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[Lord Shonus]

2: You make it a school sponsored function. Teachers walk their students outside/somewhere. Let them chant some school approved chants a bit. Basically turn it into a pep rally at the risk of students finding it shallow and still walking out.

This is a terrible idea, as you force students who aren't invested in the statement - or actively oppose it - to support it. Consider the outrage that would happen, for example, if students were forced to participate in an "end abortion now" rally.

[smjjames]

I don't really like the school approved slogans bit. Sure, I get it if they're bad language or racist stuff, but it runs right into violating the students first amendment rights.

I saw an article on CNN saying that some schools are offering suggestions of other forms of civic engagement like tying ribbons or a period of silence.

Obviously safety concerns and class disruption are understandable, but they should support civic engagement.

[SalmonGod]

Let them learn about co-opting and railroading early on.  Useful knowledge to prepare them for young adulthood.  [/half-snark]

[sluissa]

I don't really like the school approved slogans bit. Sure, I get it if they're bad language or racist stuff, but it runs right into violating the students first amendment rights.

I saw an article on CNN saying that some schools are offering suggestions of other forms of civic engagement like tying ribbons or a period of silence.

Obviously safety concerns and class disruption are understandable, but they should support civic engagement.

Just remember, minors have no constitutional rights.

Minors have a very limited set of rights set forth mostly in judicial precedent and piecemeal law rather than 100% guaranteed constitutionally.

[misko27]

2: You make it a school sponsored function. Teachers walk their students outside/somewhere. Let them chant some school approved chants a bit. Basically turn it into a pep rally at the risk of students finding it shallow and still walking out.

I think (and remember, not a constitutional lawyer) this would go against Tinker v. Des Moines. Unless you could prove ahead of time that they were going to be walking out and thus disrupting education. But to do that, you'd have to let them walk out.

Anyway... The next big special election is in on Tuesday in Pennsylvania, deep in Trump country, and Republicans are doing a 11th hour advertising Blitz for their guy there. They're still fairly pessimistic though, and the blame-game has already started (with most attacking their candidate in the race, Rick Saccone. Rick Saccone is struggling to advertise while facing off against Conor Lamb, an "Ivy League-educated 33-year-old Marine veteran and former federal prosecutor." Here's FiveThirtyEight on the race.[/url]

Trump won it that district by 20 points, and so I was already hearing about this race for a while after the GOP's Roy Moore debacle. Bellweather or not, if it goes bad it'll be

[sluissa]

2: You make it a school sponsored function. Teachers walk their students outside/somewhere. Let them chant some school approved chants a bit. Basically turn it into a pep rally at the risk of students finding it shallow and still walking out.

I think (and remember, not a constitutional lawyer) this would go against Tinker v. Des Moines. Unless you could prove ahead of time that they were going to be walking out and thus disrupting education. But to do that, you'd have to let them walk out.

Tinker ONLY applies to free speech insofar as it doesn't interfere in the normal operation of school.

Something as innocuous as an arm band is just about the ONLY thing that protects.

Post-Tinker, several cases have come up that have cut down on the extent to which Tinker protects students speech.

A class walk out, especially mass and organized is 100% interfering with school function. You might not be able to force kids to take a political side on that issue, but you can enforce that they must say it in a respectful and organized manner.

You can argue that the existing law/precedent is vague on these matters, because they are. But you can't say the kids would be 100% protected. Fighting it would very likely end up in court where a judge would very much have freedom to rule against the kids free speech in this instance.

[smjjames]

If they want to do something, then the school can help them do the civic engagement in ways that don't disrupt class.

The organized walkout on a school day is pretty obviously meant to be disruptive and a show of force of sorts, but as has been mentioned a couple times, schools are in a real bind here due to safety reasons, among other things.

[Dunamisdeos]

I mean, given the context I can understand why deliberately disrupting school is part of the protest/demonstration.

Like if you wanted to protest police brutality you would want to do it in some way that forces the police to take notice as well as brings attention to the issue. That said, part of the issue with the school helping to arrange a protest (ergo, designating a protest day) makes the school an implied participant of the protest.

The most they can really do is indeed suggest other forms of engagement, and handle other issues as they come up. I feel like most school leadership is not going to drop the book on kids for a 10-20 minute planned protest.

[Gentlefish]

It's civil disobedience, it's not necessarily meant to be "within the confines of the law". In places like Texas they absolutely could send truant officers in, but they won't since that would really escalate the situation. My school once, in protest of Idaho's great (buffoon) Luna, organized a stay-in instead of a walk-out that was sponsored by the administration who was also half-protesting in the sense that they supported us wholly.

Definitely talked to a few teachers and heard them say things teachers shouldn't necessarily say to students, at least while in class.

[Dunamisdeos]

Yeah, see to me, outright civil disobedience seems like the wrong way for minors to go. Their goal is to draw attention to how important the issue is for them.

It would be wisest to protest in such a way that brings the school administration onto their side. For instance, if I was running the show I would publicly announce something dramatic-but-not-over-the-top like a walkout, and now that there's nationwide (worldwide?) attention via news and social media, downgrade it to something less disruptive as a show of rationality. Especially in the face of the administration/lobbyists' outright obstinacy, this draws the right kind of attention and gains the right kind of pull.

[smjjames]

OOOH! Stormy Daniels says that she wants to publish texts, photos and videos relating to the President.

As much as a slow moving trainwreck that everybody is enraptured by as this particular scandal is, I hope theres nothing too salacious, dspite the fact that she's a porn star...

Although, if all the other sexual accusations didn't bring Trump down, I don't think this will, unless it's particularily nasty or happens to verify the rumored pee tape from that dossier.

[martinuzz]

Will he then be impee'd?

[smjjames]

Ha, nice pun.

He's not going to get impeached by the Republicans, not while they still have the House, and especially not when he's willing to do their every bidding.

[Starver]

I should really keep abreast of this particular scandal.

[SalmonGod]

Spoiler: Relevant.  Not stated tactically, but I can't disagree with the message. (click to show/hide)