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Glorious Arstotzka

17 (16%)

Glorious Moskurg

13 (12.3%)

Ingloriously Didn't Play

76 (71.7%)

Total Members Voted: 106

[evictedSaint]

Blood Eagle probably needs another design to get it functional, we do NOT need more air power right now, we're still winning in the air.

Right now, destroying the Cannalan NV system will obsolete a design of theirs, and lead to us destroying them in nighttime combat.

Probably will also help at sea, until we revise/design night-fighting equipment LIKE A BETTER RADAR. *Ahem*.

We are winning in the air, but not at sea.

At sea, we use air power, but it's never been effective because our launchers are too ineffective and our aircraft keep getting damaged.  Our strength is air power but we've never been able to fully apply it - ever. The Z overhaul fixes that.

[Funk]

Part of me whant us to make a bolter, get the small armss race in the bag once and for all.

[Jilladilla]

We are winning in the air, but not at sea.

At sea, we use air power, but it's never been effective because our launchers are too ineffective and our aircraft keep getting damaged.  Our strength is air power but we've never been able to fully apply it - ever. The Z overhaul fixes that.

Except it removes the rocketpult.... If nothing else, what exactly is preventing us from just installing one up top? Where the mass of smoke would cause little issue with carrier operations due to having the excellent ventilation system that is called being outside? And this way, we'd have two rocketpults, yes even if the one is a bit bad due to excess smoke and poor ventilation, the top one wouldn't be, and we'd get much better launch rates, would we not?

[Madman198237]

Steam catapults are superior.

That's all there is to be said---there's no reloading except for cranking the thing back to position, there's no smoke, and no silly FLAMES on a warship (Come on now, don't you people learn ANYTHING about naval warfare? You do NOT start fires voluntarily around aircraft loaded with ship-killing ordinance).

[10ebbor10]

The supernova shell will not obsolete the enemy IR system.

In ambushes, their aswang is superior. During reconnaissance, their Aswang is superior. Only during a long and prolonged engagement will we have sufficient time to call up the artillery and have them fire the shells. And that renders our artillery very vulnerable to counterbattery fire. Oh, and if there's anything that obscures the sky (like say, the trees of the jungle), then our weapon is useless.

[Madman198237]

How does it render the artillery vulnerable? The shell bursts into a brilliant white flame LONG after leaving the gun.

We can have just a couple of guns set to light up vulnerable areas with starshell, no need for the whole battery to light it up.

You overestimate the effects of jungle coverage---if you can see through it, you can light it up from above. Even if they're using IR systems, we can still put out enough star shells to see as well as they can.

[evictedSaint]

You overestimate the effect of the flares.  The only sufficient counter would be NV of our own.  A flare is a bandaid fix, not a real solution.

[andrea]

if we light up our vulnerbale areas frequently, won't we have made enemy IR irrelevant, by virtue of broadcasting our positions to anyone with eyes within several kilometers?

[Madman198237]

Alright, so, here's what happens: Night, you get attacked. Gunshots go off, you can't see the enemies. Position is radioed to artillery units, who fire off one or two shells, which light up over the area the enemy is already engaged in.

Now, you can see better than you could before, and you have more troops than the presumably-limited numbers of marksmen equipped with such scopes.

[evictedSaint]

Alright, so, here's what happens: Night, you get attacked. Gunshots go off, you can't see the enemies. Position is radioed to artillery units, who fire off one or two shells, which light up over the area the enemy is already engaged in.

Now, you can see better than you could before, and you have more troops than the presumably-limited numbers of marksmen equipped with such scopes.

Then the enemy pulls off their own NV to continue fighting, or just pulls back.

Not a real solution, imho.  Bumping our navy is a better advantage.  As long as we're behind in the navy we'll always be on the back foot - based on what we've seen so far, whoever has the naval advantage will be able to run rough-shod over the parts of the map that matter.  Even on the northern island where the navy is supposed to matter less we get reports that read "their shore bombardment still has an effect".

[Madman198237]

Yes, they continue fighting, but their special-forces engagement has just turned into a general brawl, and the only advantage their SpecOps brought was night vision on top of a mediocre rifle.

Oops, now we win the battle.

Also, this opens the door to general-forces night operations, where it's not just special operations, but an entire nighttime assault.

[10ebbor10]

Yup, if we can just break the enemy's naval advantage, we can finally start moving forward in the islands.

Yes, they continue fighting, but their special-forces engagement has just turned into a general brawl, and the only advantage their SpecOps brought was night vision on top of a mediocre rifle.

Oops, now we win the battle.

Also, this opens the door to general-forces night operations, where it's not just special operations, but an entire nighttime assault.

Or they retreat, because it takes an enormously long time to find the radio guy, wake up the artillery folks, get the targets dialed in, and then fire the flares. By the time we got that done, the enemy has already done their ambush and moved back.

In any case, strategically we do not need the flare revision

In the upper path, we are winning in the Jungle.
In the middle path, we lost in the Jungle due to an IR assault.
In the bottom path, we failed a naval assault
In the navy, we have a disadvantage

The flare revision appears tailored to the Middle path. However, we gain nothing from pushing back the enemy there. There's no resources to be lost, claimed or denied.

Meanwhile, with the Navy we get a significant bonus on all 4 paths.

[Taricus]

3 - UF-BID-41 Supernova: NAV, Madman, Jilladilla
5 - Z-Carrier Overhaul: 10ebbor10, evictedSaint, Stabby, Powder Miner, Taricus
3 - Blood Eagle Repairs: RAM, Piratejoe, Kashyyk
0 - UF-RAC-42 "Martial Eagle":

[Zanzetkuken The Great]

UF-S-IR-42 "Eagle Sight Mk.III" - A variant of the Eagle Rifle sight designed to see in Infrared to passively watch for the vision lines of Canalla's active infrared system.

UF-B-IR-42 "Overwatch" - A pair of binoculars modified to passively view in Infrared to watch for the vision cones of Canalla's active infrared system.


Leaving out the lamp as it would make things more complex, and just getting passive detection would allow us to counter their nightvision to a degree.  While their cone only goes out 100 meters, that cone could be seen over a far greater area.

[10ebbor10]

Yeah, something tells me we're not going to get infrared on a revision.