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Author Topic: BYOR 0 - Game Over: Everyone Dies, SK wins  (Read 196211 times)

hector13

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Re: BYOR 0 - Day 2: One Up, One Down, And One Nowhere Around
« Reply #870 on: June 14, 2017, 01:07:05 pm »

Do... do you understand how the game works? I'd quite like to refine my read on you, which you refuse to allow me to do, 'cause you're basically saying "nah, fuck your questions, scum", which I guess is telling in and of itself.

I made things easier for you by giving you a template, you literally just have to fill in the blanks. Why do you not want anyone to get a stronger read on you?
Lemmie explain what I mean by 1-bar of service, and why I havent done any rereading of the thread, at all, ever since I fused with shakerag.
I brought up my unread replies page at 17:34. which finished loading at 17:36. I clicked new on this thread at that time, and the timestamp loaded at 17:38 BUT your latest post didnt load till 17:44. I then hit reply at 17:45, which loaded thankfully at 17:46. I then typed up this reply without looking at the old posts shown below on the reply page because they take forever to load, and then typed this message to you.
I can give you the quotes you want when it wont LITERALLY take an hour to load the old pages alone, with zero time spent actually reading them, which will be on the 17th or so.

Also, sorry that I was irate earlier, I had been spending hours breathing dust and playing with C-wire, had a headache, and I shouldnt have been posting at all.
I didnt even notice your template post until this time loading the page while waiting for it to let me see past webs votecount.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Having said that, dont dodge my question. Not even you believe the what youre saying, so quit it already and just say what youre really after.

What question did I dodge? What am I selling? If I'm selling a case on you, surely you can tell me the read I have on you?

any other questions? glancing at your template you just repeated the same shit I already answered and numbered for you so that sack of crap can go piss right the fuck off, but if you have something worth reading I'd welcome it.

You didn't provide much in the way of response to it the last time, hence the "fuck your questions, scum" thing before.

You seem to have ignored the fact I asked you to explain your case on me, seeing as how you went from "this is a null thing you're doing" to "obvscum is obvious" over the course of a post or two, and your case, from my admittedly biased perspective, looks wholly manufactured, like you worked from the conclusion backwards.
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Look, we need to raise a psychopath who will murder God, we have no time to be spending on cooking.

If you struggle with your mental health, please seek help.

hector13

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Re: BYOR 0 - Day 2: One Up, One Down, And One Nowhere Around
« Reply #871 on: June 14, 2017, 01:11:11 pm »

That's a good idea, nyah. Finding another scummy target will probably be much easier than thoroughly examining everybody, nyah. As a bonus, it'll hopefully get some activity going, nyah.

How goes the search, sailor?



Tea
Tolyk
Jake
Persus
4mask
Tiruin
TDS

Can y'all provide some feedback on this whole hector-Lenglon back and forth? I'm worried I'm letting my not insignificant frustration cloud my judgment.

It might even get you assholes to actually post for a change. :P
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Look, we need to raise a psychopath who will murder God, we have no time to be spending on cooking.

If you struggle with your mental health, please seek help.

4maskwolf

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Re: BYOR 0 - Day 2: One Up, One Down, And One Nowhere Around
« Reply #872 on: June 14, 2017, 01:11:55 pm »

Fallacy: is your nyah nonsense a post restriction or something you're doing for RPing purposes?
... nyah?

Why not scum hunt someone who is not Tolyk instead of incessantly saying "waiting on Tolyk, nyah. Tolyk hasn't responded yet, nyah."
That's a good idea, nyah. Finding another scummy target will probably be much easier than thoroughly examining everybody, nyah. As a bonus, it'll hopefully get some activity going, nyah.
Nope, I'm not letting you get away with that non-answer.  Not good enough.  Given that you didn't do this D1 this obviously isn't a mandatory post restriction, which almost certainly means that you can tell me about it if it exists, fallacy

Lenglon

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Re: BYOR 0 - Day 2: One Up, One Down, And One Nowhere Around
« Reply #873 on: June 14, 2017, 04:01:28 pm »

Hector: I gave your questions the kind of answers they deserved. ask better questions for better answers.
As for my "case" on you? Pressure for you to ask better questions. If I was trying to lynch you Id be voting you more than once.
Extend - lack of activity and no conclusive lynch target.
My current preferred lynch is FoU. Flabort currently has me reasonably convinced hes probably not scum, and the people I want to hear more from the most are Tea, TolyK, Jack, and TDS, my current scummiest players are Tiruin, FoU, and Persus, with TolyK in with a special mention for third party probable but almost certainly not actual scum.

Now then, back to me and hector ripping each other apart because were t-rexes and nobody else is moving so we only see each other.

Hector: No, seriously, what the hell are you trying to acomplish? You wana know if I'm actively scumhunting? right now? no. re-reading sucks so im not doing it until i can load pages in a reasonable manner. You wana know how my Fuse works? I just told you. You wana know who I think is scum/town? listed above. You wana know my reaction to sleezy agression? it makes me pissy. Just fucking ask what you want to know already and stop dancing around playing word games asshole.
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((I don't think heating something that is right above us to a ridiculous degree is very smart. Worst case scenario we become +metal statues+. This is a finely crafted metal statue. It is encrusted with sharkmist and HMRC. On the item is an image of HMRC and Pancaek. Pancaek is laughing. The HMRC is melting. The artwork relates to the encasing of the HMRC in metal by Pancaek during the Mission of Many People.))

Jack A T

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Re: BYOR 0 - Day 2: One Up, One Down, And One Nowhere Around
« Reply #874 on: June 14, 2017, 04:18:31 pm »

More content coming, but I want to interrupt the hector/Lenglon clash first.

Can y'all provide some feedback on this whole hector-Lenglon back and forth? I'm worried I'm letting my not insignificant frustration cloud my judgment.
hector13: Your dossier on Lenglon is rather dodgy, to keep the referential theme.  (I had trouble resisting.)

I have little idea where you're going or what you're trying to say at many points, but the clear parts aren't particularly reassuring.  You have a thing about role balance/skepticism of Lenglon's claim that does veer quite a bit into the realm of rolefishing (if not taken as rolefishing, the questions oft have little purpose beyond showing that you're skeptical).

Part of the clear portion isn't particularly meaningful.  It would have been nice to outright know that Shakes and Lenglon had a quicktopic, yes, but it's also to be expected: two combined players pretty much have to have a way to coordinate.  It's an easy omission as an easy assumption.

Then there's this:
That's a pretty textbook example of misrepresentation. Shakerag claimed Miller.
Test for some clever clogs: what ways can we confirm a Miller is actually a Miller and not scum/SK/otherwise anti-town?
And so I find myself drawn once more into the abyss of miller theory.
A miller is relatively easy to confirm to be a miller: role/power inspects are a lot more reliable than alignment inspects.  As for alignment, we confirm that the same way we confirm anyone else's alignment: we don't.  There are pretty much no perfect confirmation methods (even flips are false, very rarely).  Instead, what we do to determine a miller's alignment is, well, what we do to determine anyone else's alignments: question, use logic, and determine whose interests they seem to be trying to pursue.  We just don't have alignment inspects, as they gave their inspect result already (but alignment inspects do not confirm anyway, not in a game of potential/likely framers and godfathers).

It seems to me that part of your case comes down to you distrusting Shakerag for claiming miller.  Is this correct?  How familiar are you with miller claim practice here?
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Quote from: Pandarsenic, BYOR 6.3 deadchat
FUCK YOU JACK
Quote from: Urist Imiknorris, Witches' Coven 2 Elfchat
YOU TRAITOROUS SWINE.
Screw you, Jack.

Shakerag

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Re: BYOR 0 - Day 2: One Up, One Down, And One Nowhere Around
« Reply #875 on: June 14, 2017, 04:34:07 pm »

Hey all, doing the back-from-vacation-and-need-to-catch-up-on-so-much dance.  Shooting for some time to review/post tonight.

Tea

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Re: BYOR 0 - Day 2: One Up, One Down, And One Nowhere Around
« Reply #876 on: June 14, 2017, 05:17:02 pm »

Can y'all provide some feedback on this whole hector-Lenglon back and forth? I'm worried I'm letting my not insignificant frustration cloud my judgment.

It might even get you assholes to actually post for a change. :P
I independently moderately townread both Shakerag and Lenglon before the fusion. The main question for me now is a result of Lenglon explaining her choice of fusion of Shakerag as an investigation initially - waffling on her townread of him. Now that Shakerag has claimed for her that her alignment changed to be the same as his, I guess I'd like an updated explanation from Lenglon on why Shakerag was actually chosen in the first place. Somewhat relatedly, I also would like to know from Webadict if it's possible to have more than one win condition.

I very much agree with the second half of Jack's recent post but have been having trouble articulating it. I highly doubt not mentioning the existence of the QT was nefarious especially since both Shake/Leng talked about it pretty casually later on. The fusion ability doesn't seem unbalanced to me on its face, nor is my reaction to a miller claim that it needs to be tested or lynched, so. I guess I feel like what's important to me about their claim isn't really what's important to you.

I think that you shouldn't be being voted rn because I think you've at least an 80% chance of having a friendly neighbor ability based on what doll said (that's the only Xylbot explanation for her getting a message that you're town + Webadict said "No PMing to anyone but me, the mod. I won't make this an action either because PMing is stupid" which makes me think it's less likely that he would put in some weird messaging-through-the-mod-role) - so from a purely mechanical standpoint you're Top Town.

-

As far as other recent thoughts, I liked DarkStar's turn-around on flabort's night behavior. I am still waiting on Tiruin to respond to the stuff I've directed at her at day start. I would be voting Fallacy if I had a vote.

Does anyone who has played with TBF know if him falling off a cliff activity-wise is an alignment tell?
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hector13

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Re: BYOR 0 - Day 2: One Up, One Down, And One Nowhere Around
« Reply #877 on: June 14, 2017, 05:20:02 pm »

It seems to me that part of your case comes down to you distrusting Shakerag for claiming miller.  Is this correct?  How familiar are you with miller claim practice here?

To be fair that and the question of how Lenglon's fusion ability works. The initial vote and question was for a bit of pressure, then Lenglon went off the fuckin' handle, so I thought there was something to it. Evidently she's just a dick :P

Alternatively, we both assumed the other was being super srs with the voting and pressure.

Anyway, I'm reasonably familiar, though I've only played two games prior to this that it came up: firstly, one in which everyone got a bit freaked out by the Miller claim and investigated the Miller, and the other in which there was 2 Millers, which involved Leafsnail saying that the response to both of the kooks claiming in their first post meant they might try a fake Miller claim as scum to see what happened.

Shakerag was also present in the latter, and I recall the first game I played with him saying he liked to mess around with meta (he said his, but he's canny enough to do it with site meta too I imagine) so I was wary of that, plus Lenglon pretty much immediately hitting a player we can't investigate with a fusion ability and saying "nah bro it's okay I'm town, Shake's checks out" as though that even means anything.

Frankly, I think it's a medium- to long-term danger to town. If it's true, scum can deflect onto the Miller 'cause they aren't easily trusted, if it's not, well, piss all has happened this day, they might just coast by until it's too late. Especially since they have vote-stealing abilities too. Normally a town-aligned thing, but webadict's a dick too so that doesn't necessarily mean it is.
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Look, we need to raise a psychopath who will murder God, we have no time to be spending on cooking.

If you struggle with your mental health, please seek help.

FallacyofUrist

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Re: BYOR 0 - Day 2: One Up, One Down, And One Nowhere Around
« Reply #878 on: June 14, 2017, 06:19:53 pm »

Nope, I'm not letting you get away with that non-answer.  Not good enough.  Given that you didn't do this D1 this obviously isn't a mandatory post restriction, which almost certainly means that you can tell me about it if it exists, fallacy
It's not how I was yesterday, nyah.

How goes the search, sailor?
Nothing so far, nyah. I'll try to find somebody today, though, nyah.
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FoU has some twisted role ideas. Screw second-guessing this mechanical garbage spaghetti, I'm basing everything on reads and visible daytime behaviour.

Would you like to play a game of Mafia? The subforum is always open to new players.

Jack A T

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Re: BYOR 0 - Day 2: One Up, One Down, And One Nowhere Around
« Reply #879 on: June 14, 2017, 06:49:20 pm »

@Jack A T: All actions are redirected, unless actions permit otherwise.
Webadict: Hm.  If in one night two kill actions hit a player with a one-shot autorevive, what happens?
Webadict: Please answer.  Also, are players allowed to screenshot portions of a quicktopic and post them here?

I don't think so.
Well, I'm currently suspecting Tiruin for not having ANY suspects more than I suspect you for the mafia avoiding your suspects, right now, actually, so I'm going to unvote you and vote her.
flabort: Alright.  It seemed like there were a few links missing: why them not killing one of the people I voted for makes me look suspicious, what makes it look like they actively avoided my suspects, and why this doesn't point at anyone else whose vote targets weren't nightkilled.  Can you clarify?

TheDarkStar: Can you explain what exactly changed your read on Pozzai from unreadable to non-evil third party?
TheDarkStar: I don't think you ever answered this.

Given that you didn't do this D1 this obviously isn't a mandatory post restriction, which almost certainly means that you can tell me about it if it exists, fallacy
4maskwolf: I don't see how his lack of NYAHNYAHNYAH D1 means it isn't a mandatory post restriction D2.  Role changes seem to be quite a big thing in this game.  Can you explain?

hector13: Ah, miller stuff.  Quick overview:
Spoiler: Miller Theory (click to show/hide)

Fallacy Stuff
[1]: I assure you, I would be questioning TolyK a lot more if he responded to me more, nyah. My vote is still on TolyK since I think he is scum, nyah. So far, he hasn't really countered my allegations, so my vote remains on him, nyah. If he tried to counter my allegations(besides by actually scumhunting, anyway), I would respond and do that pursuing thing you're talking about, nyah.
Stop using TolyK as an excuse to sit around and do nothing.  Not only have you done almost nothing regarding TolyK, but you're also doing almost nothing regarding anyone else with the excuse that you're too focused on dealing with TolyK.
[5]: Did you miss the post where I made a case on TolyK based on his lack of scumhunting, nyah?
I am quite aware of that, initially a secondary component of your case.  You, however, have decided to avoid my point: while the primary portion of your case got negative feedback, you did nothing to try to persuade.  You did nothing to stabilize a failing component and you did nothing to redirect your critics to the secondary component.  When you sort-of-largely dropped the cult leader part and started just repeating the secondary portion, you did nothing to try to persuade.  You made the occasional statement to show you still were voting for TolyK, but kept to the background.  As days went by and nobody joined you, you did nothing to try to persuade.  Instead of trying to persuade us to lynch your target, you tell us that you're trying to persuade us to lynch your target.  Why?
Quote
Actually, here's a question for everybody: what is your read of TolyK, nyah? It seems to me that I'm the only one paying attention to him, nyah.
I'm cautious.  Not the most active, in part clearly due to being busy. What he does get in is focused on using his role, and he has given me reasons.  The impression I currently have is misprioritization more than malice.  Currently have a couple questions for him over there, as they involve material not yet public and I don't distrust him nearly enough to break privacy yet.
[8]: Is his lack of scumhunting not evidence enough, nyah? I did cite that in a case post, nyah. Do you not think a lack of scumhunting is scummy, nyah?
Are you defending your cult leader, nyah?  :P
I am aware of your point.  A lack of scumhunting can be scummy in many contexts (albeit not all), such as one where the player obviously has time but does little more than try to portray themself as a serious contributor and scumhunter.

I love the insinuation of ill intent, joking or not.  Why include that?
What does it matter, as long as I'm scumhunting, nyah?
Why do you put so much effort into announcing this and similar things?  Why is your self-portrayal so important?
Logged
Quote from: Pandarsenic, BYOR 6.3 deadchat
FUCK YOU JACK
Quote from: Urist Imiknorris, Witches' Coven 2 Elfchat
YOU TRAITOROUS SWINE.
Screw you, Jack.

webadict

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Re: BYOR 0 - Day 2: One Up, One Down, And One Nowhere Around
« Reply #880 on: June 14, 2017, 06:56:07 pm »

I also would like to know from Webadict if it's possible to have more than one win condition.
Sure.

Webadict: Please answer.  Also, are players allowed to screenshot portions of a quicktopic and post them here?
Absolutely not.
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Jack A T

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Re: BYOR 0 - Day 2: One Up, One Down, And One Nowhere Around
« Reply #881 on: June 14, 2017, 06:57:30 pm »

Webadict: Alright, thank you.  Also, as it was missed: If in one night two kill actions hit a player with a one-shot autorevive, what happens?
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Quote from: Pandarsenic, BYOR 6.3 deadchat
FUCK YOU JACK
Quote from: Urist Imiknorris, Witches' Coven 2 Elfchat
YOU TRAITOROUS SWINE.
Screw you, Jack.

flabort

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Re: BYOR 0 - Day 2: One Up, One Down, And One Nowhere Around
« Reply #882 on: June 14, 2017, 07:09:52 pm »

I don't think so.
Well, I'm currently suspecting Tiruin for not having ANY suspects more than I suspect you for the mafia avoiding your suspects, right now, actually, so I'm going to unvote you and vote her.
flabort: Alright.  It seemed like there were a few links missing: why them not killing one of the people I voted for makes me look suspicious, what makes it look like they actively avoided my suspects, and why this doesn't point at anyone else whose vote targets weren't nightkilled.  Can you clarify?
Well, it's less suspicious today than it would be tomorrow, hence me unvoting you for now, BUT, you had the most suspects and changed votes the most out of anyone day 1; as such, if you were scum, then you were spreading out "suspects" to look town, but then the scum killed one of your non-suspects so that you wouldn't have to come up with new fake-cases on the remaining suspects of yours - in fact, your fake suspects would look even more suspicious for having survived.
But then, it's still early in the game and probably too early for me to pull out that card. I was pretty much just jumping on the first thing I noticed about you and blowing it out of proportion while I looked for anything else suspicious.
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The Cyan Menace

Went away for a while, came back, went away for a while, and back for now.

webadict

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Re: BYOR 0 - Day 2: One Up, One Down, And One Nowhere Around
« Reply #883 on: June 14, 2017, 07:10:17 pm »

Webadict: Alright, thank you.  Also, as it was missed: If in one night two kill actions hit a player with a one-shot autorevive, what happens?
Revives will happen at the end, so both kills succeed, kill the player, and then the player revives. Assuming no other actions.
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webadict

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Re: BYOR 0 - Night 1: Hanging Out
« Reply #884 on: June 14, 2017, 07:16:57 pm »

fallacy
Error 404: Vote not found.

A few cricket begin to chirp. Night is coming soon.

Vote Count
------------------------
4maskwolf -
FallacyOfUrist - Jack A T, Persus13,
flabort - TolyK,
hector13 - Lenglon, TheBiggerFish,
Jack A T -
Lenglon-Shakerag - hector13,
Persus13 -
Tea -
TheBiggerFish -
TheDarkStar -
Tiruin - flabort,
TolyK - FallacyOfUrist,
No Lynch -

Not Voting - Shakerag, Tiruin, TheDarkStar,

Extend - Lenglon,

7 To Hammer. Day Ends on Thursday, June 15th around 8:00 PM CST. There is an Extension available.


Quote from: Current Rules
Survival - The Mafiakill does not count toward the 1 action per Phase limit.
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