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Glorious Arstotzka

17 (16%)

Glorious Moskurg

13 (12.3%)

Ingloriously Didn't Play

76 (71.7%)

Total Members Voted: 106

[Parsely]

-especially as we don't have screening ships or floatplanes to warn of enemy forces in the vicinity.

A carrier has fighters that it can use as a scouting force. A CV would have been pretty capable on it's own, especially with the ability to intercept enemy communications. Now we've got a good destroyer, but it's undergunned and will get torn to shreds by the bigger and harder hitting enemy ships out there. A destroyer is pointless without another ship to escort. A CV would have been just as vulnerable while contributing more to the fight.

[evictedSaint]

I agree, Gunin, but we can't argue over what we should have done.  We can only argue over what we shoud do nw.

CV should be our next design.

[Azzuro]

-especially as we don't have screening ships or floatplanes to warn of enemy forces in the vicinity.

A carrier has fighters that it can use as a scouting force. A CV would have been pretty capable on it's own, especially with the ability to intercept enemy communications. Now we've got a good destroyer, but it's undergunned and will get torn to shreds by the bigger and harder hitting enemy ships out there. A destroyer is pointless without another ship to escort. A CV would have been just as vulnerable while contributing more to the fight.

This is incorrect. Carriers of this period did not use their fighters for scouting, as their range, endurance and flight characteristics were nowhere near suited to the naval reconnaissance role, not to mention that doing so would severely comprise its CAP cover in case of attack. In fact, the main bulk of airborne naval reconnaissance was done by Kot's beloved floatplanes and flying boats, which were not quite so fatally bound to their fuel endurance.

And screening ships are much better than planes in serving as early warning. For one, they don't consume fuel merely to stay in the air, thus the carrier's air wing need not run their supplies low, enhancing their effectiveness and mission capability. They can also continue providing cover at night, while carrier operations of this period are limited to daylight.

Don't get me wrong, I too want carriers. In fact, I want carriers so much that I'd like to get some naval design experience in, so we can get better results on our designs, instead of jumping straight to carriers when our only other ship is a cargo ship with a field artillery gun on it.

[andrea]

speaking about scouting, our HF-32 fighter can mount drop tanks for extended range. Not ideal scouting, but can help I guess.

[Zanzetkuken The Great]

speaking about scouting, our HF-32 fighter can mount drop tanks for extended range. Not ideal scouting, but can help I guess.

Plus, thanks to the additional oil we got, mounting the drop tanks doesn't make them very expensive anymore.

Interesting to note: If we get our transport capacity high enough, then if we fully capture the Northern Jungle after grabbing the British Island, then the ARAC drops form National Effort to Very Expensive as well.  We would need to reduce the naval advantage they have and build a bigger transport, but it is a possibility.

Edit: Hey, I thought of a way to help quell the riots.  Anyone good at writing a speech for the Prime Minister (or whatever we have) that they can give that would lambast the Canallans and call for all Forenians to unite to destroy this foe?

[Powder Miner]

no fascism reeeeeeeeeeeeee

[Zanzetkuken The Great]

no fascism reeeeeeeeeeeeee

Nah, not Fascism.  I'm aiming for a Communist Republic that actually is a republic rather than a thinly veiled dictatorship.

[Powder Miner]

>communist
>democratic
m-muh Hayek

[Taricus]

No communism reeeeeeee. (Syndicalism is okay though )

[NUKE9.13]

Edit: Hey, I thought of a way to help quell the riots.  Anyone good at writing a speech for the Prime Minister (or whatever we have) that they can give that would lambast the Canallans and call for all Forenians to unite to destroy this foe?

"My fellow Forenians. As you may have noticed, we are at war. This is glorious news! For it is a just war we fight, against a truly monstrous foe. The lawless, greedy, and merciless Cannalan Dictatorship has set its sights on the continent we all love.
Now look. I'm a regular guy, just like you. I feel the urge to fight someone every day- we all do. We're Forenians, it's in our blood. So rejoice, for we can now spend our ferocious energy against a true foe, who menaces us all. I urge everyone who wants to fight to sign up to the army- we'll take anyone we can get!
*whisper*
We'll take only the best! Which no doubt includes YOU! GOYRL and Honour await!"

I'm not great at speeches. :/

[Zanzetkuken The Great]

I'm not great at speeches. :/

Give me a few minutes.  I got an idea...

[Zanzetkuken The Great]

Here's what I got:

Fellow citizens of the United Forenia, we stand at the precipice of one of the most important battles of our nation.  Less than three years ago, we became united under one banner under our own will.  Yet, in this young state, we already face a threat determined to crush our nation.

If these Canallans were to win this war, we would be placed under a subjugation far worse than how we suffered under the British Empire.  Look to the former citizens of Juraki.  Once their nation had fallen, the Canallans had made them little better than slaves to their new rulers!  If these barbarians were to win this war, then this same fate would be forced upon us all.

Some are saying to look to the past, thinking the old nations might somehow save us.  I say, look further back!  When the British came, we were divided and we fell!  It was only through our united resolve that we had been able to force out our subjugators before!  The lesson is clear.  If we fight among ourselves at this critical juncture, we will fall.  It is only by all citizens united against this foe that our victory will be gained!

Glory to United Forenia!

[Azzuro]

Edit: Hey, I thought of a way to help quell the riots.  Anyone good at writing a speech for the Prime Minister (or whatever we have) that they can give that would lambast the Canallans and call for all Forenians to unite to destroy this foe?

Portion of a speech by the Prime Minister of United Forenia, 14th January 1938

My fellow Forenians, this day the war against Cannala has begun. As I speak, Cannalan planes are flying across the Zhuyev Archipelago, Cannalan troops are marching out of the Kader Jungle, and Cannalan cruisers are steaming for Emilovich Island. Between us lies two thousand kilometres of ocean and isle, and before us stands the full arsenal of the continent island-nation of Cannala, turned to the task of transcontinental conquest. Already, the dishonourable Cannalans have struck an underhanded blow against our fair Forenia!

I will not lie to you, this war will not be won by winter. It will not be won this time next year, and it will not be won the year after. It will be won when our planes bomb their capital, when our ships shell their capitol, and when our soldiers storm their streets and decapitate every last Cannalan! That is the victory we must be resolved to achieve, the day Cowardly Cannala attacked us by surprise!

These coming weeks, these coming months, these coming years all promise a revolution in the conduct of war. The Cannalan battleships which shelled our capital have gone down in history for conducting the world's longest transoceanic raid; now it falls to us to win, and write the rest of that history. The rest of the world waits with bated breath to witness how land, air and sea power may converge to victory across the wide expanse of ocean, and it is upon us to show them. In this, the tireless efforts of our researchers, engineers and designers is paramount, and I have every confidence that their innovation, intelligence and ingenuity will give United Forenia the weapons she needs to triumph.

But our greatest advantage over Cannala is not one that was invented. It is not a vehicle driven, which may be disabled, nor a weapon wielded, which may be wrestled away, nor a bullet fired, which may be armoured against. It is a power that Cannala cannot comprehend. It is a strength that every last man and woman with a Forenian flag upon their breast may draw on, and one that no one save ourselves may relinquish. It is one that is in the very name of our glorious nation. It is unity!

Today, our children learn to sing the anthem of United Forenia, of which Moskurg and Arstotzka are two parts that form a greater whole. I do not ask that these two storied identities be forgotten to history - only that Forenia must come first if we are to prevail. Already our continental union has borne fruit - the plains, mountains and jungles of our bountiful continent are settled and cultivated in peace, unhindered by battles and borders for the first time in centuries, ushering in a new age of prosperity and plenty. We draw our strength from the unity of north and south, rather than waste it in fruitless battle against our brothers. No such mindset exists in Cannala - even the name of their worthless nation speaks of the dominance of one over the other! Where else exists the Juraki Shogunate, but in the minds of an underclass of Cannalans forced to toil on the sugar plantations and in the rum factories? Will they take up arms against our righteous soldiers when we land on the Cannalan beaches? Or will they take up arms against the pirates who conquered them by force, and fight alongside a similarly aggrieved people for their freedom? The Cannalans showed no mercy to the Juraki, and neither will they be accepting of Arstotzkan or Moskurgite - only Forenia united can prevail against their dreams of intercontinental conquest and assimilation!

I do not pretend that the detritus of our violent history will be washed away solely by the tears of the war widows, weeping for the victims of the New Year's Eve attack. I only hope that the sweat of Forenian soldiers slogging through the Kader Jungle and the blood of Forenian sailors split in the waters of the Zhuyev islands will be enough to write a new page in our history - the name of United Forenia!

United by fire, united by strife, United Forenia shall survive!

*cue epic rendition of United Forenia's national anthem*


Why is Cannala named Cannala, and not Turbados or Turbobarbarians or whatever? Anyway, forgive any tense mix-ups, it's getting late on my side. I was going for a Churchillian feel to this, but I'm out of practice.

EDIT: Ninja'd! You can try adding ours together somehow.

Edited, original version is quoted by Zanzetkuken below if you want to see it.

[NUKE9.13]

I think we should be more subtle about the message "Forget about Arstotzka and Moskurg, be Forenian!" Being too overt is liable to upset hardcore nationalists further.

For example, let's not relegate the names of the proud, glorious states of Arstotzka and Moskurg to the history books. Yes on the pointing out that Cannala has repressed the Juraki- so let's be better than them, and not do the same.

[Zanzetkuken The Great]

May want to put a horizontal rule after the United Forenia National Anthem line.

Spoiler: Few thoughts (click to show/hide)

Portion of a speech by the Prime Minister of United Forenia, 14th January 1938

Probably want to set it up at the end of Summer rather than the beginning of the year.  A speech at the beginning of the year won't affect the rioters.

My fellow Forenians, this day the war against Cannala has begun. As I speak, Cannalan planes are flying across the Zhuyev Archipelago, Cannalan troops are marching out of the Kader Jungle, and Cannalan cruisers are steaming for Emilovich Island. Between us lies five thousand kilometres of ocean and isle, and before us stands the full arsenal of the continent island-nation of Cannala, turned to the task of transcontinental conquest. Already, the dishonourable Cannalans have struck an underhanded blow against our fair Forenia!

There's a few people that seem to recall Sensei had said the islands were roughly the size of New Zealand, so 'five thousand kilometers' is probably a bit much.

I will not lie to you, this war will not be won by winter. It will not be won this time next year, and it will not be won the year after. It will <be> won when our planes bomb their capital, when our ships shell their capitol, and when our soldiers storm their streets and decapitate every last Cannalan! That is the victory we resolved to achieve, the day Cowardly Cannala attacked us by surprise!

'That is the victory we must be resolved to achieve' may be better.

These coming weeks, these coming months, these coming years all promise a revolution in the conduct of war. The Cannalan battleships which shelled our capital have gone down in history for conducting the world's longest transoceanic raid; now it falls to us to win, and write the rest of that history. The rest of the world waits with bated breath to witness how air, land and sea power may converge to victory across the wide expanse of ocean, and it is upon us to show them. In this, the tireless efforts of our researchers, engineers and designers is paramount, and I have every confidence that their innovation, intelligence and ingenuity will give United Forenia the weapons she needs to triumph.

The commentary upon 'how land, air, and sea power may converge' seems a bit weird, as it seem to imply that that type of warfare has never been done before, which is false.

But our greatest advantage over Cannala is not one that was invented. It is not a vehicle driven, which may be disabled, nor a weapon wielded, which may be wrestled away, nor a bullet fired, which may be armoured against. It is a strength that every last man and woman with a Forenian flag upon their breast may draw on, and one that no one save ourselves may relinquish. It is one that is in the very name of our glorious nation. It is unity!

Seems a bit distracting from the grand nature the speech should direct towards.

Generations of Moskurgites and Arstotzkans fought and died in the fires of war that forged our modern nation, yet they too would scarcely comprehend the magnitude of the victory we won three years ago. Today, our children learn to sing the anthem of United Forenia, while Moskurg and Arstotzka are mentioned only in history classes. We draw our strength from the unity of north and south, rather than waste it in fruitless battle against our brothers. No such mindset exists in Cannala - even the name of their worthless nation speaks of the dominance of one over the other! Where else exists the Juraki Shogunate, but in the minds of an underclass of Cannalans forced to toil on the sugar plantations and in the rum factories? Will they take up arms against our righteous soldiers when we land on the Cannalan beaches? Or will they take up arms against the pirates who conquered them by force, and fight alongside a similarly aggrieved people for their freedom?

May want to adjust the first few lines.  That'll probably piss off the nationalists even more.

I do not pretend that the detritus of our violent history will be washed away solely by the tears of the war widows, weeping for the victims of the New Year's Eve attack. I only hope that the sweat of Forenian soldiers slogging through the Kader Jungle and the blood of Forenian sailors split in the waters of the Zhuyev islands will be enough to write a new page in our history - the name of United Forenia! United by fire, united by strife, United Forenia shall survive!

Seems to be a pretty good ending to the speech, in my opinion, though maybe remove the ' - the name of United Forenia' and send the part after to its own section.

I think we should be more subtle about the message "Forget about Arstotzka and Moskurg, be Forenian!" Being too overt is liable to upset hardcore nationalists further.

That's why I largely went the route of being nonspecific with 'citizens of United Forenia'.  Granted, we may want something shorter afterwards to prevent getting stuck in repetition and making it obvious.