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Author Topic: The Fitness Thread - THE RE-SWOLLENING  (Read 62451 times)

Xantalos

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Re: The Fitness Thread (aka Git Fit, aka Swole Patrol, aka Many Rep, Such Wow)
« Reply #120 on: December 01, 2017, 02:39:44 pm »

Should help - make sure to really squeeze your elbows into your sides when pulling up though, that's what really engages your lateral muscles. Made a fair difference for me.
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nenjin

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Re: The Fitness Thread (aka Git Fit, aka Swole Patrol, aka Many Rep, Such Wow)
« Reply #121 on: December 01, 2017, 02:51:42 pm »

Just never really given my back the attention it needs. Couldn't climb the rope in grade school either, it's always been a sore point for me physically.

I've got a home pullup bar it's just....awkward to try and do pullups from your knees almost. It's not really an excuse. But man am I glad I can target my lats now with a machine. The body weight exercises for lats and back are not exactly straight forward.
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nenjin

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Re: The Fitness Thread (aka Git Fit, aka Swole Patrol, aka Many Rep, Such Wow)
« Reply #122 on: December 01, 2017, 05:32:07 pm »

Double post but eh:

Here's a good TED Talk that breaks down what I was talking about earlier with Fasting, Insulin Levels, Insulin Sensitivity and Fat Storage. She explains it a lot better than I did. The talk is aimed at Diabetes and Obesity but if you are actively thinking about how what you eat affects your body and your metabolism just from a fitness perspective, you should watch this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=da1vvigy5tQ

I don't think I agree with her conclusion that "you need absolutely zero carbs in your diet" though. But she's treating patients for diabetes so I think that's a pretty understandable position for her to take.
« Last Edit: December 01, 2017, 05:46:02 pm by nenjin »
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NRDL

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Re: The Fitness Thread (aka Git Fit, aka Swole Patrol, aka Many Rep, Such Wow)
« Reply #123 on: December 01, 2017, 06:36:21 pm »

The benefits of minimal carbs goes way beyond weight loss in my personal experience. I just FEEL better overall. Less aches and pains, never feel sick, my energy levels never fluctuate rapidly.

Maybe it's just a placebo effect. If so, it's a damn effective placebo.
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Edmus

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Re: The Fitness Thread (aka Git Fit, aka Swole Patrol, aka Many Rep, Such Wow)
« Reply #124 on: December 01, 2017, 07:20:57 pm »

From what I've learnt of metabolism this year, zero carbs is not great for most people.
With zero carbs, your body will break down protein to produce glucose, whereas very little fat can be converted to glucose. (only the glycerol backbone iirc)
A lot of tissue requires glucose as its only energy source, including the brain and blood cells.
People with diabetes are seriously metabolically broken, and treatments are pretty extreme and you should be doing prevention, not treatment.
Never drink soft-drink and avoid white-rice and bread. Keeping daily sugar below ~30-35 grams is good advice, it's bombarding your body with the most open ended resource is has for storage and transport otherwise. Longer chain polysaccharides that your body has to work to extract are what you want. I'm only a bio-chem student, so take this with a pinch of salt, but that's my best understanding. 
#notallcarbs. Porridge is good shit—it lowers cholesterol for some reason.
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nenjin

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Re: The Fitness Thread (aka Git Fit, aka Swole Patrol, aka Many Rep, Such Wow)
« Reply #125 on: December 01, 2017, 08:02:00 pm »

That's pretty much my understanding too. You need at least some carbs as an average daily source of energy for the brain and body. And that's if you're not exercising/working out. If you're working out, especially resistance training, carbs are what put the most glycogen back in to your muscles, which they use as energy. No glycogen and your body starts cannibalizing muscle instead.

I know pretty much everyone will disagree with me about this, but I don't think white rice and white bread are a death sentence. We just eat way too much of it. Anything I get sits on a huge bed of rice. Many people's daily meals are sandwich between multiple slices of white bread. We eat pasta meals that are 70% carbs, 25% protein and 5% vegetable matter. Pizza is like70% carbs.

Just cut back the carbs, but don't cut them out. There are plenty of relatively unprocessed carbs you can eat too if you don't want the gluten or the processed wheat flour. (Personally I've never made an association between processed wheat flour and feeling bad......but based on how different I feel after working out, maybe it's a case of not knowing how bad you feel until you stop feeling that way.)

All I know is my family loves their french bread and their pasta and I seriously doubt I could give up either entirely. That shit is the spice of life. Just go easy on the seasoning.

The grams of sugar I've read the six pack guys recommending is less than 16g of sugar a day. For reference, that's about 4 tea spoons. What they actually recommend is zero.
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Edmus

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Re: The Fitness Thread (aka Git Fit, aka Swole Patrol, aka Many Rep, Such Wow)
« Reply #126 on: December 01, 2017, 08:23:01 pm »

Good point with the glycogen in muscle.
I agree with you on the carbs. I think I end up with a lot of my food being 'carbs' in a day, with bread, pasta, porridge and wraps. Not even thinking about vegetables...
It's a quality vs quantity issue, I feel lucky I prefer the low-GI stuff.
'Carbohydrates' is a pretty big simplification of things. Technically that lumps fibre and fructose in the same basket. A weetbic is very different from a potato is very different from a slice of cake.

I'd buy into 0-16g sugar. I do like a couple pieces of fruit in a day though, so I probably hit the 30g mark just with that. If you wanna jump further onto the anti-sugar bandwagon, this is an interesting interview with one of the journalists who's pushing it.
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JoshuaFH

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Re: The Fitness Thread (aka Git Fit, aka Swole Patrol, aka Many Rep, Such Wow)
« Reply #127 on: December 01, 2017, 10:25:38 pm »

That's pretty much my understanding too. You need at least some carbs as an average daily source of energy for the brain and body. And that's if you're not exercising/working out. If you're working out, especially resistance training, carbs are what put the most glycogen back in to your muscles, which they use as energy. No glycogen and your body starts cannibalizing muscle instead.

I'm not an expert here, just read the one book I already linked, but it mentioned that the process of your body breaking down muscle tissue to use as energy is called 'wasting' and it does happen, but only to people that are at extremely low levels of body fat, IIRC it was below 2% BMI. Otherwise, your body simply uses your stored glycogen in your liver and then your fat reserves for energy, but releases that fat as ketone bodies, which are purported to actually be far greater than glucose as an actual energy source.

I read that the deal with carbs is that refined carbs like bread or cake or whatever, overstimulate the insulin system because they're basically things our bodies were never evolved to have in such large quantities as they now exist in most 1st worlder's diets. Meats and fats don't stimulate it as much, so even though fats are very calorically dense, they don't stimulate the insulin system very much and therefore your body never goes into 'save that shit' mode, and so during a keto diet your body continues pulling from bodily reserves even though it has food in it's system.
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nenjin

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Re: The Fitness Thread (aka Git Fit, aka Swole Patrol, aka Many Rep, Such Wow)
« Reply #128 on: December 01, 2017, 11:19:27 pm »

Yeah I've seen people on the Keto diet who manage to stay very thin. But I get bored just looking at what they eat. I had a couple of friend who would have like, a steak, some green veggies and then just a pile of cooked fat on the plate. And that seemed like their meals most nights. Didn't seem super appealing to me. But again, I'm pretty biased.

Quote

I'm not an expert here, just read the one book I already linked, but it mentioned that the process of your body breaking down muscle tissue to use as energy is called 'wasting' and it does happen, but only to people that are at extremely low levels of body fat, IIRC it was below 2% BMI. Otherwise, your body simply uses your stored glycogen in your liver and then your fat reserves for energy, but releases that fat as ketone bodies, which are purported to actually be far greater than glucose as an actual energy source.

I think it's sorta similar to what happens to long distance runners. They run for 45 minutes, run out of all the stored muscle glycogen, then there's this 30 or 45 minute period where they're probably pulling it from their liver. Then after about 2 hours of steady state cardio, they start pulling it from fat cells and their fat loss goes through the roof. (Was watching a whole video on sort of the calorie and fat burning map of a long distance runner.) The release of ketones also probably contributes to the "Runner's High" and the second wind.

But you know who has like, no muscle mass at all and insanely low body fat levels? People that can run for 6 hours straight. So the body cannibalizing muscle mass does happen beyond a certain threshold of sustained effort, once you've tapped out the energy in the muscles and other places. I know from resistance training that I can tell when I've not had enough carbs, because my muscles tire way faster. And a lot of body building channels I've watched have all more or less lined up to say you have to eat a reasonable level of carbs to both fuel your intensity and prevent muscle loss if you push through fatigue and keep working out.

Quote
I read that the deal with carbs is that refined carbs like bread or cake or whatever, overstimulate the insulin system because they're basically things our bodies were never evolved to have in such large quantities as they now exist in most 1st worlder's diets. Meats and fats don't stimulate it as much, so even though fats are very calorically dense, they don't stimulate the insulin system very much and therefore your body never goes into 'save that shit' mode, and so during a keto diet your body continues pulling from bodily reserves even though it has food in it's system.

Yeah, our bodies definitely did not evolve in a time when carbohydrates from sugars and processed grains were readily available. I find the whole science of insulin and how it's reacted to our modern habits pretty fascinating now that I getting in to it. And I'm starting to think a regular dose of cinnamon every day, to increase the body's insulin sensitivity, has really helped keep my appetite in check and in turn help me lose weight. I'd use even more but it's hard to find a lot of things to put cinnamon on in a day. I suppose if I was getting donuts or rolls or something it'd be pretty easy, but that'd sort of be self-defeating, wouldn't it? :P
« Last Edit: December 01, 2017, 11:27:36 pm by nenjin »
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Cautivo del Milagro seamos, Penitente.
Quote from: Viktor Frankl
When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves.
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Its kinda silly to complain that a friendly NPC isn't a well designed boss fight.
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Quote from: MrRoboto75
Always spaghetti, never forghetti

Yoink

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Re: The Fitness Thread (aka Git Fit, aka Swole Patrol, aka Many Rep, Such Wow)
« Reply #129 on: December 01, 2017, 11:49:42 pm »

These days I eat every carb I can lay my hands on. :))
In other news, currently struggling to work up some exercise motivation. Or any motivation, really, though there's not much I need to do today apart from exercise.
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NRDL

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Re: The Fitness Thread (aka Git Fit, aka Swole Patrol, aka Many Rep, Such Wow)
« Reply #130 on: December 02, 2017, 12:57:30 am »

What kind of training do you do Yoink?
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nenjin

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Re: The Fitness Thread (aka Git Fit, aka Swole Patrol, aka Many Rep, Such Wow)
« Reply #131 on: December 02, 2017, 01:03:50 am »

I haven't had that problem...yet. There are days I feel weaker and less energetic and that makes it harder to work out...hard. But I do it. There's not much I've been super disciplined about in my life, but this has become one thing. Chasing the weight loss dragon is a constant reinforcer. Honestly if I didn't have that crystalized goal in front of me, I may not have stuck with this. I looked in the mirror the other day and realized, I pretty much have a flat stomach now. Sure there's still a discernible layer of fat but I'd call it pretty realistic. If my goal was to get down to a healthier weight, well, I think I've done that. But it's something beyond just being healthier and thinner. Now I wanna see if I can get shredded, for real shredded. Just for the fuck of it. To see if the changes and discipline I've cultivated are enough to get me there, or if it will take a higher commitment still to achieve it. I'm not even sure I want to live a life style to have a body like that. But for just a while, it might be fun to be that cut.
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Cautivo del Milagro seamos, Penitente.
Quote from: Viktor Frankl
When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves.
Quote from: Sindain
Its kinda silly to complain that a friendly NPC isn't a well designed boss fight.
Quote from: Eric Blank
How will I cheese now assholes?
Quote from: MrRoboto75
Always spaghetti, never forghetti

JimboM12

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Re: The Fitness Thread (aka Git Fit, aka Swole Patrol, aka Many Rep, Such Wow)
« Reply #132 on: December 02, 2017, 04:30:18 am »

But for just a while, it might be fun to be that cut.

as someone who's been at, say, chris hemsworth as thor level of cut (but a bit thinner (not like, fatwise, more like lean)), it's pretty fun. it's a very solid confidence booster to see it in the mirror and to get stares (the good kind) at the beaches or pools. it's best combo-ed with a tan after all. you feel strong and losing weight also takes some of it from around your face, so you might even look better (your mileage may vary)

losing that is a gradual slip until you realize you got a pudding gut. egad. im sure a good bit of my muscle is still under there but losing weight's harder when you're not an enlisted guy with access to a gym literally a short walk from the dorms and nothing to do most weeknights except eat healthy dining facility food and work out.

winter has hosed me badly; i got vacation to go visit family around christmas and new years, but im finding less time as i've got work to finish before then. i might be able to keep the fast with my better eating habits but working out might be on hold for a new years resolution upturn.
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JoshuaFH

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Re: The Fitness Thread (aka Git Fit, aka Swole Patrol, aka Many Rep, Such Wow)
« Reply #133 on: December 02, 2017, 08:28:19 am »

I dug up two videos from 'Questions for Science' which are short and interesting, I'd say atleast:

How carbs make you fat:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T4QY9yU6Inc

Heavy lifting vs light lifting:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQIf1Y3NXFA

I have a feeling he oversimplifies on the topics though.
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JoshuaFH

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Re: The Fitness Thread (aka Git Fit, aka Swole Patrol, aka Many Rep, Such Wow)
« Reply #134 on: December 04, 2017, 08:07:24 am »

I'm so beat today. Just walking feels rough. I thought I'd go to an old ping pong club I used to go to a couple years ago, but before that I thought I'd warm up at the gym, doing my normal exercises and running a couple miles, so I'm not going in cold. I wound up having to leave early because the exertion was getting too much, and my knees were starting to feel weak. Guess I'll just eat healthy and take it easy today.

Still it was immense fun. I wish I could do it every week, or even a couple times a week, that'd be awesome.
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