Project. Revision Tier.
« Last Edit: June 14, 2019, 05:33:07 pm by TricMagic »
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Madman198237

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Re: Mad Arms Race - Mereth Design Division (Fall 1964 - Revision Phase)
« Reply #888 on: June 14, 2019, 05:08:39 pm »

The RIP-AT description is somewhat hard to follow and integrates many unnecessary features, and leaves out a few possibilities and uses that should be mentioned.

Quote
ME-LDT-64 'Ravenmind Area Interdiction Laser System' (RAILS)
The new Ravenmind computer is quite an achievement. It is, however, mounted to quite the expensive chassis as of now. Enter the RAILS system, which makes use of the Ravenmind's target acquisition, tracking, and communications capability to provide unmatched tactical coordination and analysis. Oh, and it has a laser.

A conical base made of light COMBAT plating with an optical CLAW from the Firestorm mounted up the center with the emitter on top of the cone, RAILS contains all the sensors a Ravenmind needs to identify hostile airborne or groundside targets, a radio package to send that data to every other RAILS unit in the area as well as central command, and a GOFAST generator with an Electrogel battery pack to provide power to the Ravenmind. The CLAW dispenses with the cartridges to reduce Magmatite use in the CLAW itself and uses the cycling system with a minimal amount of Magmagel, again to reduce costs. RAILS is intended to be as small as possible as well as Cheap, and will make tradeoffs as necessary to become Cheap. Three steel stakes on the bottom allow the system to be driven into the ground by the Bear Trooper who carried it into the field, to keep it fixed in place. The Ravenmind in the RAILS system is smaller than that in the Firestorm, as it does not need the autopilot or holographic capabilities, saving a substantial amount of space. Also saving size and weight is the fact that this Ravenmind is only controlling a single weapon from a fixed platform (which is far easier to aim than multiple weapons on a moving platform)

The primary use of the RAILS system is interdiction. It is capable of shooting pretty much anything a Ravenmind can identify as a target---special care is taken to ensure that hostile artillery missiles and infantry are both included in this list due to their differences from the Ravenmind's usual targets. Constantly networked to every other RAILS system in the area, the units will coordinate fire to hit targets that are likely to attempt a dodge, or that are tough enough to survive a single CLAW burst. The secondary use is intelligence. Every RAILS unit can communicate the locations of friendlies and enemies alike to every other unit, and, most importantly, back to command. Our field commanders will have unparalleled intelligence and awareness of the situation so long as a RAILS unit is within range of a situation.

They can (and will) be deployed on the Moon, to prevent Aratamite attacks from being capable of overwhelming our lunar operation(s).

Emphasizing smaller size and lesser cost for maximum coverage, this is similar to RIP-AT but more focused on getting tactical. And also shooting more lasers beams.

OK fine it's mostly about shooting more laser beams.

Quote from: Votebox
RIP-AT: (3) TricMagic, m1895, NUKE9.13
ME-LDT-64 'RAILS': (1) Madman
ME-ODS-64 'KILLSAT': (0)

Much as I want the ability to blow up enemies from orbit...I understand the draw of a deploy-everywhere laser turret.
« Last Edit: June 15, 2019, 08:56:23 am by Madman198237 »
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TricMagic

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Re: Mad Arms Race - Mereth Design Division (Fall 1964 - Revision Phase)
« Reply #889 on: June 14, 2019, 05:16:26 pm »

Quote from: Votebox
RIP-AT: (3)  m1895, NUKE9.13, TricMagic,
ME-LDT-64 'RAILS': (1) Madman,
ME-ODS-64 'KILLSAT': (0)

Make sure to add the Datalinks connection for charging. A lot simpler though, which means an easy revision.

also, working on the whole ACE bit now I've eaten supper.
« Last Edit: June 14, 2019, 05:43:17 pm by TricMagic »
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Madman198237

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Re: Mad Arms Race - Mereth Design Division (Fall 1964 - Revision Phase)
« Reply #890 on: June 14, 2019, 05:21:23 pm »

I don't feel that there's much point connecting it to a Datalink cable since the turrets are meant to deployed across the field, nowhere near any Datalink cable.
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flabort

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Re: Mad Arms Race - Mereth Design Division (Fall 1964 - Revision Phase)
« Reply #891 on: June 14, 2019, 06:03:40 pm »


Quote from: Votebox
RIP-AT: (4) TricMagic, m1895, NUKE9.13, Flabort
ME-ODS-64 'KILLSAT': (1) Madman
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Failbird105

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Re: Mad Arms Race - Mereth Design Division (Fall 1964 - Revision Phase)
« Reply #892 on: June 14, 2019, 06:54:07 pm »

Quote from: Votebox
RIP-AT: (4)  m1895, NUKE9.13, TricMagic, Flabort
ME-LDT-64 'RAILS': (1) Madman,
ME-ODS-64 'KILLSAT': (0)
You kinda just removed Madmans entire last proposal and vote there Flabort
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TricMagic

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Re: Mad Arms Race - Mereth Design Division (Fall 1964 - Revision Phase)
« Reply #893 on: June 14, 2019, 08:09:20 pm »

Noted as V2 Revision Proposal. Props to Madman
ME-LDT-64 'Ravenmind Area Interdiction Laser System' (RAILS)
The new Ravenmind computer is quite an achievement. It is, however, mounted to quite the expensive chassis as of now. Enter the RAILS system, which makes use of the Ravenmind's target acquisition, tracking, and communications capability to provide unmatched tactical coordination and analysis. Oh, and it has a laser.

An Optical CLAW as seen in the Firestorm sitting slightly above the top of itself, RAILS contains all the sensors a Ravenmind needs to identify hostile airborne or groundside targets, the radio package to send that data to every other RAILS unit in the area as well as other Ravenminds all the way back to an ORACLE Node, a GOFAST generator and Recycling Magmagel to provide power to the Ravenmind and CLAW, and STABIL-ICE Cooling, RAILS is intended to be as small and portable as well as Cheap. Four flat pieces extending from the bottom edges of a RAILS allow the system to be nailed into the earth by Bear Troopers to keep it fixed in place on a wall or incline. It also has handles on it's sides for two Bear Troopers to pick up and carry.


The primary use of the RAILS system is interdiction. The RAILS Ravenmind is capable of shooting down anything in the sky, be it missiles or aircraft. Constantly networked to every other RAILS system in their assigned groups, the units will coordinate fire to hit targets that are likely to attempt a dodge. The secondary use is intelligence. Every RAILS unit can communicate the locations of friendlies and enemies alike to every other Ravenmind using units, and, most importantly, back to command. Our field commanders will have unparalleled intelligence and awareness of the situation so long as a RAILS unit is within range of it, which will be often..

They can (and will) on the Moon, to prevent Aratamite attacks from being capable of overwhelming our lunar operation(s). As well, they can be deployed on ships, and anywhere else we may need a helping hand to prevent enemy movement.

For Armor, it makes use of Combat Plating, and like a Bear Armor, it can be moved aside at a point to refill the STABIL-ICE, and connect a Datalink to it for rapid recharging, and new programs as needed. This allows us to program it not only to provide cover from Missiles, but also to dedicate groups to attacking infantry, coordinating multiple RAILS to take down tanks with a combined beam, and anything else we might need them for.

They also come with a Sleigh to allow Bears to pull them along, as the RAILS is slightly too big to be constantly carried by a single Bear Trooper. The Sleigh comes with wheels and a simple brake. Pretty simple to allow their movement behind infantry marches, and doubles as mobile anti-air.

As a reminder, remember to have your IFF so you don't get targeted by mistake. Ravenminds may be smart enough to recognize you in your armor, but better safe than sorry.

As it's not quite clear. The Ravenmind is a box. Need for all that finicky human stuff is removed, but it's still a box. We stick the rest of the Internals on top of this in it's own box, basically. So it's still a Box. And the Optical Claw fires from a cone sticking out of the top. Still mostly a Box. It's just a question on how well we fit everything that determines how much of a Box.

Quote from: Votebox
RIP-AT: (3)  m1895, NUKE9.13, Flabort
ME-LDT-64 'RAILS': (1) Madman,
V2 ME-LDT-64 'RAILS': (1) TricMagic
ME-ODS-64 'KILLSAT': (0)
« Last Edit: June 14, 2019, 08:37:37 pm by TricMagic »
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Failbird105

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Re: Mad Arms Race - Mereth Design Division (Fall 1964 - Revision Phase)
« Reply #894 on: June 14, 2019, 08:53:40 pm »

Quote from: Votebox
RIP-AT: (3)  m1895, NUKE9.13, Flabort
ME-LDT-64 'RAILS': (2) Madman, Failbird
V2 ME-LDT-64 'RAILS': (1) TricMagic
ME-ODS-64 'KILLSAT': (0)
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TricMagic

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Re: Mad Arms Race - Mereth Design Division (Fall 1964 - Revision Phase)
« Reply #895 on: June 14, 2019, 09:24:26 pm »

Quote from: Discord
Madman198237Today at 9:12 PM
There is a reason I am arguing for less, less, less
TricMagic, LoWToday at 9:13 PM
You really think we, who have manged to reach the moon and come back thanks to ICE, will have any trouble with this?
Madman198237Today at 9:13 PM
I want more of these things deployed, enough to invalidate their missile launchers through massed fire, rather than fewer great turrets.
TricMagic, LoWToday at 9:13 PM
Less, Less, Less. And then we end up with a Claw with about ten seconds of fire time.
Madman198237Today at 9:13 PM
Oh please
We'll end up with a CLAW just as powerful as infantry CLAWs, and that's just fine

2/2/2 is the Claw part of the design. This also includes the Magmagel which will power the Ravenmind, and the GOFAST. Ravenmind is likely an ore cost, and maybe a bit of oil. So my design, the V2 version, is fine. As stated in the RIP-AT, it's basically just packaging them together.

Something that is only as good as the Infantry Claw is not good. Your average Bear could shoot a missile out of the sky if they were trained for it. And if their weapons were properly linked to allow for continuous beam fire. Something with no cool-down system, which the Talon shows still ends up only costing 1 Oil even with an extensive cooling system, is dumb. It forces Ravenminds to lead their shots, rather than just using a beam to sweep through everything like the Firestorm does. By taking more out, it moves it farther and farther away from just packaging the things we already have. As is, mine will likely be easy. Perhaps, it may even end up trivial. MM's, while likely being easy, has a number of 'small details' missing. Like a damn Datalink Port under that armor. This is something that can screw us over, when it's trivial to make sure it at least has the thing... How else can it simply link with a ship for power? Which gives them AA for nothing. Not even a revision needed, it's a standard thing if it has a datalink.

I also note anther difference, spaced shots just like the infantry Claws, vs the Continual Beams to entrap it's targets before moving to the next with no delay. See the word Entrap, to prevent escape once they're in a group of laser beams. That and simply raking across an area instead of needing to fire at a new area after a slight delay. Not good against SEEMs, most likely, due to their grasp of surroundings. A sweeping laser does not pause to allow spacing.
« Last Edit: June 14, 2019, 09:38:23 pm by TricMagic »
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Madman198237

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Re: Mad Arms Race - Mereth Design Division (Fall 1964 - Revision Phase)
« Reply #896 on: June 14, 2019, 10:18:09 pm »

So, a possible design for next turn to build on the Ravenmind's immense capabilities and give us a breakthrough in computers and communication.

Quote
ME-UCD-64 Telecommunications Encrypted Light Enhanced General Radio Assistant, Miniaturized (TELEGRAM)
WALK-TALKs. ORACLE-A. Birdbrains and Shrikes. Ravenminds. All marvels of electronics and communication, advancing our capabilities bit by bit. The Universal Communication Device is meant to tie all our advancements together and push technology forwards better than has ever been seen before.

The TELEGRAM device is capable of encrypting radio traffic on the fly, which is then decrypted by any other TELEGRAMs on the same channel. It is capable of sending and receiving multiple streams of radio traffic simultaneously, playing them back as desired by the user, capable of sending and receiving CAT data by using multiple-channel transmission to eliminate errors in the transmitted data stream, capable of transmitting holographic images like Ravenmind is, and capable of extremely long-ranged transmission, able to reach satellites in low-Earth orbit. It is also, most remarkably, capable of decryption of hostile radio traffic, often real-time. TELEGRAM is controlled by the user's CAT interface.

Our impressive computer technology has steadily decreased the size and increased the power of computers for years now. A Herculean effort has allowed us to miniaturize this technology to the point where the circuits can actually be distributed amongst the inside of a Bear Suit without increasing the size of the suit, with a little extra battery power and the antennae mounted to the back of the suit in a very low-lying rectangular bulge in the rear armor plate. The system is installed in every single vehicle and structure we have and linked to Ravenminds and Birdbrains and back to ORACLE.

Anything I've missed or should add?


Tric you're jumping at shadows. No minor details are going to screw us over, that'd be petty and Chief is far from petty. He doesn't care whether we specify a Datalink port or not, if there is (somehow) a need for one then one will be installed. Our job is not to give Chief enough details to just follow the instructions to build a 3D model of what we want, we just tell him the broad strokes and he fills in most of them.
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flabort

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Re: Mad Arms Race - Mereth Design Division (Fall 1964 - Revision Phase)
« Reply #897 on: June 14, 2019, 10:19:00 pm »

You kinda just removed Madmans entire last proposal and vote there Flabort
I swear I quoted TricMagic's last post and just added in my vote. Sorry.

RAILS... even V2, is an anti-air weapon. It's designed to defeat Aratam's already inferior air force. The only thing of theirs that we have to worry about that RAILS will counter is the napalm spreading missiles, which, if we're more aggressive, we won't have to worry about as we can take out the emplacements or aircraft carrying them before they can be fired.

I just reread it while writing this up, and it can indeed take out ground targets as well.
No, you've convinced me. We do need to be able to hold the ground we take, and making a minefield out of laser guns that can blast away tanks and airplanes is a fantastic idea.
Quote from: Votebox
RIP-AT: (2)  m1895, NUKE9.13
ME-LDT-64 'RAILS': (2) Madman, Failbird
V2 ME-LDT-64 'RAILS': (2) TricMagic, Flabort
ME-ODS-64 'KILLSAT': (0)
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Madman198237

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Re: Mad Arms Race - Mereth Design Division (Fall 1964 - Revision Phase)
« Reply #898 on: June 14, 2019, 10:20:18 pm »

What? RAILS V1 comes in a better shape and is smaller, lighter, cheaper, and generally better for mass use...and says nothing about not being able to target infantry. If the Ravenmind can pick them up, it can kill them.
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flabort

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Re: Mad Arms Race - Mereth Design Division (Fall 1964 - Revision Phase)
« Reply #899 on: June 14, 2019, 10:30:40 pm »

What? RAILS V1 comes in a better shape and is smaller, lighter, cheaper, and generally better for mass use...and says nothing about not being able to target infantry. If the Ravenmind can pick them up, it can kill them.
The second design specifically says they can be programmed to specifically target infantry if needed, and the general blurb shared by both versions says "RAILS contains all the sensors a Ravenmind needs to identify hostile airborne or groundside targets," which implies that V2 doesn't say it can't target infantry either.

The only downside I see for the V2 that the V1 is superior at performing in is the size, where it says the V2 is carried by 2 bear troopers or transported by sleigh with one bear trooper pulling, where the V1 only requires one trooper. I cannot see how V1 would cost any less than V2, and both have had the holographic display and autopilot removed to shrink them.
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