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Author Topic: Ertex Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid - Strategy SY108  (Read 48459 times)

3_14159

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Re: Ertex Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #390 on: December 22, 2017, 08:43:35 am »

I'd rather design the missile and revise the laser.

Edit: Chiefwaffles convinced me to go for the Spear, not the least because it can also lead to heavy ground weaponry.

Quote
Dory missile (4): joha4270, FallacyofUrist, Andrea, Detoxicated
EAF-HDW1-A "Alke" Spider Tank (0):
EAC-AX5 "Spear" (4): Chiefwaffles, TFF, Piratejoe, 3_14159
EAF-HDW1-B "Arachne" Spider Tank (1): Blood_Librarian
Argus (1): Andrea
« Last Edit: December 22, 2017, 04:22:11 pm by 3_14159 »
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andrea

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Re: Ertex Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #391 on: December 22, 2017, 05:29:32 pm »

As promised earlier, adding the vote for the laser as well.

Quote
Dory missile (4): joha4270, FallacyofUrist, Andrea, Detoxicated
EAF-HDW1-A "Alke" Spider Tank (0):
EAC-AX5 "Spear" (5): Chiefwaffles, TFF, Piratejoe, 3_14159, Andrea
EAF-HDW1-B "Arachne" Spider Tank (1): Blood_Librarian
Argus (1): Andrea

Chiefwaffles

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Re: Ertex Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #392 on: December 22, 2017, 07:39:43 pm »

Voting for Argus to give it a better shot at winning if people care about it, though I'm keeping my vote for the Spear also as either works for me. Blood_Librarian also expressed their support over Discord.

Quote
Dory missile (4): joha4270, FallacyofUrist, Andrea, Detoxicated
EAF-HDW1-A "Alke" Spider Tank (0):
EAC-AX5 "Spear" (5): Chiefwaffles, TFF, Piratejoe, 3_14159, Andrea
EAF-HDW1-B "Arachne" Spider Tank (1): Blood_Librarian
EAF-SE1 Argus (3): Andrea, Chiefwaffles, Blood_Librarian
Reminder that the Argus circumvents their invisibility cloak, puts us quite close to being able to manipulate gravity, and is a desperately needed upgrade to our sensors. Which we haven't really touched at all in this game thus far.
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You should really look to the wilderness for your stealth ideas, it has been doing it much longer than you have after all. Take squids for example, that ink trick works pretty well, and in water too! So you just sneak into the dam upsteam, dump several megatons of distressed squid into it, then break the dam. Boom, you suddenly have enough water-proof stealth for a whole city!

Khang36

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Re: Ertex Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #393 on: December 22, 2017, 08:00:12 pm »


Quote
Dory missile (4): joha4270, FallacyofUrist, Andrea, Detoxicated
EAF-HDW1-A "Alke" Spider Tank (0):
EAC-AX5 "Spear" (5): Chiefwaffles, TFF, Piratejoe, 3_14159, Andrea
EAF-HDW1-B "Arachne" Spider Tank (1): Blood_Librarian
EAF-SE1 Argus (4): Andrea, Chiefwaffles, Blood_Librarian,khang
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BBBence1111

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Re: Ertex Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #394 on: December 23, 2017, 04:37:25 am »

Quote
EAC-AX5 "Spear" (6): Chiefwaffles, TFF, Piratejoe, 3_14159, Andrea, BBBence
EAF-SE1 Argus (5): Andrea, Chiefwaffles, Blood_Librarian, khang, BBBence
Dory missile (4): joha4270, FallacyofUrist, Andrea, Detoxicated
EAF-HDW1-B "Arachne" Spider Tank (1): Blood_Librarian
EAF-HDW1-A "Alke" Spider Tank (0):
Ground designs are kinda useless until we win in space, or make boarding possible. We can't really deliver them anywhere where they'd be useful.

Between the space weapons, I'd go for the Spear. While the Dory involves explosions, they have PD. And you can't PD lasers.

And the Argus is so damn useful, especally since it can lead to Blackholes as a powersource or weapon.
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NUKE9.13

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Re: Ertex Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #395 on: December 24, 2017, 04:51:05 pm »

Design: EAC-AX5 Spear
"...didn't we have some kind of laser gun?"
"Don't we? The Raider!"
"No, I mean the gun on our ships. The Spear."
"I don't think w-OOOOOOH"
"We completely forgot to continue upgrading our weapons, didn't we?"

The AX5 Spear is the culmination of a lot of tech. It's bound to be a huge improvement. Especially considering the modern AX4 Spear is a bandaged version of the laser pointer that we "designed" along with the first iteration of the Cuttlefish. This will be the first design actually given to a heavy laser weapon.

Implementation of the new "Vasarely" Nanopattern has led to huge improvements in power efficiency. We've implemented much better mirrors - something we really should have done earlier - in order to greatly decrease the falloff of power over distance. The general power has been dialed up to make use of the greater amounts of power afforded by the Caduceus. The Vasarely Nanopattern also has the new improvement of being able to affect different light wavelengths during "runtime" - we don't have to set it during production. This allows for Athena to reactively change the wavelength during combat in order to find a wavelength able to pierce Mirage plating.
Finally, a bit of concentrated effort in the realm of the mechanics surrounding the turret itself allow our lasers to track targets much more quickly. While this wasn't a problem before with Quillus ships, we hope to be able to start deflecting/vaporizing (whatever's easiest) coilgun rounds in space before they hit our ships, as Athena has already proven to be able to track the rounds with sensors.

Overall the AX5 Spear is expected to be a huge improvement. The proper mirrors should allow for a much more focused beam effectively boring through armor - especially helpful with Athena's precision - and at a far greater distance. The greater power consumption and efficiency should aid to just generally more powerful turrets. The wavelength switching should effectively nullify (for now) their specialized armor. And the tracking allows for us to use our Spears defensively as well, actually making use of Athena's projectile tracking.

TL;DR: Has anyone noticed we haven't touched our main weapon in a long time and that we never actually spent a design on it or really gave it any effort other than intentional side effects? Let's fix that. (AX5 Spear: Better mirrors -> less damage dropoff,  more power efficiency + consumption -> more damage in general, real-time wavelength switching -> less affected by mirage plating, better tracking speed -> (limited?) PD functionality)
EAC-AX5 Spear (Normal): (2+4)=6: Above Average
The new AX5 Spear is significantly better than the old AX4. I mean, let's just start with the damage output. Tripled. Power consumption? Up by ~50%. Damage dropoff has been reduced, meaning the lasers can do real damage even at Long range (although still not as much as at shorter ranges).
Perhaps most interesting, however, is the new Vasarely Pattern's ability to switch between up to three preset wavelengths across a wide range. Although the alternate wavelengths will deal slightly less damage, getting through Mirage Plating should not pose a challenge.
However, making the weapon function as PD just isn't viable- certainly not versus coilgun slugs. We didn't even spend much time on the possibility- main guns and PD just aren't the same thing.

The AX5 fits flawlessly into the same mounts as the AX4, and will require only a basic refit at Ertex.



It is now the Revision Phase of SY105.
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Happerry

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Re: Ertex Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #396 on: December 24, 2017, 07:45:02 pm »

Perhaps we should do the same kind of upgrade, but for our laser rifles?
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FallacyofUrist

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Re: Ertex Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #397 on: December 24, 2017, 08:02:13 pm »

That would be a good revision, but on the other hand, we could improve the effectiveness of our Aegis drones. Odds are the enemy will learn to target the portable Athena nodes...
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Happerry

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Re: Ertex Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #398 on: December 24, 2017, 08:05:21 pm »

What I'd like to do with the Athena nodes is to build them into a giant robot tank that can defend itself, but that'd be more then a revision.
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FallacyofUrist

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Re: Ertex Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #399 on: December 24, 2017, 08:13:06 pm »

That would be awesome. Call it... the Mothership. Or maybe the "Theseus-Class Mothership". Bonus points if it issues commands from space.

On another Arms Race note, I need your action for my Mad Science Arms Race test.
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FoU has some twisted role ideas. Screw second-guessing this mechanical garbage spaghetti, I'm basing everything on reads and visible daytime behaviour.

Would you like to play a game of Mafia? The subforum is always open to new players.

Happerry

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Re: Ertex Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #400 on: December 24, 2017, 08:49:31 pm »

That would be awesome. Call it... the Mothership. Or maybe the "Theseus-Class Mothership". Bonus points if it issues commands from space.

On another Arms Race note, I need your action for my Mad Science Arms Race test.
My issue with issuing commands from space is that the other side doesn't currently have any Ortillery, but they damn well do have the ability to shoot other ships in space, so if we make a space command ship it should be after we actually can keep stuff in orbit for more then one turn before it has to withdraw on count of railgun slugs.

Granted, they do have tanks of their own, and we might want to make another tank of our own before we make a command tank, whether its a robot tank or not is something we should consider, or at least hand out anti-tank missile launchers to our infantry first, but I'd prefer to keep our command units in the zone we have the better chance of defending.

Honestly if we had the transport and resource capacity I'd prefer to turn the command tanks into command relays, and then just build the actual command computers underneath a Castle Brain type structure with big whomping ground to orbit death rays and plentiful artillery and smaller defense turrets for use against ground foes.

(Also, oops, sorry, was waiting for you to make a new post about the experiment, didn't see till now you edited it in to the original one.)
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Chiefwaffles

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Re: Ertex Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #401 on: December 24, 2017, 08:55:01 pm »

Eh. Designing independent Athena node does come with the very bad flaw that the enemy can disable armies if they destroy the very obvious nodes.
Revision: Athena Dedicated Computronics
Right now we're hosting Athena on general computer parts and electronics. While this works just fine and is perfectly acceptable in a void, it could be much better.
By spending some time revising the computer parts utilized by Athena nodes, we can come up with parts that are specifically meant to work with Athena, improving the amount of processing power we get for space, mass, and budget.

This should allow us to fit proper Athena nodes in every Aegis drone (and just increase processing power/space+budget for anything else - like the Cuttlefish - and fit Athena into smaller things in the feature). The proper Athena nodes in Aegis units should eliminate the reliance on the external Athena node and allow relative competence even when severed from the network.

Hopefully the dedicated parts will allow Athena to "think" more, improving her general battlefield strategic and tactical abilities as well.
TL;DR: We revise computer parts specifically meant to "run" Athena, getting a lot more processing power for space/budget used. Maybe improve general capabilities as well w/ advantages from dedicated parts.



Revision: EAC-PDX1 "Aspis"
We greatly downscale an AX5 Spear in size and power, then implement some changes to the mirrors; specifically, the mirrors will be able to hopefully redirect the stream of laser pulses in any direction. The Aspis is put on every Cuttlefish, and Athena is instructed to use it to eliminate incoming projectiles she's already tracking, either by deflecting it or vaporizing it (whatever's easiest).

TL;DR: Revise some point defense for our ships.



Revision: EAC-TML2 "Sarissa"
Instead of a single large payload, we have the Sarissa instead hold a number of smaller "missiles" to be released when close to the target - making the Sarissa a MIRV missile. It'll release the smaller payloads before entering PD range.

Each smaller missile is of course controlled by Athena, who will guide them for maximum damage in the area and to overwhelm PD. This can also make the Sarissa more "efficient" at doing damage, as Athena can find the best targets in the area (or focus one one target) instead of wasting all explosive power in the center wherever the Sarissa itself hit.
TL;DR: Turn the Sarissa into a MIRV missile.



Revision: EAF-PX4 "Raider"
The Raider has been neglected for a while, too.

We refit the Raider to use the Vasarely Pattern (like ~x2 damage not x3 'cause we're not increasing power consumption). While we're at it, we make it more futuristic we include a holographic sight and sync the entire gun with Athena. Athena will be able to pinpoint already-analyzed weakspots as well as targets already located by the Athena network. The holosight isn't huge in size but it can point out targets (specifically mirage-plated ones) in the general direction the gun's pointed, as aforementioned the best spots to fire on to get past armor can be pinpointed, and Athena can give targets that compensate for movement and the like.
As a side note, one of the three Vasarely wavelength modes should be IR in order to bypass their smoke cloud stuff.

TL;DR: Give the Raider the Vasarely Pattern (increasing damage + countering mirage plating) and a holosight linked to Athena (compensating for target movement + pointing out stuff known by the network, like cloaked targets and weak points). Should be straightforward.
(Should be easy - holosight is just a hologram [we have] displaying what Athena knows and Vasarely pattern is already a laser pattern and from previous pattern designs we know porting them is trivial)

Spoiler: Holosight Reference (click to show/hide)

Quote
EAC-PDX1 "Aspis" (1): Chiefwaffles
EAC-PX4 "Raider" (1): Chiefwaffles
EAC-TML2 Sarissa (0):
Athena Dedicated Computronics (1): Chiefwaffles
EDIT: Also added a vote for Dedicated Computronics. Again, you can let me know if you dislike me multivoting.
My reasoning for Aspis: Basically cement a future space advantage and also give Quillus a taste of their own countermedicine. We increase the survivability of all our ships and lay the groundwork for PD in our land stuff as well.
My reasoning for PX4 Raider: It's a really easy way (Holosight: We make a hologram - trivial - and connect it to Athena - trivial. Vasarely Pattern: Just port it over - trivial) to get a substantial improvement for our infantry.
My reasoning for Computronics: Lays out more groundwork for a a better Athena in the future (more processing power in smaller things) and makes the Aegis able to work independently + be less bad.

« Last Edit: December 26, 2017, 12:57:42 am by Chiefwaffles »
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Quote from: RAM
You should really look to the wilderness for your stealth ideas, it has been doing it much longer than you have after all. Take squids for example, that ink trick works pretty well, and in water too! So you just sneak into the dam upsteam, dump several megatons of distressed squid into it, then break the dam. Boom, you suddenly have enough water-proof stealth for a whole city!

Happerry

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Re: Ertex Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #402 on: December 24, 2017, 09:51:03 pm »

Looks good to me.

Quote
EAC-PDX1 "Aspis" (2): Chiefwaffles, Happerry
EAC-PX4 "Raider" (2): Chiefwaffles, Happerry
EAC-TML2 Sarissa (0):
Athena Dedicated Computronics (1): Chiefwaffles
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andrea

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Re: Ertex Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #403 on: December 25, 2017, 05:33:13 am »

Me, I want to revise Sarissa and rifle this cycle. We need ways to deal with their heavy armor on the ground, we can't neglect it too much. And next design I want to do some gravity stuff.
The rifle alone is unlikely to be able to reliably kill their tanks, part of the power improvement we got on the spear was from increased electrical power from the caduceus, not an option for infantry. We should still get double power, and maybe smaller size, but I suspect we will still need sarissa.

Quote
EAC-PDX1 "Aspis" (2): Chiefwaffles, Happerry
EAC-PX4 "Raider" (3): Chiefwaffles, Happerry, Andrea
EAC-TML2 Sarissa (1): Andrea
Athena Dedicated Computronics (1): Chiefwaffles
« Last Edit: December 25, 2017, 01:40:42 pm by andrea »
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3_14159

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Re: Ertex Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #404 on: December 25, 2017, 04:23:10 pm »

Proposing another alternative for improving the Sarissa:

Quote
EAC-TML2 "Sarissa" Mk. II

The Sarissa II is, in most respects, a general upgrade of the old Sarissa. Slightly better manoeuvrability, slightly more accuracy, slightly higher range, better sensors. What makes it special is what we did with the warhead.
The issue with our current warhead is a dilemma: We can either detonate it outside of the enemy's PD range (and not do any significant damage) or close in to its target and get shot down. The Sarissa Mk. II's warhead solves that by constraining the nuclear explosion in a cage of InsAlloy, with a plug of other material (hydrogen?) being accelerated. This effectively concentrates the warhead's energy into a cone only about 5° across, which increases its range ten-fold (against a very specific area). If not necessary (it's been detected there are no PD-equipped units nearby), the rocket as before dives and the InsAlloy cage is explosively dismantled before detonating.

Quote
EAC-PDX1 "Aspis" (2): Chiefwaffles, Happerry
EAC-PX4 "Raider" (4): Chiefwaffles, Happerry, Andrea
EAC-TML2 Sarissa (2): Andrea, 3_14159
EAC-TML2 Sarissa Directional Warhead (1): 3_14159
Athena Dedicated Computronics (1): Chiefwaffles
« Last Edit: December 25, 2017, 04:58:23 pm by 3_14159 »
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