Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

Glorious Arstotzka

17 (16%)

Glorious Moskurg

13 (12.3%)

Ingloriously Didn't Play

76 (71.7%)

Total Members Voted: 106

[Zanzetkuken The Great]

Make the Apocalypse have spaced armor and I'd definitely consider it.

How should I word that?

[Madman198237]

UF-HT-41 "Apocalypse"
A Heavy Tank, this monster utilizes a V12 engine, taken from the Haast.  It uses a 110mm gun with an autoloader as its primary armament mounted within a electronic traverse turret, with a desired minimum firing speed of ten rounds per minute and is also armed with a coaxial mounted AS-AC18 and a pintle mounted M3 Sorraia.  The turret is armored with 160mm of sloped Rolled Homogenous Armor, and while the main body is not armored to the same degree, it's frontal hull is still heavily armored with 120mm sloped RHA, has 80mm of armor upon the sides and rear hull, and has 40mm of armor in armored skirts protecting the base of the turret and the treads. All armor on the tank is spaced to an obscene degree, the goal being to render all known HEAT weapons ineffective. Also, all armor faces are sloped if at all feasible, leading to a squat pyramidal shape. Quite ugly, but effective.

[Zanzetkuken The Great]

-

How about this:

UF-HT-41 "Apocalypse" Pattern A
A Heavy Tank, this monster utilizes a V12 engine, taken from the Haast.  It uses a 110mm gun with an autoloader as its primary armament mounted within a electronic traversal turret, with a desired minimum firing speed of ten rounds per minute and is also armed with a coaxial mounted AS-AC18 and a pintle mounted M3 Sorraia.  The turret is armored with 175mm of sloped Rolled Homogenous Armor, and while the main body is not armored to the same degree, it's frontal hull is still heavily armored with 125mm sloped RHA, has 85mm of armor upon the sides and rear hull, and has 40mm of armor in armored skirts protecting the base of the turret and the treads.

UF-HT-41 "Apocalypse" Pattern B
A Heavy Tank, this monster utilizes a V12 engine, taken from the Haast.  It uses a 110mm gun as its primary armament mounted within a electronic traversal turret, with a desired minimum firing speed of eight rounds per minute and is also armed with a coaxial mounted AS-AC18 and a pintle mounted M3 Sorraia.  The turret is armored with 175mm of sloped Rolled Homogenous Armor, and while the main body is not armored to the same degree, it's frontal hull is still heavily armored with 125mm sloped RHA, has 85mm of armor upon the sides and rear hull, and has 40mm of armor in armored skirts protecting the base of the turret and the treads.  The outer 20mm of the armor is spaced off from the rest of the armor by a layer of 10mm of rubber, not included in total armor size, designed to absorb impacts and reduce damage.

UF-HT-41 "Apocalypse" Pattern C
A Heavy Tank, this monster utilizes a V12 engine, taken from the Haast.  It uses a 110mm gun as its primary armament mounted within a electronic traversal turret, with a desired minimum firing speed of eight rounds per minute and is also armed with a coaxial mounted AS-AC18 and a pintle mounted M3 Sorraia.  The turret is armored with 175mm of sloped Rolled Homogenous Armor, and while the main body is not armored to the same degree, it's frontal hull is still heavily armored with 125mm sloped RHA, has 85mm of armor upon the sides and rear hull, and has 40mm of armor in armored skirts protecting the base of the turret and the treads.

UF-HT-41 "Apocalypse" Pattern D
A Heavy Tank, this monster utilizes a V12 engine, taken from the Haast.  It uses a 130mm gun with an autoloader as its primary armament mounted within a electronic traversal turret, with a desired minimum firing speed of nine rounds per minute and is also armed with a coaxial mounted AS-AC18 and a pintle mounted M3 Sorraia.  The turret is armored with 175mm of sloped Rolled Homogenous Armor, and while the main body is not armored to the same degree, it's frontal hull is still heavily armored with 125mm sloped RHA, has 85mm of armor upon the sides and rear hull, and has 40mm of armor in armored skirts protecting the base of the turret and the treads.

UF-HT-41 "Apocalypse" Pattern E
A Heavy Tank, this monster utilizes a V12 engine, taken from the Haast.  It uses a 130mm gun as its primary armament mounted within a electronic traversal turret, with a desired minimum firing speed of seven rounds per minute and is also armed with a coaxial mounted AS-AC18 and a pintle mounted M3 Sorraia.  The turret is armored with 175mm of sloped Rolled Homogenous Armor, and while the main body is not armored to the same degree, it's frontal hull is still heavily armored with 125mm sloped RHA, has 85mm of armor upon the sides and rear hull, and has 40mm of armor in armored skirts protecting the base of the turret and the treads.  The outer 20mm of the armor is spaced off from the rest of the armor by a layer of 10mm of rubber, not included in total armor size, designed to absorb impacts and reduce damage.

UF-HT-41 "Apocalypse" Pattern F
A Heavy Tank, this monster utilizes a V12 engine, taken from the Haast.  It uses a 130mm gun as its primary armament mounted within a electronic traversal turret, with a desired minimum firing speed of seven rounds per minute and is also armed with a coaxial mounted AS-AC18 and a pintle mounted M3 Sorraia.  The turret is armored with 175mm of sloped Rolled Homogenous Armor, and while the main body is not armored to the same degree, it's frontal hull is still heavily armored with 125mm sloped RHA, has 85mm of armor upon the sides and rear hull, and has 40mm of armor in armored skirts protecting the base of the turret and the treads.


UF-HT-41 "Apocalypse" Pattern A
A Heavy Tank, this monster utilizes a V12 engine, taken from the Haast.  It uses a shortened B2 Destroyer with an autoloader as its primary armament mounted within a electronic traversal turret, with a desired minimum firing speed of ten rounds per minute and is also armed with a coaxial mounted AS-AC18 and a pintle mounted M3 Sorraia.  The turret is armored with 175mm of sloped Rolled Homogenous Armor, and while the main body is not armored to the same degree, it's frontal hull is still heavily armored with 125mm sloped RHA, has 85mm of armor upon the sides and rear hull, and has 40mm of armor in armored skirts protecting the base of the turret and the treads.

UF-HT-41 "Apocalypse" Pattern B
A Heavy Tank, this monster utilizes a V12 engine, taken from the Haast.  It uses a shortened B2 Destroyer as its primary armament mounted within a electronic traversal turret, with a desired minimum firing speed of eight rounds per minute and is also armed with a coaxial mounted AS-AC18 and a pintle mounted M3 Sorraia.  The turret is armored with 175mm of sloped Rolled Homogenous Armor, and while the main body is not armored to the same degree, it's frontal hull is still heavily armored with 125mm sloped RHA, has 85mm of armor upon the sides and rear hull, and has 40mm of armor in armored skirts protecting the base of the turret and the treads.  The outer 20mm of the armor is spaced off from the rest of the armor by a layer of 10mm of rubber, not included in total armor size, designed to absorb impacts and reduce damage.

UF-HT-41 "Apocalypse" Pattern I
A Heavy Tank, this monster utilizes a V12 engine, taken from the Haast.  It uses a shortened B2 Destroyer as its primary armament mounted within a electronic traversal turret, with a desired minimum firing speed of eight rounds per minute and is also armed with a coaxial mounted AS-AC18 and a pintle mounted M3 Sorraia.  The turret is armored with 175mm of sloped Rolled Homogenous Armor, and while the main body is not armored to the same degree, it's frontal hull is still heavily armored with 125mm sloped RHA, has 85mm of armor upon the sides and rear hull, and has 40mm of armor in armored skirts protecting the base of the turret and the treads.


Nixed the autoloader (and reduced rounds per minute), gave it NERA instead.  While it may not fire as fast, that plus its already thick armor should mean it will last a lot longer.  Misunderstood NERA.  Nixed it back to autoloader.

[Madman198237]

Seven rounds per minute is a good ROF for a 110 mm gun. Excellent.

Now, if only we could get the things onto Cannalan soil. Souped-up Forenian C-130, anyone?

[Light forger]

That thing likely weights at least 45-50 tons our current aircraft(which we can't make any bigger) can carry 13. We can't air transport any real tank, full stop.

[Zanzetkuken The Great]

Seven rounds per minute is a good ROF for a 110 mm gun. Excellent.

Now, if only we could get the things onto Cannalan soil. Souped-up Forenian C-130, anyone?

Could go for a Landing Craft - Tank.  Might be able to engineer one good enough to get T2s or T33s to shore, as well as large numbers of troops.

[Madman198237]

That was a joke.


However, with enough Forenian !!SCIENCE!!, anything is possible.

Theoretically, anyway.



_{Bad dum tssh Limp expense level jokes}

[RAM]

UF-AC41 "Annihilator"
A modern update of the quite old AS-AC18 autocannon with an improved rate of fire to 2700 rounds per minute through usage of technology developed over the twenty-two years the AC18 has been in service.

Huh? Even the an-94 only makes it to a theoretical 1800. 2700 sounds more like a multiple barrel configuration than a straight upgrade. I can't help but think that accuracy, brevity of travel-time, range, and penetration are more important features... I mean, sure, if we were building a big multibarrel setup for the Haast to go all thunderbolt II then I would understand. An insane rate of fire helps when you are sweeping your aeroplane's nose over a surface target, but I feel that we are more worried about defeating light armour and accurately hitting aeroplanes(Preferably while performing manoeuvres, but it is probably about time for air warfare to switch to high-speed low-manoeuvrability formation-tactics now so the agile dogfighter is probably only going to be a thing if we give it reason to be...) in flight. I mean, I am sure that we could make use out of it, but it just doesn't seem like the correct direction to move in unless there is some sort of plan afoot. Not to mention the ammunition concerns when a 2-second burst eats through a 50-round drum and asks for seconds...

I do not like the Apocalypse, it is too sane. Sanity is for the weak, your weakness shall doom us all.

So much sanity here, so much disappoint...

UF-SPT-39 "Earsplitter"
An antitank position on treads.

With the recent upgrade to enemy ordnance, it became apparent that weaponry will continue to escalate. We cannot abandon our tanks, so we must race to meet the enemy developments. I propose that we do so, but first, we ensure that we will never be caught completely unprepared. To do so, we must have a mobile unit of extreme armour and ordnance faculty. I propose:

A turret, of 120mm sloped forward armour, 10mm of steel at the front for hardness, 10 at the back for rigidity, and a 100mm slab of aluminium sandwiched in the middle to reduce weight. The other angles do not matter so much, but they need something... Two periscopes over two cylindrical holes for drum-jointed guns to seat. A pair of ammunition racks capable of holding at least three rounds each. And fully motorised rotation and elevation with an arc of at least 45 degrees with a reserve of battery power along with power connections to an absent base to recharge its batteries and convey control-commands from a pair of levers. Also a pair of slits at the back.

A Track with an armoured tank engine, multiple fuel-tanks, and ammunition conveyance. along with a generator to provide power to a turret. And two large caterpillar tracks(With odd holes at regular intervals) with a heavy steel bracing pillar running heir length and affixed to a large, heavily armoured platform at the front(held in place with six 100mm pipes and 200mm disk as the platform itself.).

A pair of 120mm cannons. With drum-joints by which to be hinged in a turret. shields towards the back to extend out the back of a turret and traverse up/down without exposing the innards, a loading gear to push the rounds to the back of the gun when loaded from a mid-point, and the ability to fire high-velocity penetrator rounds, though they will, for now, only be issued with snub-nosed high-explosive rounds with a low propellant volume for maximum damage against 'softer' targets and low wear until the kinks can be sorted out.

However, any and all of these considerations can be sacrificed for these final necessities:
All components must be capable of being air-lifted by the reckless effect and dropped from altitude. We predict this sets a maximum limit of 3 tonnes to account for support elements and safety margins.
Field assmeblable into a single unit, ideally by as few as two dozen men. We expect this to require numerous ropes and rings upon the items themselves, along with some clever tricks...

The assemblage process would start with a Track-unit being righted and driven to a turret-unit. The turret unit would be tipped onto its face and the tracks would drive up behind it. A pair of chocks would be inserted into the tracks and the turret would be pulled back onto the chocks, with a notch catching on them. The tracks would then be wheeled backwards,pulling the turret over its platform, at which point one final heave pulls it off of the chocks and it pulls backwards backwards while the turret finally rests in place. The guns are then pulled onto their ends and then lowered into place, again, this makes extensive use of attaching ropes to both ends, and obviously the entire top of the turret needs to open for this event. Obviously the turret's seam would have a pattern to prevent a perfect seam running straight through it.

It would be lack the combat mobility of a tank, or even tank-destroyer, but would be small enough to overcome some terrain disadvantages and hide in things like suburban garages. It's purpose would be to be under the authority of infantry units to provide heavy anti-armour support for defensive positions and ambushes. It would be extremely vulnerable to flanking attacks, but would hopefully be used in well fortified positions or used with the intention to overwhelm the enemy with surprise and thus if the retreat is xcalled everyone else is likely in just as much trouble... Its greatest strength would be to provide extreme stopping power to paratroops, provided it can be deployed to a relatively large area of relative security to be gathered and assembled.

1200 mm is very ambitious for air-drop so that will probably have to be abandoned, but I would really like me some extra-heavy front plating for long-term "don't come at my face"ness...

Looks something like this:

     _
____/ \_    {HHH}
    \_/[] []{HHH}
  0=0=0=0=0=0=0=0

With the front pod and engine being heavily armoured and the rest being sxposed and easily blowed up.

I really don't see any reason that we should bother with a tank-destroyer if it can't be dropped with the paratroops... But how you go about that is not my concern.

[Zanzetkuken The Great]

UF-AC41 "Annihilator"
A modern update of the quite old AS-AC18 autocannon with an improved rate of fire to 2700 rounds per minute through usage of technology developed over the twenty-two years the AC18 has been in service.

Huh? Even the an-94 only makes it to a theoretical 1800. 2700 sounds more like a multiple barrel configuration than a straight upgrade. I can't help but think that accuracy, brevity of travel-time, range, and penetration are more important features... I mean, sure, if we were building a big multibarrel setup for the Haast to go all thunderbolt II then I would understand. An insane rate of fire helps when you are sweeping your aeroplane's nose over a surface target, but I feel that we are more worried about defeating light armour and accurately hitting aeroplanes(Preferably while performing manoeuvres, but it is probably about time for air warfare to switch to high-speed low-manoeuvrability formation-tactics now so the agile dogfighter is probably only going to be a thing if we give it reason to be...) in flight. I mean, I am sure that we could make use out of it, but it just doesn't seem like the correct direction to move in unless there is some sort of plan afoot. Not to mention the ammunition concerns when a 2-second burst eats through a 50-round drum and asks for seconds...

Yeah, was thinking an autocannon setup, but then I've looked into some contemporaries.  Holy shit, most of those are far slower than ours, and in fact, looking over the Canalla setup, ours is still faster.  Theirs only looks faster because the setup uses two barrels, meaning for a fair analysis, we need to look at one of theirs vs two of ours, and we output 200 more rounds per minute than theirs does in that comparrison.

Hell, an upgrade of our single-barrel autocannons to a mere 1000 rounds per minute means we could output twice as much firepower as them in the same amount of time.

I do not like the Apocalypse, it is too sane. Sanity is for the weak, your weakness shall doom us all.
...
I really don't see any reason that we should bother with a tank-destroyer if it can't be dropped with the paratroops... But how you go about that is not my concern.

More recent designs shift towards a Heavy Tank utilizing NeRA.  Plus, look at your armor, then the ones I used.  Mine can live.

[Taricus]

Because it needs a big heavy rotating turret to hold its big cannon. That means it has a higher profile, so it's a bigger and more visible target, so it needs thicker armour. Because of all that extra weight it needs more motor, transmission, suspension, etc. So it is much more complex and expensive overall.

Tanks are much better on the offensive than tank destroyers, they are made for breaking through lines. They are equal at defending though. Seeing as we don't have a way to land with tanks, a tank destroyer would be the better option.

The best way to go about it would probably be to base it on the as-t33 chassis, like how our current one was based on the as-t25.

A tank destroyer would be useless. And I fail to see how a regular tank would be harder to develop when we're improving the characteristics of the 75mm gun rather than slapping on a larger gun. And we do have some leeway in how expensive it gets; so long as it's cheaper than the bull we've done alright. Furthermore we cannot be restricted into building designs that don't benefit us on the offensive

[Sheb]

I'll back a tank if it's made amphibious.

[Taricus]

We can't make an MBT fully amphibious; that's simply not possible. We can introduce fording equipment but that's it.

[andrea]

Fording equipment should be great, in the jungle.

but yes, it shall not float. if it floats, it is too light.

(and then, we will ford the ocean and invade cannala, rising from the deep!)

[Sheb]

We can't make an MBT fully amphibious; that's simply not possible. We can introduce fording equipment but that's it.

Not fully amphibious, but what about a flotation skirt like the DD tanks for landing.?

[Taricus]

We'd still need to get them onto the beach via lander in the first place. And in order to do that we need cruisers to escort them there in the first place.