Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Starver]

In some ways, I think it's good that H>alley lost out significantly. Of all the contenders, I think she'd have had the best actual bet of reuniting the right (and drawing in the 'maybe-right') under the torch of (relative) sanity. It wouldn't have helped Biden to have a closer stalking horse in the R's camp (or even a new favourite), and would make for many more awkward decisions both within and without the various parties' faithful... Not that I'm wedded to Biden (and there'd more to be said for keeping an eye on the incumbant VP), just that he's the best baseline to work from at the moment.

Though this does lead up to never-Trumpers, never-Bidenistas, 'never-gonna-vote-for-nobody, no-way, no-how!'s, and the like, holding (perhaps by passive and non-engaging majority) the future results in their clenched hands. As they have in the past.



The other also-rans, as currently measured, could of course also surprise us (for good or ill). But it would also need a (not entirely unforseeable) upset.


(Just a broad impression, is the above. Consult your actual psephologist (or psychologist!) for a more accurate extrapolation of what this shows about what people actually might think... My own crystal ball just resolutely shows fuzzy and distorted views of everything currently on the other side of the crystal ball. Upside-down.)

[McTraveller]

It does make me concerned for the world political stage, that so many people flock to these bombastic demagogues instead of well-tempered leaders.

I like to think that we have enough checks and balances in the system that a second Trump term couldn't completely destroy things, but my emotions are getting in the way.  Mostly because I think of things like the likelihood of just abandoning Ukraine and who knows what his administration would do for the Middle East or the climate or for consumer protections or infrastructure or education or for being nice to our geographic neighbors...

Basically his policy, and I think his appeal, is "me first, let everyone else fend for themselves."  So I guess no wonder why people like his rhetoric...

EDIT: added to list of concerns.

[Loud Whispers]

It does make me concerned for the world political stage, that so many people flock to these bombastic demagogues instead of well-tempered leaders.

Probably because "well-tempered leaders" usually means "small clique of corrupt bastards" from the same families over and over and over again

It's like the European politics meme

"I am the anti-corruption candidate. I will be the most corrupt candidate so far"
"I am in the incumbent candidate. The anti-corruption candidate went to school with me, we are friends"
"I am the populist candidate. Inject bleach"

Is it any surprise the Chileans elected the dude who said he would legalise organ harvesting? That position starts to make sense when the other two main parties are all just "look I know your life is an endless sisyphean nightmare but we don't intend to change anything, wait, wait don't vote for the inject bleach guy"

[nenjin]

Reject modernity.

Inject bleach.

[Starver]

There is of course a big gap between honestly trying to improve stale old situations and outright table-flipping. Neither could you or should you really be passionate about "Hail the new chief, marginally dissimilar to the old chief!", naturally, but where has political passion ever been unequivocably rewarded, against the same-ol' same ol'..?

Heads and hearts (and the cold, dry cut of subsequent reality, to make it a proper triumvirate of uncontrollable factors) rarely lead to the same (unqualifiably good) result. And there are far too many table-flippers. Or people who would enjoy seeing the table flipped by others, even if they don't know which table it'll be.

(I could point out Truss, or Johnson, over here. Corbyn, for a short but intense time was definitely "the thing" amongst anybody not actually on the other side of any of his classic arguments. Of course "the B-word" (barely, but FPTP rather than nuanced). Clegg's nearly-there opportunities, following on from Blair's actual ones. Maggie was this, initially... Not sure how much further back I should go with anyone here. I mean even I don't go back as far as Attlee, but then that was a case of an already pretty flipped table where the argument was how might the room be refurnished. For the US, the previous anomaly was perhaps just the other side's response to Obama, and you could argue at least every other prior President (and any number of congresscritters/etc) was a form of table-flipper. Reagan, yes, by his (and Carter's) era's standards; Bush Sr, not so much, etc... But it seems to me that tables are getting flipped harder and faster and more frequently. Or maybe I'm just minimising what I previously experienced, when younger.)

[Maximum™]

I mean, Iowa has been more worthless than fucking Nebraska and Kansas for ever, but I do still gotta chuckle over "Trump won!" morons not noticing he would thus be disqualified entirely from ever running again, 2 terms ya dipshits.

How are these fucking turdbrains able to read well enough to vote?

How do they tie their shoes?

[hector13]

My curiosity is why they still engage with the electoral system they think cheated him the last time round.

[Maximum™]

Right? They should absolutely boycott it, never vote again, that'll show us! That'll show us all!



Though, they're supporting a fascist with plans to install himself as a dictator, which isn't really engaging with an electoral system outside of trying to use it to kill it.

[The_Explorer]

Maybe the problem really is simple and obvious

There are tons of parties, but only two really win and matter. So its literally US's fate decided by blue or red

And in this case, both candidates are so terrible except one is less terrible

Like, please put up better candidates if US only has in reality a two party system lol

I think even though voting biden, my main problem is he is so old he can croke at  any time like a dwarf who wanders off and then just falls over for no apparent reason

[Loud Whispers]

Reject modernity.

Inject bleach.

I don't like 'im but 'is politics is clean

[MorleyDev]

As an outside observer,

US Political options used to be a right wing party vs a slightly righter wing party. Then Obama's terms really seemed to *break* something in the Farther Right side, and it's become a Right Wing Party vs Utter Fucking Lunatics.

(And yes the Democrats are still pretty right wing by European standards, if only due to the nature of the USA meaning they have to take baby steps at best to move in the leftward direction on things like Welfare and Healthcare).

[anewaname]

Calling Trump voters stupid isn't right and it is pointless, because the Trumper problem is less about their intelligence and more about their income, education, and their perception of their future.

Statistics from a nytimes article showing Trump getting his votes from the poor people

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

From this MSNBC vid...

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

The voters were asked two questions "did Biden legitimately win in 2020?" and "if trump is convicted, is he fit to be president?", and as the guy explains, about 2/3 of the voters were pro-trump and answered no and yes, and about 1/3 the people were pro-Halley and answered yes and no, with DeSantis getting the evangelical votes that went to Trump in prior years (which could be a good sign).

Regardless of what the Biden has done, there hasn't been real trickle-down for most people, so Trump will win the GOP nomination across the nation, because many of his people are thinking "they will never help me, so burn down the system".

[Maximum™]

They felt certain they would get respect when their big stupid bitchbaby got into office, and instead everyone started hating them for being backwards fucking cunts.

Then they started losing election after election and having to justify ever more inane and insane bullshit on behalf of their shitty orange god.

Now people don't even have the energy to pay attention to their stupid positions, we know they aren't based on anything resembling reality, we know they are absolutely lost causes, and we know they chose this.

Nobody made them fly out and attack the capitol building, they chose to do that.

Nobody made them hitch their shitty sense of self worth to being white and defending orange shitheads, they chose to do that.

He is getting his votes from stupid racists, and shocker of shockers, the US is full of stupid racists.

They may pretend they're making some moral or self serving decision, but anybody counting on an orange turd to do anything for anyone but himself is stupid as a fucking brick.

He did nothing but help a handful of rich fuckers, including himself, and his kids. He passed out pardons to his cronies but fuck the moron insurrectionists, though he'll happily hang that as a prize for the stupid turds to stick by him because, let me reiterate: THEY ARE THE STUPIDEST FUCKERS ON THE PLANET!

They aren't doing this because of financial insecurity, I'm financially insecure but I'm not a white supremacist fascist cunt!
They aren't doing this because of their education, I got a GED and did a handful of courses but I'm not a white supremacist fascist cunt!
They aren't doing this because they worry about the future, I worry about our future with all these white supremacist fascist cunts because... you get the idea.

[Strongpoint]

Statistics from a nytimes article showing Trump getting his votes from the poor people

Correlation does not imply causation.

[dragdeler]

Calling Trump voters stupid isn't right and it is pointless, because the Trumper problem is less about their intelligence and more about their income, education, and their perception of their future.

Dude, the median attention span plus critical thinking skills doesn't suffice to successfully instruct the first come which color container their garbage goes in... Does it matter wether it is pettyness or stupidity. If these people could make use of their "ability" to read they'd still find a way to disagree with that conciliatory, meant to be a low common denominator take, because for all intents and purposes of civil discourse, those whom still have not got the memo** by now, they have to be considered like rabbid animals foaming at the mouth.

We can't exactly go out there and visit them at their doorsteps, eventhough everyday they make themselves easier to find, because then we might as well join them... But as I said at the very beginning, the median, the first come person you ask in the street, the average dude is allready at a level where they can not be trusted to find sonething if the instruction to go get it contained information past a comma or didn't encode the target color in the very last words. The average citizen of the world is allready at a level where you can't trust them to save their own lives without constantly micromanaging them. They'd simply not pay attention and then turn on the people who predicted the outcome.


At this point nobody should care if they could be helped since they made it abundantly clear, that they have no interest in being helped. They want you to bow to their tantrum course of self destruction. That time is better used staying healthy or even learning to defend yourself.

**We live in post truth post covid post jan6 but I bet not post Trump motherfucking 2024, may I kindly suggest you wake up.