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Glorious Arstotzka

17 (16%)

Glorious Moskurg

13 (12.3%)

Ingloriously Didn't Play

76 (71.7%)

Total Members Voted: 106

[andrea]

Anti Air Artillery.

[3_14159]

GET ON THE DISCORD.

I strongly disagree. Discord has some advantages (like faster communication) but has inherent disadvantages like increasing the obstacle to join this game or ephemeral communication.


Now, onto the glide bomb: I agree that a MCLOS weapon will always have several inherent problems.

• Unless guided through nose-mounted TV or something similar, the deploying aircraft has to fly straight and level to effectively guide it, making it vulnerable to attack. This has been noted as an issue with the Fritz X and the Hs 293 - strong anti-aircraft fire might force the bomber to abort the run.
• They are going to be vulnerable to electronic countermeasures, as again shown in operations against the Kehl-Straßburg Radio. Whether that's just jamming or sending bogus signals, it will greatly curtail their effectiveness. On the other hand, this can be avoided through wire-guidance, which was developed but not deployed for the Hs 293.
• Require a second operator for guidance.

However, their advantages (far better accuracy and range) might make them useful.

What I personally would prefer would be to design better radar beforehand, then deploy a Bat-clone (that is, a clone of the SWOD Mk 9, not something related to Batman) using our better radar. Fire-and-forget, more difficult to develop countermeasures to (but still easy-ish).

[evictedSaint]

Consider this:

We design the Deadliest Ray next turn.  It features:
1) Smaller - much, much smaller
2) Can be mounted on the Reckless
3) Can be mounted on ships and 300 mm guns without issue (possibly even fixing the revision)
4) Can be made into radar-fuses for flak and eventually missiles.

[Taricus]

The revision this turn is basically borked on the side of the computer, not the radar. And we need the cruiser first before we should try making a better RADAR.

[Sheb]

The revision this turn is basically borked on the side of the computer, not the radar. And we need the cruiser first before we should try making a better RADAR.

Battleship.

[andrea]

The revision this turn is basically borked on the side of the computer, not the radar. And we need the cruiser first before we should try making a better RADAR.

Battleship.

Torpedo boat/DD

[evictedSaint]

No more ships, please?  They are very much a field we can't catch up in, and the Victoria proved that.  It's completely giving up elsewhere and agreeing to play to Cannala's strengths.  The only reason we should be building a ship is if we've developed enough tech to put out something that out-classes what they already have - for example, a missile cruiser or a good submarine.  Building a regular cruiser or battleship is a losing fight.

[Taricus]

Battleship would be too hard to armour properly, and would also likely be too slow to keep pace with our carriers.

@Andrea, we don't need destroyers, we do already have one. And they aren't going to be surviving the larger cannon shots at any rate.

@Evicted: We cannot rely on carrier only fleets, they do need screen ships and we do need to have some presence at sea. We cannot be deterred from the sea whilst victory relies on having some measure of control of it. A missile cruiser or submarine is too complex for our shipbuilders, the munitions of the former and the hull of the latter are the biggest issues. A regular escort cruiser is the one thing we need for our carrier task forces.

[evictedSaint]

I strongly believe that putting out a cruiser will not change the naval advantage, nor would putting out another ship after that, nor another ship after that.  Cannala has a large head-start, and they have every advantage towards increasing and maintaining that lead.  It sucks that we don't have a decent fleet, but it strikes me as a "Sunk Cost Fallacy" to think "well, we just need one more ship to make our existing ships work" when it's been very clearly demonstrated that Cannala can easily keep us at arms length and mentioned that a naval advantage isn't needed to successfully land on an enemies shores.

[Taricus]

But it is needed to get a sizable number on the beach. Cannala may have a large head start but that doesn't preclude us from making a navy that can at least stand up to theirs.

[10ebbor10]

The Revision Phase is your opportunity to fix problems or make changes to your existing designs. This works like the design phase, but the changes you can make are smaller (see difficulty, below). You can also attempt to reverse-engineer enemy designs, if you have gained ground in a theatre where the design which you want to reverse-engineer was fought.

If we take ground at Sea, we can follow up next turn by stealing one of their designs with a revision.

That, I believe, is the only way we can gain a comparative advantage. Use 1 revision to steal a design.

Of course, that requires that we actually push the enemy back in the first place.

[Taricus]

A revision to steal one of their designs is still subject to a roll, and we can fail this. An espionage credit is needed if we want to ensure we've stolen something good.

[stabbymcstabstab]

Well we already have the same caliber gun as their new battleship, and something like that would make naval landings much easier and definitely screw with their naval advantage. and we could use a espionage credit to better effect elsewhere.

[evictedSaint]

According to sensei, stealing something through a revision requires we gain ground in that area.  It's subject to a roll, and then to actually produce it we need to spend the next revision on making it.  It's 2 revisions, both subject to rolls, and dependent on gaining ground.

Any advancement we make on the sea will be directly countered by Cannala doing the exact same thing next turn, only way better.  They've done it before multiple times.  We can't beat them at sea, and trying is a waste of actions.  What we can do is develop tech that will let us circumvent their advantage.  When we changed the nature of sea battles with a carrier, we made decent progress.  When we put out ship-detection radar to let us fight in the fog, we made progress.  When we made jet fighters when Cannala didn't have any, we made progress. 

Our strongest method of gaining an advantage is to change the nature of the combat.  A gun ship won't do that, and will likely not have any profound effect on the Naval Theatre.



Look at it this way: Cannala had a Massive Naval Advantage, and then put out a battleship.  If we put out a smaller, less-armed, less-armored ship, that won't suddenly knock them down an advantage level.  And then next turn they'll put out a new ship to directly counter our naval advancements, like they have twice before.

[10ebbor10]

According to sensei, stealing something through a revision requires we gain ground in that area.  It's subject to a roll, and then to actually produce it we need to spend the next revision on making it.  It's 2 revisions, both subject to rolls, and dependent on gaining ground

Okay, reverse engineering won't help us.