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Author Topic: Modded secrets not spreading?  (Read 949 times)

uristjack

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Modded secrets not spreading?
« on: April 09, 2017, 02:54:29 am »
So I've created several secret interactions. And, funny thing, they all spread in my world.

Except for one. And I don't know why.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

So there's a secret with two interactions - one being to shoot iceballs and the other being to create water golems from corpses. I've also included the water golem raws in case that's why.

Oddly enough, the secrets of water work just fine in Arena mode, but in every genned world there are never any. All my other modded secrets work just fine (fire, wealth, war) but this one doesn't.
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D_E

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Re: Modded secrets not spreading?
« Reply #1 on: April 09, 2017, 08:25:43 am »
You can double-check to make sure that there are gods capable of teaching your secret by doing an xml dump and looking for the secret ID (SECRET_WATER) in the resulting file (for this, you can just use a text viewing program.  It'll look funky but you should be able to understand it).

(One thing you will find is that some forgotten beasts and megabeasts are listed as being able to teach secrets.  They never actually do so, so you'll need to skip past them and look for gods with the secret)
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Mods I've done:
Zelda mod-mod, Beta in the Wild DF 47.04
Illithid Empire mod DF 31.25 (update canceled)
Spotter's Guide to Illithids (Genesis mod-mod) genesis 3.19a4 (update canceled)

Shub-Nullgurath

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Re: Modded secrets not spreading?
« Reply #2 on: April 09, 2017, 08:57:50 am »
Quote from: D_E on April 09, 2017, 08:25:43 am
(One thing you will find is that some forgotten beasts and megabeasts are listed as being able to teach secrets.  They never actually do so, so you'll need to skip past them and look for gods with the secret)

Wait, megabeasts don't teach secrets?
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uristjack

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Re: Modded secrets not spreading?
« Reply #3 on: April 09, 2017, 10:01:25 am »
Quote from: D_E on April 09, 2017, 08:25:43 am
You can double-check to make sure that there are gods capable of teaching your secret by doing an xml dump and looking for the secret ID (SECRET_WATER) in the resulting file (for this, you can just use a text viewing program.  It'll look funky but you should be able to understand it).

(One thing you will find is that some forgotten beasts and megabeasts are listed as being able to teach secrets.  They never actually do so, so you'll need to skip past them and look for gods with the secret)

Ah. I thought that with MUNDANE_RESEARCH_POSSIBLE they didn't need gods/goddesses to teach their secrets? So maybe I've just been really unlucky then I guess - my only SECRET_WATER knowers appear to be megabeasts.

And why don't megabeasts teach secrets?

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D_E

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Re: Modded secrets not spreading?
« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2017, 10:24:51 am »
Quote from: Shub-Nullgurath on April 09, 2017, 08:57:50 am
Quote from: D_E on April 09, 2017, 08:25:43 am
(One thing you will find is that some forgotten beasts and megabeasts are listed as being able to teach secrets.  They never actually do so, so you'll need to skip past them and look for gods with the secret)

Wait, megabeasts don't teach secrets?

Um, I don't THINK they do?  Based on the wiki's description, though, I could very well be wrong about that!
Quote from: uristjack on April 09, 2017, 10:01:25 am
Ah. I thought that with MUNDANE_RESEARCH_POSSIBLE they didn't need gods/goddesses to teach their secrets? So maybe I've just been really unlucky then I guess - my only SECRET_WATER knowers appear to be megabeasts.

Note that it is PROBABLY the case that there are relationships between spheres, and that the fire sphere probably precludes the water sphere.  So if you've been seeing lots of fire mages, it may indicate that for whatever reason your entities favor fire gods, thereby preventing any gods from being generated that can teach the water secret. (Link to the old 40d sphere relationships page, which is believed to still be in effect in the current version: http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/40d:Sphere)

If megabeasts CAN teach secrets, you may have just been getting unlucky, since I think people need to be near a megabeast's lair before they can start worshiping it?

Either way, try increasing the number of spheres that can teach your water secret, and see if that causes it to show up.

EDIT: I've never seen someone discover a secret without divine aid.  I think that may not be implemented yet?
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Mods I've done:
Zelda mod-mod, Beta in the Wild DF 47.04
Illithid Empire mod DF 31.25 (update canceled)
Spotter's Guide to Illithids (Genesis mod-mod) genesis 3.19a4 (update canceled)

Max™

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Re: Modded secrets not spreading?
« Reply #5 on: April 10, 2017, 01:43:52 am »
Anything with [CAN_LEARN] and [POWER]+[SUPERNATURAL] can teach secrets, my intelligent dragons, steel colossi, giants, minotaurs, and ancient masters (a goblin based creature variation) do so regularly.
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D_E

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Re: Modded secrets not spreading?
« Reply #6 on: April 10, 2017, 07:35:30 am »
Quote from: Max™ on April 10, 2017, 01:43:52 am
Anything with [CAN_LEARN] and [POWER]+[SUPERNATURAL] can teach secrets, my intelligent dragons, steel colossi, giants, minotaurs, and ancient masters (a goblin based creature variation) do so regularly.

Ah, and the vanilla megabeasts seem to lack... all three of those tokens (they really don't even have SUPERNATURAL ????), which would explain why uristjack's don't seem to be teaching anyone his secret (and also why I didn't know about it either :D)
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Mods I've done:
Zelda mod-mod, Beta in the Wild DF 47.04
Illithid Empire mod DF 31.25 (update canceled)
Spotter's Guide to Illithids (Genesis mod-mod) genesis 3.19a4 (update canceled)

Max™

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Re: Modded secrets not spreading?
« Reply #7 on: April 10, 2017, 09:19:42 pm »
Yup, they were remnants from the old demon masters who would pretend to be deities, which sounded awesome so I latched onto them.
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D_E

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Re: Modded secrets not spreading?
« Reply #8 on: April 17, 2017, 09:28:49 pm »
Quote from: Max™ on April 10, 2017, 01:43:52 am
Anything with [CAN_LEARN] and [POWER]+[SUPERNATURAL] can teach secrets, my intelligent dragons, steel colossi, giants, minotaurs, and ancient masters (a goblin based creature variation) do so regularly.

Have you posted your mod anywhere?  I can't get megabeast-spread secrets to work.

How frequent would you say it is?  Do you think it would take a lot of eligible megabeasts before I had a decent chance of seeing it happen?
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Mods I've done:
Zelda mod-mod, Beta in the Wild DF 47.04
Illithid Empire mod DF 31.25 (update canceled)
Spotter's Guide to Illithids (Genesis mod-mod) genesis 3.19a4 (update canceled)