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Author Topic: Wands Race - [Arstotzka] {COMPLETED}  (Read 394738 times)

andrea

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Re: Wands Race - [Arstotzka]
« Reply #930 on: April 26, 2017, 05:25:46 pm »

a reason we don't want to destroy the jungle is that we want to design new ships, and holding jungle makes the cheaper.

Roboson

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Re: Wands Race - [Arstotzka]
« Reply #931 on: April 26, 2017, 05:39:50 pm »

Ok but seriously, hear me out.

Revised bomb arrows:
We revise our bomb arrows to take several times the amount of magic required to cause them to explode. This causes them to hold significantly much more magic and do not explode immediately upon being exposed to magic. Instead, they charge up on continuous magic near them until they explode with incredible power. This makes them (relatively) safe for our mage hunters to use. The intention is to lodge the arrows near the enemy mages where their anti-magic and wind magic channel-style spells will charge the arrows until they explode violently.


If we make them require immense amounts of magic, then they won't get very charged by our mages, but they will explode near enemy mages that must continuously cast their spells. Plus, they may do more damage.
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Chiefwaffles

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Re: Wands Race - [Arstotzka]
« Reply #932 on: April 26, 2017, 05:46:49 pm »

Relevant idea for a future design:
Anti-magic mines.
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Quote from: RAM
You should really look to the wilderness for your stealth ideas, it has been doing it much longer than you have after all. Take squids for example, that ink trick works pretty well, and in water too! So you just sneak into the dam upsteam, dump several megatons of distressed squid into it, then break the dam. Boom, you suddenly have enough water-proof stealth for a whole city!

Tyrant Leviathan

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Re: Wands Race - [Arstotzka]
« Reply #933 on: April 26, 2017, 05:50:38 pm »

Good things said. Keeping vote though but if one wants to make revision for our Bomb arrows more power to you guys. As I am all for either one.

stabbymcstabstab

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Re: Wands Race - [Arstotzka]
« Reply #934 on: April 26, 2017, 06:11:30 pm »

I don't think revising th bomb arrows will be worth it right now, since we don't know if it's actually going to be a major issue or not.
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Long Live Arst- United Forenia!
"Wanna be a better liberal? Go get shot in the fuckin' face."
Contemplate why we have a sociopathic necrophiliac RAPIST sadomasochist bipolar monster in our ranks, also find some cheese.

Chiefwaffles

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Re: Wands Race - [Arstotzka]
« Reply #935 on: April 26, 2017, 06:16:13 pm »

Also, -1 to not using anti magic arrow order.
Preeetty sure their wind can't make our arrows perform 180 degree turns. When only an elite specialized unit is using them, friendly fire should be a non-issue.
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Quote from: RAM
You should really look to the wilderness for your stealth ideas, it has been doing it much longer than you have after all. Take squids for example, that ink trick works pretty well, and in water too! So you just sneak into the dam upsteam, dump several megatons of distressed squid into it, then break the dam. Boom, you suddenly have enough water-proof stealth for a whole city!

andrea

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Re: Wands Race - [Arstotzka]
« Reply #936 on: April 26, 2017, 06:23:49 pm »

Also, -1 to not using anti magic arrow order.
Preeetty sure their wind can't make our arrows perform 180 degree turns. When only an elite specialized unit is using them, friendly fire should be a non-issue.

agreed. lets try them first. If they truly prove to be death traps, our soldiers will stop using them anyway.

Azzuro

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Re: Wands Race - [Arstotzka]
« Reply #937 on: April 26, 2017, 06:34:41 pm »

Yeah, I'm kinda bummed that with a 6 for effectiveness and 5 for bugs, we got an arrow that can't penetrate armour or shields (don't forget that Moskurg armour, even the new one, is still inferior to ours in terms of protection), and has a major bug that makes it unusable.

+1 to not using anti-magic arrows
As it stands, just one unlucky gust of wind (not even a lightning strike) would likely be fatal for any archer carrying these, along with their squad. It's not that wind magic may turn them back upon us, but rather than the mere presence of enemy magic will make them explode in the quiver.

Revision: Magically Shielded Quivers
With the experience we've gained in making the anti-magic quartz, incorporate an anti-magic charm into the quivers of archers carrying the new arrows, ideally next to the arrowheads. This prevents the antimagic arrows from cooking off prematurely, while the warming of the anti-magic charm warns the archers of magic in the vicinity.

Quote from: Revisions
Powerful Streamlined Fireball : 3, stabby, 10ebbor10, Azzuro
Dragon's Fireball: 0
Study Staff Material: 0
Micro Fireball: 0
Anti-Anti Magic Amulet: 0
Improved Normal Arrows: 0
Bomb Arrowhead Molds: 0
Literal Anti-Magic Arrows: 0
Magically Shielded Quivers: 0

Oh, and vote for what to do about the trader!

Quote from: Trader?
Sell him the fireball wand: 1, Azzuro
Seize his ship: 0
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United Forenia Forever!

FallacyofUrist

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Re: Wands Race - [Arstotzka]
« Reply #938 on: April 26, 2017, 06:37:50 pm »

+1 to not using anti-magic arrows
As it stands, just one unlucky gust of wind (not even a lightning strike) would likely be fatal for any archer carrying these, along with their squad. It's not that wind magic may turn them back upon us, but rather than the mere presence of enemy magic will make them explode in the quiver.

Revision: Magically Shielded Quivers
With the experience we've gained in making the anti-magic quartz, incorporate an anti-magic charm into the quivers of archers carrying the new arrows, ideally next to the arrowheads. This prevents the antimagic arrows from cooking off prematurely, while the warming of the anti-magic charm warns the archers of magic in the vicinity.
Our mage hunters are already using anti-magic amulets. I don't think wind magic would work against them, or near them...
~~~
Quote from: Trader
Sell him fireball wand: 1, Azzuro
Sell him steam engine: 1, FallacyofUrist
Seize his ship: 0
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FoU has some twisted role ideas. Screw second-guessing this mechanical garbage spaghetti, I'm basing everything on reads and visible daytime behaviour.

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Chiefwaffles

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Re: Wands Race - [Arstotzka]
« Reply #939 on: April 26, 2017, 06:43:05 pm »

What Fallacy said. Our anti-mages shouldn't be having problems.
1.) Anti-magic charms.
2.) They're not stupid.
3.) Again, wind should almost certainly not make arrows perform 180 degree turns. Like, it shouldn't happen at all. Not "most of the time it won't happen".
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Quote from: RAM
You should really look to the wilderness for your stealth ideas, it has been doing it much longer than you have after all. Take squids for example, that ink trick works pretty well, and in water too! So you just sneak into the dam upsteam, dump several megatons of distressed squid into it, then break the dam. Boom, you suddenly have enough water-proof stealth for a whole city!

stabbymcstabstab

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Re: Wands Race - [Arstotzka]
« Reply #940 on: April 26, 2017, 07:07:53 pm »

Quote from: Trader
Sell him fireball wand: 1, Azzuro
Sell him steam engine: 2, FallacyofUrist, Stabby
Seize his ship: 0

We kinda need to go steam engine since don't we only have one fireball wand? that and we can sell the point that the steam engine is not only useable without years of magically training that has... low survival percentage to say the least and we have a academy to train them.
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Long Live Arst- United Forenia!
"Wanna be a better liberal? Go get shot in the fuckin' face."
Contemplate why we have a sociopathic necrophiliac RAPIST sadomasochist bipolar monster in our ranks, also find some cheese.

evictedSaint

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Re: Wands Race - [Arstotzka]
« Reply #941 on: April 26, 2017, 07:13:24 pm »

Revision: Powerful Streamlined Fireballs [5]

Well, we've done it.  The Wand of Fireballs, our National Treasure, the very thing that jumpstarted our nations ascension into magical theory, is now obsolete.

Knowing Mathemagics has been a tremendous boon to understanding the inner workings of the wand, but as we learn more and more it becomes clear the original creators of the Wand of Fireballs didn't understand that particular field of science/magic.  The original wand is a mess of spell-work cast haphazardly.  Some portions seem dedicated to preventing bugs that aren't even present in the wand.  Other portions of the spellwork tap into magical energy in disappointingly inefficient ways.  Even more bizarrely, some of the spellwork seems to do nothing at all, being a by-product of a long-ago race's feeble understanding of magic.

Despite the disillusionment our mathemagicians go through, they've taken their understanding of fire and weaved tighter control upon our Streamlined Fireballs to have the same devastating effect as the Wand.

PSF's handle almost all of the magic through the wand, requiring only an apprentice level of magical understanding to use.  The spellwork is efficient, clean, and dangerously powerful - the resulting fireball is correctly channeled away from the user, and the explosion can annihilate entire squads at a time.  The only downside is that they take longer to recharge between shots than the original Wand, but when every Mage, Wizard, and Apprentice has one the downtime is barely noticeable.  Against all odds, cheap.

RAM

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Re: Wands Race - [Arstotzka]
« Reply #942 on: April 26, 2017, 07:24:48 pm »

Great lord of the Ninja abyss, I summon you!
Revision to greater fireball -> Ballblast.(Recall that the streamlined spells were streamlined to be small, they cut out a lot of stuff that was holdovers of being big. Revising them to ebe big again may involve taking out the streamlining...)
Heat is a problem, remove heat. We know that they burst when they reach the target, so just focus all of the energy on that and create a force-based ball instead of a fire-based ball. This should be a better companion to the smaller fireballs as it offers something different, being able to break hulls instead of burning them and burst trees into splinters instead of fighting the frost and rain constantly.
Also make sure it isn't a national effort, we want them to actually be fielded.

Revision to Myark -> Myark's apprentice.
Myark gets an apprentice that enhances his ability to win duels to the point that Al can potentially be defeated even if our forces are at a disadvantage, thus driving the maniac away for a turn. Can be further revised into an addition hero.

Revision to antimagic charms and antimagic bombs -> quartz growth
As part of the initial design document of the bombs, it is hoped that we have some research in magically growing quartz. If we can get it working we can increase the supply, allowing us to at least equip all of our commanders and wizard-hunters with them.

Revision to antimagic bombs -> Antimagic bombs
 Give them the ability to shatter to cover an area in antimagic, rather than the largely redundant ability to burst into an explosion of flame(the theory of trading duration for area doesn't seem too far fetched as a means of miniaturising the charms.). Also include some nifty quartz-growing magic to justify it being a design rather than just a revision of our old flawed charms into an arrowhead.

Orders
test their antimagic: We need to figure out what exactly we are trying to counter.
  Use channelled fog:
     We tried to train with frogs, it was chaotic and mad, which is very similar to fighting in fog. The survivors of the frog training go into battle under cover of fog. If it vanishes, then we know that the channelling effect does not resist their antimagic.
  Use crystal weapons which are protected by antimagic:
    This should have happened in the initial engagement but we have no data on it. presumably it does nothing, but we need to know. Equip a group with both antimagic and crystal weapons(AND backup weapons) and have them carry caltrops. If the antimagic charms can't even protect caltrops which are completely immersed in the charm's effect then we know.
  Interviews:
    Get some survivors from the crystal weapon disaster, what specifically happened to the weapons. We heard they just vanished, no breaking down, just poof, gone. Is this true, because that is a crazy difficult effect to undermine. No amount of stability or hardness can stop instantly being unmade.
    Get some wizards who have had their spellcasting disrupted. Did it vanish? Did it bend? Could they not feed it? Was there too much to control... Describe it in detail.
  BOMBS:
    Give our wizard-hunters some antimagic charms. No magic = the bombs are safe. Kind of all in the original design document but hey, doesn't hurt to check.
« Last Edit: April 26, 2017, 07:27:19 pm by RAM »
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Chiefwaffles

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Re: Wands Race - [Arstotzka]
« Reply #943 on: April 26, 2017, 07:27:31 pm »

Could that be an order? An apprentice for Myark?
Also, RAM, your fireball revision seems somewhat obsolete with the Powerful Streamlined Fireballs.
EDIT: Oh okay you ninja-edited an edit about ninja-edits.

And regarding the new fireball:
Yes.
Yeeees.

DOUBLEDIT:
Future idea for revision (or design?): Expanding the Academy to include mathemagics could very likely help us in designing new things utilizing mathemagics.

TRIPLEEDIT: (I have a problem)
+1 to Sell the trader a steam engine ASSUMING this doesn't somehow delete all knowledge of steam engines in Arstotzka and that it doesn't allow Moskurg to discover the existence of the steam engine.
« Last Edit: April 26, 2017, 07:32:26 pm by Chiefwaffles »
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Quote from: RAM
You should really look to the wilderness for your stealth ideas, it has been doing it much longer than you have after all. Take squids for example, that ink trick works pretty well, and in water too! So you just sneak into the dam upsteam, dump several megatons of distressed squid into it, then break the dam. Boom, you suddenly have enough water-proof stealth for a whole city!

RAM

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Re: Wands Race - [Arstotzka]
« Reply #944 on: April 26, 2017, 07:34:27 pm »

Could that be an order? An apprentice for Myark?
Also, RAM, your fireball revision seems somewhat obsolete with the Powerful Streamlined Fireballs.
EDIT: Oh okay you ninja-edited an edit about ninja-edits.

And regarding the new fireball:
Yes.
Yeeees.

DOUBLEDIT:
Future idea for revision (or design?): Expanding the Academy to include mathemagics could very likely help us in designing new things utilizing mathemagics.
I still like the idea of explosive to go along with incendiary, but yes, it is rather problematic with the revision already decided.
And I love that idea for revising some sort of vaguely-purposed mathemagical college onto the magic academy. I wish that I had thought of it...
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Vote (1) for the Urist scale!
I shall be eternally happy. I shall be able to construct elf hunting giant mecha. Which can pour magma.
Urist has been forced to use a friend as fertilizer lately.
Read the First Post!
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