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[MrRoboto75]

Heh. I thought "Stonewall" Jackson was the name of a US president. President "Stonewall" Jackson.

Ulysses S Grant was the one that became president.  He was an awful president IIRC, but he was president.

Stonewall Jackson was just a particularly noteworthy confederate general.  Aside from his appearance in one of the battles of bull run, I don't remember him doing much.

[EnigmaticHat]

They want to rename a school in VA that is named for a confederate war hero.
 
I don't have a problem with this. The naming of a school is usually given to support the actions and ideals of a person and/or their way of thinking. It isn't used as a teaching tool or a reminder of history like a monument can be. It's intent is instead to (for lack of a better description) set a public role model. Definitely should be someone more appropriate.
 
The problem is that schools in the area are notoriously underfunded, and the article states that the cost of changing everything could reach $750,000.

I think that's reverence same as the statue.  Plenty of people admire Rommel's military aptitude, doesn't mean we name things after him.

[smjjames]

Heh. I thought "Stonewall" Jackson was the name of a US president. President "Stonewall" Jackson.

You're thinking of Andrew Jackson.

[Dunamisdeos]

He was actually one of the greatest US military minds to ever live, along with Lee. If I'm not mistaken, Stonewall's tactical exploits are even studied overseas.

But yeah the article mentions that they are trying to crowdfund, but only got 2000$. They mention the costs as sports uniforms and equipment, etc. Some of the schools around here (when I was in high school some time ago) did need some serious repairs/upgrades, and it would bother me to some degree if they spent all this money on renaming rather than improving the facilities.

I have a kid who will be in school in a few years. Gives a new perspective to me. I do feel like I'll have no problem explaining to him why the school is named that, and I certainly don't think the name of it will lean him towards being a psycho supremacist, but I can understand the logic behind this change easily.

[Playergamer]

Heh. I thought "Stonewall" Jackson was the name of a US president. President "Stonewall" Jackson.

Ulysses S Grant was the one that became president.  He was an awful president IIRC, but he was president.

Stonewall Jackson was just a particularly noteworthy confederate general.  Aside from his appearance in one of the battles of bull run, I don't remember him doing much.

He was an amazing officer, much better than Lee, and he got shot by one of his own men on accident.

[SalmonGod]

Thanks for that rant on the internet, Frumple.  I didn't have it in me at the time to write something similar, but that's basically how I feel about it.

I think the primary limiting factor on human advancement has always been ability to communicate, and there's only two developments in history that approach the internet's level of importants on this front -- written language and the printing press.  Both of which directly coincided with massive upgrades to the human condition, but also a great deal of temporary instability as new establishments rose to conflict with old.

[smjjames]

I think the primary limiting factor on human advancement has always been ability to communicate, and there's only two developments in history that approach the internet's level of importants on this front -- written language and the printing press.  Both of which directly coincided with massive upgrades to the human condition, but also a great deal of temporary instability as new establishments rose to conflict with old.

More precisely, it's the ability to access information (and who has access to it) and the speed at which ideas could spread.

Television and radio were definetly a big change in speed of information and the ability to reach larger groups at a time, but access didn't change all that much. The internet magnified both access and speed exponentially.

[sluissa]

I think the primary limiting factor on human advancement has always been ability to communicate, and there's only two developments in history that approach the internet's level of importants on this front -- written language and the printing press.  Both of which directly coincided with massive upgrades to the human condition, but also a great deal of temporary instability as new establishments rose to conflict with old.

More precisely, it's the ability to access information (and who has access to it) and the speed at which ideas could spread.

Television and radio were definetly a big change in speed of information and the ability to reach larger groups at a time, but access didn't change all that much. The internet magnified both access and speed exponentially.

I do think we're currently struggling to adapt to that access and speed though. Internet is probably a net positive, but we've also introduced a number of problems to ourselves we're struggling to deal with.

As the world becomes more internet dependent, we'll see more instances of things like the recent series of ransomware attacks and in a world where to the average user, the internet is only one step below complete magic, and for even an expert user it's often impossible to completely understand the threats and properly protect yourself, I expect to see a lot of damage being done.

[SaberToothTiger]

I think that renaming not only a politically driven decision, but also a brilliant way of whitewashing the local history of any undesirables. It's a great idea to ignore parts of history and remove signs that the past was not as we would have liked it! I think we should go further and rename Virginia as the current name is reminiscent of history and the bloody english and that's terrible. In fact, we should stop teaching history in schools and establish a proper department to modify records in order to avoid mistakes in proles' thought! Truly, we are the harbingers of peace and prosperity!

[Lucus Casius]

I'm pretty sure having confederate monuments and buildings named after confederate generals only serves to honor the confederacy.  They don't actually teach you the details of those negative parts of history; they only serve to try spinning those parts as positive, something to be respected and emulated.

Needless to say, the Confederacy should be neither respected nor emulated.

[smjjames]

I think that renaming not only a politically driven decision, but also a brilliant way of whitewashing the local history of any undesirables. It's a great idea to ignore parts of history and remove signs that the past was not as we would have liked it! I think we should go further and rename Virginia as the current name is reminiscent of history and the bloody english and that's terrible. In fact, we should stop teaching history in schools and establish a proper department to modify records in order to avoid mistakes in proles' thought! Truly, we are the harbingers of peace and prosperity!

Nice slippery slope fallacy there.

However, I agree that the politics of it should be minimized as much as possible so that there is a honest discussion about it. Also, did anybody ask the local community and the students and teachers at the school if they wanted to change the name?

[scriver]

Heh. I thought "Stonewall" Jackson was the name of a US president. President "Stonewall" Jackson.

You're thinking of Andrew Jackson.

Yeah, I googled President Jackson to see where I had got it from. President "Stonewall" Jackson is very catchy, though, so it's no wonder I mushed the two names together.

Thanks for that rant on the internet, Frumple.  I didn't have it in me at the time to write something similar, but that's basically how I feel about it.

I think the primary limiting factor on human advancement has always been ability to communicate, and there's only two developments in history that approach the internet's level of importants on this front -- written language and the printing press.  Both of which directly coincided with massive upgrades to the human condition, but also a great deal of temporary instability as new establishments rose to conflict with old.

Unless the end result is that we actually communicate less.

[EnigmaticHat]

I think that renaming not only a politically driven decision, but also a brilliant way of whitewashing the local history of any undesirables. It's a great idea to ignore parts of history and remove signs that the past was not as we would have liked it! I think we should go further and rename Virginia as the current name is reminiscent of history and the bloody english and that's terrible. In fact, we should stop teaching history in schools and establish a proper department to modify records in order to avoid mistakes in proles' thought! Truly, we are the harbingers of peace and prosperity!

The linked article points out that the school was specifically named after Stonewall by officials, as a fuck you to people calling for desegregated schools.  Not nearly the same thing as Virginia.  Also the officials that renamed the schools in the south were likely local school board members, same as the ones proposing to change it now.  But yeah, I'm sure all the people who disagree with you are arrogant elites and all the people that agree with you are angry poor people.

Also that's not what whitewashed means in this context.  Whitewashed means lightening history, e.g. by drawing Jesus with cream cheese pale skin.  Even ignoring that Stonewall Jackson is white, renaming the school wouldn't be whitewashing.  Giving a black general credit for Stonewall's quote, that would be the correct use of the word.  Of course it never goes in that direction, hence why its called whitewashing and not a more racially generic term.

[smjjames]

I guess you could use brightwashing or lightwashing in place of whitewashing.

[SalmonGod]

I share this perspective on the confederate monument thing