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[wierd]

Blaming the people that simply cannot get work, because there is no work to be had-- and implying that they were "hoping it would last forever" is wrong.


The proper action would be for the government to FIND work for these people to do, and to hire them as remote workers. (assuming the GOP fuckholes are at all serious about wanting to have people be employed before offering them benefits.)


The economic reality is that there are only so many jobs that can be conducted by remote, and of those, the organizations that are offering them, only want to offer them to people they have a reasonable assurance (of one form or another) will be able to profitably perform that work.  Bob the illiterate janitor is not going to translate well to a service job, for instance. Nothing wrong with Bob the illiterate janitor-- just that his vocation, janitorial, requires physical presence at the job site, and with the shutdowns, that means NO WORK FOR BOB.

Bob would happily find work to do, if there was work he could do that was available.  No such work is available.


Because no such work is available, and likely wont be available for at least another year, at the current trending rate of things, then the society we live in needs to answer a difficult question--- Do you value clean buildings enough to keep Bob the illiterate janitor from starving to death, and being evicted from his apartment over the next year, so that he will be able to return to the job market and return to cleaning buildings again once the public health crisis is over (because those office people working from home right now sure as hell are not going to take offerings for that kind of work once that happens!!), or do we allow Bob to be brutally crushed by financial hardship and likely literally be killed by it, because we are too damn tight with our pockets to accept that this is real?

[sluissa]

Herman Cain has succumbed to the 'Rona.
Didn't he get it at the last Trump rally?

Spoiler: F (click to show/hide)

That man was a walking meme and I loved him for it. I'm glad he never became president, but I'm also glad he existed.

Meanwhile, Biden has openly called for political persecution of anarchists, while mimicking Trump narrative about violent protesters.

Not that it should be surprising to anyone who was paying any attention before the Trump era.

Just needs to be constantly reiterated how marginal the "lesser" is in this cycle's "lesser evil".  And that even the stuff going on in Portland did not began with Trump, and will not end with him.

Not that I'm really trying to defend Biden here... because I'm sure there's some other people that would get swept up with the "anarchists" and "arsonists" as a matter of political expediency. But are we really suggesting that anarchists are worth defending? Are somehow less evil than EITHER of the two options we have this fall? As shit as the US is in a lot of ways, anarchy is not a better option.

[Frumple]

Herman Cain has succumbed to the 'Rona.
Didn't he get it at the last Trump rally?

Spoiler: F (click to show/hide)

Seem to recall he supposedly caught it at the tulsa rally, yeah. Which means you can check off the box besides "literally killing their supporters" under the trump rally checklist, if it wasn't already ticked.

[Iduno]

Herman Cain has succumbed to the 'Rona.
Didn't he get it at the last Trump rally?

Spoiler: F (click to show/hide)

That man was a walking meme and I loved him for it. I'm glad he never became president, but I'm also glad he existed.

Meanwhile, Biden has openly called for political persecution of anarchists, while mimicking Trump narrative about violent protesters.

Not that it should be surprising to anyone who was paying any attention before the Trump era.

Just needs to be constantly reiterated how marginal the "lesser" is in this cycle's "lesser evil".  And that even the stuff going on in Portland did not began with Trump, and will not end with him.

Not that I'm really trying to defend Biden here... because I'm sure there's some other people that would get swept up with the "anarchists" and "arsonists" as a matter of political expediency. But are we really suggesting that anarchists are worth defending? Are somehow less evil than EITHER of the two options we have this fall? As shit as the US is in a lot of ways, anarchy is not a better option.

Even if you think it's okay to disappear people for their political beliefs, he's also defining anarchists as including innocent bystanders or non-whites who get attacked by the police.

[wierd]

And people trust the mainstream democrat party, who selected this senile, racist old fossil--- because?


Sure, the murder teddy is slightly less horrible than the hentai tentacle rape monster, but both are not interested in your wellbeing.  Simply because one looks superficially cuddly does not make it good.

[McTraveller]

Blaming the people that simply cannot get work, because there is no work to be had-- and implying that they were "hoping it would last forever" is wrong.

I'm not "blaming people for not finding work". I'm questioning people that appear to be relying on $600 a week emergency funds to maintain a standard of living instead of assuming that they will revert to the long-term average of $150 a week support and adjusting accordingly.

If I lost my job and didn't think I could find another, I'd do everything in my power to readjust my living situation so I could have a sustainable situation on whatever assistance income is available. Then, once I had that stabilized, I would start working to increase my situation again.  I wouldn't complain that "nobody found a job for me" or "nobody helped me sell my house" or whatever.  Granted selling a house to cash out the equity isn't probably an option for a 19 year old, but where are the traditional support networks of family and friends?

Why do we expect the government to help us out, and not our family and friends?

[wierd]

The grim reality is that >60% of US households *NEED* that kind of income, to pay for RENT.

There is an affordable housing crisis in our country. You can't just move out and look for a cheaper landlord. The cost of the rent is non-negotiable, and it is high.

[misko27]

I spent way too much time writing this only for people to move on, but I'm doing it anyway because it's that sort of day.

Firstly we interrupt this newscast with breaking news: former CEO of Godfather's Pizza and GOP Presidential Candidate/one-time-frontrunner (which you may remember for its memetastic qualities), and current Trump surrogate Herman Cain has died from COVID-19. Those regularly following the news may have heard when he got sick, less than two weeks after attending the Trump Tulsa rally and tweeting a picture of himself and fellow Trump supporters without a mask. Didn't age well. He was hospitalized on the 1st of July, two days after testing positive. Tweets made in his name claimed he'd been getting better or at least on "cruise control". The last update was on monday, which said he was "being treated with oxygen for his lungs” and “He really is getting better, which means it is working,”

For news with less immediately fatal (more of a long term thing really) is the GDP data. Sitting at -9.5% for the quarter, it is by far the worst on record. Really! Granted the data only stretches back to 1950, but look at that graph. This seems like Bad News^TM and expect the stock market to slump (which, in all honesty, is probably a very much needed correction, that things been running on pixie dust and good vibes for most of the crisis). The 19th straight week of +1 million unemployment claims probably won't help brighten the mood. Note that the GDP drop can be read either in terms of quaterly GDP (the more accurate description) or projected annual decline (which is how much it would decline if this continued for a year straight). CNN uses the latter because it has a bigger number: 32.9%. Either way, still pretty awful.

Spoiler: I even had to resize this graph (click to show/hide)

In totally unrelated news, Congress flails attempting to keep many of the provisions enacted to save the US economy going. Republicans and Democrats are deadlocked, with, among other objections, Democrats refusing to accept the Senate proposal for a cut in the $600 dollar per week per person unemployment program down to $200. Among other disagreements are the overall pricetags (Republican bill being $1 trillion vs the Democratic $3 trillion proposal), Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell's demand for litigation protection for businesses from sick workers/consumers, Democrats wanting direct funding for State/Local areas, etc. Chief of Staff Mark Meadows and Treasury Secretary Mnuchin have been leading the efforts to hash out a deal, but as of Wednesday they remained, quote, "Very far apart" as the benefits are set to expire soon, which would (of course) lead to $0 a week, end to the eviction moratorium, and a lot of other rather unpleasant effects; yet Democratic Congressional Leadership has rejected either a short-term extension or a piecemeal approach. With no deal about to appear, Congress is poised to allow the provisions to lapse.

Complicating the issue is that the Republican Caucus seems unable to coalesce behind any proposal, with some fiscal "hawks" taking one look at the pricetag and rejecting it out-of-hand, while others push pet projects, or support even further aid; the White House isn't helping, adding on it's own non-starters like tax cuts, new limits on unemployment, further stimulus checks (unrelated: still haven't got mine ), funding for an FBI building meeting bipartisan derision for both its pricetag and alleged links to Trump's Hotels. To quote Lindsey Graham (R-SC) after a meeting on Tuesday: "I think if Mitch can get half the conference, that’d be quite an accomplishment.”, a truly inspiring vote of confidence. Sen. John Kennedy (R-La.) "I’m not going to vote for a bill in the name of unity when I don’t know what’s in the damn thing," Sen. Josh Hawley (R-Mo.): "It’s a mess. I can’t figure out what this bill is about. I don’t know what we’re trying to accomplish with it." Senator Rand Paul simply stormed out of the meeting as he does.

Meanwhile Trump suggests simply delaying the 2020 election, finally giving the conspiracy theory crowd the White Whale they've been waiting for since, uh...probably since the Federalist/Democratic-Republican presidential elections honestly. Notch up the "It's Happening!" meter.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Edit: Oh, and last but not least: the late Rep. John Lewis's funeral is today. Obama is delivering a eulogy as of posting time. John Lewis wrote an Op-Ed shortly before he died, instructing the NY Times to publish it on the day of his funeral, which they have done. Link here.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

I feel like it's at least appropriate that we be at HAPPENING-CON 3, since we could indeed have prevented this.

[wierd]

"You didn't listen" is more appropriate.

The data and historical review of the 1918 flu clearly and profoundly put to page that the course of action with the least long term effects was harsh, full, and complete shutdown of all transit and business EARLY--- followed with sustaining of those conditions until the pathogen burns out.


What did the US do instead?  "Fuck that-- where's my money!? SLAVES-- GET BACK TO WORK!"


"This could have been avoided" is likely reserved for when we have >50% homelessness, because of all the evictions, because of all the tightwads in congress refusing to subsidize the nearly 50% unemployment rate, and with landlords screeching to the heavens that they dont want tenants that aren't paying.

[Reelya]

That's based on a straw man of what an anarchist even is, sluissa. If you define it as bomb-throwing nihilist then of course that's not necessarily defendible. It's also an age-old straw man canard that ignores basically everything ever written by anyone who calls themselves an anarchist.

It's like saying Republican = Nazi and therefore anyone who says they're a Republican is undefendible and shouldn't be listened to because then you're listening to Nazis. However the problem was that the definition was circular in nature.

[McTraveller]

Only Congress can change election day. Furthermore, if we don't have a clear winner from an election, Speaker of the House by default gets the job on January 20.

Or are people really that scared of what must be a military coup to have anything else occur?

ASIDE: Holy crap, wow I didn't realize that rents were as ridiculous as they are in most urban areas.  At some point we're either going to literally be overrun by homeless or the landlords are going to have to start cutting their rents.  I somewhat envision this crazy situation where local law enforcement just refuses to enforce evictions, and landlords just get zero income.  I mean, would law enforcement really evict "50%" of the population?  That doesn't even sound logistically possible.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

The Speaker of the House would get the job as long as the Speaker is still in-term. While it's California and not the federal government that is handling Pelosi's district, there's nothing normal about the President casually suggesting we cancel democracy to begin with. If the House can't get reelected then they're all gone, and Chuck Grassley of the Senate becomes President.

Of course, by that point I imagine Trump will just have Congress arrested anyway. You know, that's an interesting hole in our electoral law, just don't allow the election to happen and you effectively abolish the House immediately and the Senate over the next couple of years.

Cops and landlords are the best of buddies, they'd happily evict 50% of the population.

[Reelya]

ASIDE: Holy crap, wow I didn't realize that rents were as ridiculous as they are in most urban areas.  At some point we're either going to literally be overrun by homeless or the landlords are going to have to start cutting their rents.  I somewhat envision this crazy situation where local law enforcement just refuses to enforce evictions, and landlords just get zero income.  I mean, would law enforcement really evict "50%" of the population?  That doesn't even sound logistically possible.

As for housing prices be very wary of people who call for any sort of de-zoning or urban sprawl as the solution to the problem: "just build a billion new houses, that'll solve the problem".

The problem is that it won't since that's not how things actually work. The proponents of this approach are housing constructions companies.

There's actually going to be some amount X of available rental properties which maximizes Y, which is total revenue from rental properties, for a given level of demand. Add too much housing stock and this pushes profitability down, forcing any more marginal (i.e. actually affordable) options off the market, in favor of the high-end new stuff. There are plenty of houses already that could be rented but aren't because the return on the market rent wouldn't be worth the upkeep and maintenance. So you keep tacking on new housing stock and all that does is force the more marginal stuff out of the market in favor of the high-margin stuff, pushing things back towards that high-profit point X (assuming demand doesn't change). So ... you can't fix housing affordability with supply-side means in a free market.

[SalmonGod]

Not that I'm really trying to defend Biden here... because I'm sure there's some other people that would get swept up with the "anarchists" and "arsonists" as a matter of political expediency. But are we really suggesting that anarchists are worth defending? Are somehow less evil than EITHER of the two options we have this fall? As shit as the US is in a lot of ways, anarchy is not a better option.

I'm an anarchist.  That's me.  Right here.  *waves*  Have been an anarchist long before I started hanging out on this forum.

And anyway, whether anarchists are better than republicans or democrats is completely beside the point.  Like seriously that has absolutely nothing to do with the principle in question.

The issue is that Trump gets flak for openly espousing cultural persecution and legal consequences for political beliefs.  Now Biden has done exactly the same.  Being an anarchist means having a set of political beliefs in your head.  Nothing more. 

I repeat.  Being an anarchist is not an activity.  It's a political belief.  It has nothing to do with arson, rioting, looting, etc.  I am an anarchist and have never participated in any of those things.  And linguistically associating anarchy and arson with each other in the same sentence is another play right out of any fascist propaganda playbook, and something Trump is rightly called out for all the time.

So this is literally both sides engaging in political thought policing.  And what's worse on Biden's side is his administration predates Trump's in doing so.  The twitter link I included before includes articles about how the FBI (federal agents, as the terminology goes that people like to emphasize where Trump is concerned) did a bunch of raids on people's homes with battering rams and assault rifles and trashed their places looking for evidence of anarchist political leanings as a basis for arrest, and two people ended up imprisoned for several months without any charges other than refusing to give information to secret proceedings in front of a grand jury about their social circles.

Plante had been summoned to Seattle by a federal subpoena, delivered to her in the early hours of July 25, when the FBI raided her home—one of several raids in Seattle and Portland in the past couple of months. FBI agents, she said, smashed through her front door with a battering ram with assault rifles drawn, "looking paramilitary." According to a copy of the warrant, agents were looking for black clothing, paint, sticks, flags, computers and cell phones, and "anti-government or anarchist literature."

The warrants for the related raids used similar language. One warrant for an early morning raid at a Seattle home also listed black clothing, electronics, and "paperwork—anarchists in the Occupy movement." In effect, witnesses in Portland and Seattle say, federal and local police burst into people's homes while they were sleeping and held them at gunpoint while rummaging through their bookshelves, looking for evidence of political leanings instead of evidence of a crime.

And I should also point out that this is not the only case of such behavior at a federal law enforcement level during the Bush/Obama era.  There were plenty.  They're just really hard to dig up now, because they were barely reported on even when they were current events, so word of mouth and obscure indie media were generally the only sources.  It wasn't fashionable to draw attention to such things before Trump took office, and hardly anyone cared.  And I didn't have the foresight to save the info as I came across it back then.  I thank the twitter person for digging this one up, and somebody else for linking me to that twitter thread.