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[wooks]

So I read in another thread about creating of a caste based fortress of animal peoples in the newest version since we can now both reclaim fortresses and play animal people adventurers. So I set about this absurd endeavor, and oh boy, have I done some stuff, and found some science.

I embarked in a nice, flat, small little 2x2 area of the world with my seven dwarfs and immediately retired the fort.
Next, I made 16 adventurers and retired them all at the fort.
4 Snail men (genderless),
2 Jaguar men, 2 Jaguar women,
2 Green Tree Frog men, 2 Green Tree Frog women,
2 Black Mamba men, 2 Black Mamba women.

I unretired the fort and stuck the starting 7 dwarfs into a walled in room to starve to death.

With the intention of setting up a breeding population I ran into a few hurdles, here is their story:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

• Animal men have varying size, and as such many of them cannot wield equipment. The only creatures I had large enough to told the pickaxes and battleaxes for mining and woodcutting were the jaguar men with their 75,000cm^3 body size. This was fine since I could still mine and chop, but good to know for the future since equipment cannot be made in smaller/larger sizes like armor and clothing can.
  
  
• I had to marry the adventurers somehow. All adventures start asexual and as such would never form relationships. Here I had to use DF hack's "gui/family-affiars" tool to marry them off correctly. However, the Snail people still could not marry, I fear that being genderless makes breeding an impossibility.
  
  
• The Mamba people lay eggs, so they needed to have nest boxes, as well as not have their eggs stolen for food/kitchens. But, this was actually a pretty useful thing to have brought since because DFhack tells you when eggs are fertilized I could know without having to wait the 9 month gestation period of non-egg-layers if their was a problem with breeding. Which there was.
  
  
• The gender of citizens affects their breeding behavior, not only their relationships. As such, I had to change all the genders of the animal people to heterosexual with the dfhack command "fix-ster fert all", after this the eggs showed as fertile, confirming that breeding was indeed occurring.
  
  Spoiler (click to show/hide)

  
  I suppose you could skip the step of force marrying the adventurers and instead only change their gender orientations, but I didn't go that route, and I suspect the non-standard desires of adventurers may cause issues. Also, while waiting for all of these babies to come about, I also noticed that Snail people don't sleep, at least not in their beds.
  
  
• Finally I got a few births, a set of twins and a set of triplets, all Green Tree Frog people
  
  Spoiler (click to show/hide)

  
  
  I took a look at one of the new citizens:
  
  Spoiler (click to show/hide)

  
  Less than a day old, yet an adult! I can give them labors and everything! In fact, many of them were born with skills! However, I also saw (with Dwarf Therapist) that they were still very small.
  
  
• After this I knew the eggs must be hatching soon so I took a quick inventory of them: 51!!!!!! 51 eggs were going to hatch in the days to come!
  The mothers had been sitting on them in their down time (No Job) but would run off to eat and do other such tasks. This made me fear that something may have gone wrong, but the mothers would always come back.
  
  Finally it happened!
  
  Spoiler (click to show/hide)

  
  
  
  That's a lot of Snake people! Again many of them came fully adult with skills in some labor, and they all started very small, many around 100cm^3.
  
  
• What came next I wasn't expecting. I was waiting on my Jaguar people to create some spawn, when out of nowhere, I get a series of announcements
  
  Spoiler (click to show/hide)

  
  
  4 of my new Black Mamba people have been made nobility!? How is this possible? They're all direct relations of insignificant adventurers! and beyond that they're not even a week old!
  
  Further one became a Diplomat! I've never seen that before! I check the wiki and it stated "The Diplomat is a noble position responsible for acts of diplomacy. In the current version it is not possible to assign a dwarf to this position, nor will one ever migrate to your fortress." How strange!

I'll keep you guys updated as things develop!

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I added the save file here

[Immortal-D]

This is a terrifying perversion of all things Dwarfy.... well done.

[steel jackal]

instead of using dfhack to change orientation you can just add the [ORIENTATION] tag to make a species always be hetrosexual.

for females do
           [ORIENTATION:MALE:0:50:100]
            [ORIENTATION:FEMALE:100:0:0]

for males do
                [ORIENTATION:MALE:100:0:0]
           [ORIENTATION:FEMALE:0:50:100]


that guarantees that everyone will be straight and 50% will be interested in marriage, change the 50 to 100 to guarantee they will want to marry.

note: i use the above tags to make it more easy to get breeding pairs but ive noticed that when i use those values i end up with a large number of children migrants


this change will effect worlds already made, but you have to edit the raws in the world save rather than the main raws

[Shonai_Dweller]

instead of using dfhack to change orientation you can just add the [ORIENTATION] tag to make a species always be hetrosexual.

for females do
           [ORIENTATION:MALE:0:50:100]
            [ORIENTATION:FEMALE:100:0:0]

for males do
                [ORIENTATION:MALE:100:0:0]
           [ORIENTATION:FEMALE:0:50:100]


that guarantees that everyone will be straight and 50% will be interested in marriage, change the 50 to 100 to guarantee they will want to marry.

note: i use the above tags to make it more easy to get breeding pairs but ive noticed that when i use those values i end up with a large number of children migrants


this change will effect worlds already made, but you have to edit the raws in the world save rather than the main raws

Will that also override the automatic adventurer orientation setting?

[steel jackal]

instead of using dfhack to change orientation you can just add the [ORIENTATION] tag to make a species always be hetrosexual.

for females do
           [ORIENTATION:MALE:0:50:100]
            [ORIENTATION:FEMALE:100:0:0]

for males do
                [ORIENTATION:MALE:100:0:0]
           [ORIENTATION:FEMALE:0:50:100]


that guarantees that everyone will be straight and 50% will be interested in marriage, change the 50 to 100 to guarantee they will want to marry.

note: i use the above tags to make it more easy to get breeding pairs but ive noticed that when i use those values i end up with a large number of children migrants


this change will effect worlds already made, but you have to edit the raws in the world save rather than the main raws

Will that also override the automatic adventurer orientation setting?

i dont play adventure mode so i dont know

[Dame de la Licorne]

<snip>
Will that also override the automatic adventurer orientation setting?

I don't think so, since vanilla player-generated adventurers aren't assigned an orientation at any point, even though their parent races do have orientations assigned to each individual.

- Dame de la Licorne

[Shonai_Dweller]

Will that also override the automatic adventurer orientation setting?

i dont play adventure mode so i dont know

Op is taking about changing the orientation of adventurers. Pretty sure that needs dfhack. Would gladly remove adventurer's 'unspecified' orientation if it was as easy as a raw edit. Makes me sad that my retired adventurers will never realise their dreams of raising a family.

[Fleeting Frames]

I...Am quite surprised. This is definitely new to me.

*looks around*

*borks tileset*

Okay, this is somewhat unmigrantlike skill setup on the born creature skills. Only 1s and 2s, though there's also military skills at times. Migrants, contrariwise, tend to have military skills in 3/1/1/1/1 pattern as well as usually getting all 3 fishing skills at once if they have any of them at low level.

*noticed really unhappy high master crutchsnail planter* *looks at stats* Looks like someone hasn't been getting leisure time in location zones *checks health* Hahaha...Okay, that was cruel of me.

Well, this is novel. Never seen diplomat come to visit:



Didn't know they required so much:



The number one problem with lot of animal people in vanilla fort mode is the [MEANDERER] token. This can be removed with single line of modding. It's not here, though, and *checks with miners* still present in 43.05. Others without meanderer zip past them as I make them dig between the ends of central hallway with digging priorities.

[wooks]

*noticed really unhappy high master crutchsnail planter* *looks at stats* Looks like someone hasn't been getting leisure time in location zones *checks health* Hahaha...Okay, that was cruel of me.

Well, this is novel. Never seen diplomat come to visit:



The number one problem with lot of animal people in vanilla fort mode is the [MEANDERER] token. This can be removed with single line of modding. It's not here, though, and *checks with miners* still present in 43.05. Others without meanderer zip past them as I make them dig between the ends of central hallway with digging priorities.

Yeah, The snails apparently won't heal for some reason. I don't believe he ever got injured beyond a small scratch lol. Here I thought I would have an OP labor force covered in shells.

The diplomat was appointed in my fort, which is strange, I checked the civilization, there doesn't appear to be a king either.

I did notice Jaguar people were pretty slow relative to the others, but I was initially planning on using them for military mostly, so that was fine. Became more annoying when they became my defacto miners and woodcutters.

[StagnantSoul]

Jaguar people are really, really slow. I had one come along with me as an adventurer... He was so slow he got left behind, trailing about two days worth of walking at all times.

[Ironfang]

Urist McConsort: "your majesty, we need to attend to the matter of replacing several of the barony."

Dwarf King: "let's see here? Hey these dwarves are all marked snakes?"

Urist McConsort: "Well sir, you see..."

Dwarf King:"They sound like perfect members of the nobility! Make them barons at once!"

Urist McConsort:"But your majesty..."

Dwarf King:"Oh, make this one a diplomat as well, I want to finish my monthly hour of work early."

[neo1096]

Jaguar people are really, really slow. I had one come along with me as an adventurer... He was so slow he got left behind, trailing about two days worth of walking at all times.

This is the result of the [MEANDERER] token, which causes them to lazily stroll everywhere.

[Fleeting Frames]

So, I waited a bit to have jaguar women give birth to children too (Happens on 27th granite).

Turns out these (4) children don't come with combat or labour skills...But do come with some social skills. Here's shot of best example:



This is in contrast to all other animal people OP used, who are all born as an adult.

Now, looking at wiki, those jaguar kittens would probably be adults in 3 years. So, if you get animal person without "meanderer" that is same size as humans, they're going to be better.

As an aside for those who want to try, conveniently the three largest such creatures - tortoise (185k), python (135k) and anaconda (85k) men are also egglayers. Though if one wants population explosion, chameleon men might be best with 40-50 eggs a clutch, no meandering and adult at birth.

[Inconspicuous]

This looks amazing. I'd try it, but I'm still working on a fort. I'll be watching

[FantasticDorf]

Strange to see a (Maybe in being hearthpeople they have a indirect relationship for the lord and were selected via that relation) diplomat be elected.

It wouldn't be hard to get diplomat through just fiddling noble positions, im not sure if they even serve any particular purpose at the moment (diplomats come & go, the most you could expect probably is to have them meet & talk about topical discussions as post tavern 42. update re-enabling small representative diplomats works fine)

> In theory if a visitor from another society kills your diplomat it's a cause for war.

A diplomat is needed to broach peace, so there's use in having one in wartime. Eitherway a interesting experiment in sporing adventurers locally onto a site.