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[Frumple]

Similar but like... inverted. Evangelism's issues on that front are near entirely self-inflicted. People claiming the descriptor and their immediate allies have been the ones dragging it into the dirt , more than 'bout anything. Rather than other folks trying to pervert the term, outside observers have mostly just been kinda' going 'what the fuck are you people doing' or whatev'.

Communism et al's had dedicated campaigns to warp them by hostile actors, some of them basically nation scale. It had plenty of fuckups to drag it down, too, but also major sabotage and whatnot to go with it that's largely just not there with evangelism (yet, at the absolute least). There's similarities, but it's not a terribly close fit.

[Naturegirl1999]

Similar but like... inverted. Evangelism's issues on that front are near entirely self-inflicted. People claiming the descriptor and their immediate allies have been the ones dragging it into the dirt , more than 'bout anything. Rather than other folks trying to pervert the term, outside observers have mostly just been kinda' going 'what the fuck are you people doing' or whatev'.

Communism et al's had dedicated campaigns to warp them by hostile actors, some of them basically nation scale. It had plenty of fuckups to drag it down, too, but also major sabotage and whatnot to go with it that's largely just not there with evangelism (yet, at the absolute least). There's similarities, but it's not a terribly close fit.

Yes, I was referring to communism with the propaganda. Evangelism was changed by evangelists. They didn’t need sabatoge

[Trekkin]

Yes, I was referring to communism with the propaganda. Evangelism was changed by evangelists. They didn’t need sabatoge

The evangelists did kind of get it, though, as several fields of science have provided evidence that a literal reading of the Bible is at odds with reality and, more broadly, miracles are incompatible with the methodological naturalism underpinning the scientific method. In Boomers' case, the same thing credited with getting men to the Moon and giving them nylon stockings, antibiotics, enormous chickens, nuclear weapons and global political domination was also the thing that kept finding more reasons to say the statements the Bible makes about the natural world are not accurate, from the impossibility of a global flood to the shape of the Earth being an oblate spheroid rather than anything with corners. And if it's not inerrant, why not similarly think critically about its moral precepts?

Now, I'm not saying these questions are new, or unique to American evangelists, or that they couldn't be resolved through means other than American evangelism -- as indeed they have been, here and elsewhere. I am saying that the American understanding of their scientific supremacy simultaneously confronted a lot of American Christians already implicitly in favor of Biblical inerrancy with painful questions about their faith that also had a patriotic tinge for the same generation that saw America undergo the seismic cultural shifts of the latter 20th century. That their opposition to these things individually was conflated into a single worldview -- in short, that God exists and He's deeply conservative -- is not surprising under these circumstances.

[Naturegirl1999]

Yes, I was referring to communism with the propaganda. Evangelism was changed by evangelists. They didn’t need sabatoge

The evangelists did kind of get it, though, as several fields of science have provided evidence that a literal reading of the Bible is at odds with reality and, more broadly, miracles are incompatible with the methodological naturalism underpinning the scientific method. In Boomers' case, the same thing credited with getting men to the Moon and giving them nylon stockings, antibiotics, enormous chickens, nuclear weapons and global political domination was also the thing that kept finding more reasons to say the statements the Bible makes about the natural world are not accurate, from the impossibility of a global flood to the shape of the Earth being an oblate spheroid rather than anything with corners. And if it's not inerrant, why not similarly think critically about its moral precepts?

Now, I'm not saying these questions are new, or unique to American evangelists, or that they couldn't be resolved through means other than American evangelism -- as indeed they have been, here and elsewhere. I am saying that the American understanding of their scientific supremacy simultaneously confronted a lot of American Christians already implicitly in favor of Biblical inerrancy with painful questions about their faith that also had a patriotic tinge for the same generation that saw America undergo the seismic cultural shifts of the latter 20th century. That their opposition to these things individually was conflated into a single worldview -- in short, that God exists and He's deeply conservative -- is not surprising under these circumstances.

I hope people will eventually accept reality over religion.

[Dunamisdeos]

Frumple's got it right.
 
Communism/socialism have become political nonsense words to most, whereas Evangelical has been hijacked. It still refers to a specific group, albeit a very negative one.
 
From my perspective the meaning of the term Evangelical has been altered in the same method that the swastika was. The swastika has a ton of other meanings in a ton of other cultures, all of which amount to basically "good feelings". But we all know what we associate it with now. To me and the Christians I associate with an Evangelical until relatively recently was literally just someone who went out of their way to spread word about our faith. You talk to people about your beliefs in a coffee shop on Tuesdays? Travel abroad and talk to people about our faith? That's you as recently as like, the 90's.
 
Now the term is becoming more and more irrevocably associated with a hate group.

[Karnewarrior]

Yeah. Can't say normal proseletysers weren't a bit irritating, but they weren't bad people.

But the modern evangelical either is a bad person or, more likely, works with bad people to accomplish bad ends because they're too frightened by the thought of doubting their faith to question what they're doing. It's the kind of thinking which leads to burning copies of Nat Geo in the backyard because they're "full of sin", without actually stopping to ask what sin they're actually full of.

There's nothing actually unchristian about National Geographic. It's a journal of learning, which is AFAIK entirely within the rules of the church. But your modern evangelical will burn anything which doesn't fit inside their increasingly narrow definition of reality, something which ironically can include stuff like C.S. Lewis' works which are *explicitly* Christian. The movement's been hijacked by bad actors who want to spread ignorance, not faith.

[Naturegirl1999]

Faith is a good medium for ignorance to spread. Spreading both makes it easier to deny reality

[scourge728]

Pretty much every movement that has been hijacked have been hijacked to spread ignorance afair

[Dunamisdeos]

Excuse me sir but National Geographic has boobs in it occasionally, and you all know that we can't accept that those exist in real life. #habitsforeverybody

[Kagus]

sunflower/safflower/canola (...) coconut

No. Lard4Life. Team Lard. #LoveLard

I finally got to try chleb ze smalcem! Here in Norway, of all places...

We had an international food and culture festival here in town a little while ago, and I saw that the Poland stall had good ol' bread and lard as one of its offerings, topped with pickles, onions and black pepper. I'd felt a bit bad about not getting to check that off the list while I was in Kraków, so I spent one of my last food bongs on a slice.

Tasty, but it was festival fare and also not really worth the price I paid for it... Which went for many of the stands out there, to be honest. Each bong was 35 kroner, so a little over 15 złoty for one slice.

Norway! Shit's expensive, y'all.

[Dunamisdeos]

sunflower/safflower/canola (...) coconut

No. Lard4Life. Team Lard. #LoveLard

I finally got to try chleb ze smalcem! Here in Norway, of all places...

We had an international food and culture festival here in town a little while ago, and I saw that the Poland stall had good ol' bread and lard as one of its offerings, topped with pickles, onions and black pepper. I'd felt a bit bad about not getting to check that off the list while I was in Kraków, so I spent one of my last food bongs on a slice.

Tasty, but it was festival fare and also not really worth the price I paid for it... Which went for many of the stands out there, to be honest. Each bong was 35 kroner, so a little over 15 złoty for one slice.

Norway! Shit's expensive, y'all.

Ooo a food tangent!

I just ordered a whole-ass pepperoni pizza for 2$ because I got a coupon. 7-11 delivers now for reasons I cannot immediately comprehend. They put out a 7$ off coupon for my first order, and the pizza costs 7$. It's 2$ for the delivery fee.

Quick Edit: I just saw that they deliver beer and cigarettes as well. Mystery solved.

[Rolan7]

Quick Edit: I just saw that they deliver beer

Welp I guess I'm dead!

[Karnewarrior]

Excuse me sir but National Geographic has boobs in it occasionally, and you all know that we can't accept that those exist in real life. #habitsforeverybody

God made those nipples.
Besides, they're saggy tribal nipples. Dunno how you're supposed to be able to fap to something which resembles a set of fleshy shower curtains with a couple of buttons pinned to the bottom.

[Il Palazzo]

a little over 15 złoty for one slice

This is a heresy.

[Folly]

From my perspective the meaning of the term Evangelical has been altered
...
Now the term is becoming more and more irrevocably associated with a hate group.

Doesn't it always though?
Most every religious war throughout history was preceded by several generations of missionaries spreading the good word of peace love and kindness, shoring up numbers while subtly planting the seeds of hatred and intolerance so that they can fester until it's time to purge the infidels.

At a fundamental level, 'Faith' means presuming that anyone who thinks differently than you is automatically and unquestionably wrong. And humans can only tolerate something wrong in their midst for so long before they instinctively need to make it right, by whatever means are necessary.