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[Lord Shonus]

The Obama's former pastor was rather nasty, and would have fit in with these protestors quite well if he wasn't on the opposite end of the racial spectrum.

This is a direct quote from after the 2008 election, when asked about his relationship with the President

"[T]he Jewish vote, the A-I-P-A-C vote, that's controlling him, that would not let him send representation to the Darfur Review Conference, that's talking this craziness on this trip, cause they're Zionists, they would not let him talk to someone who calls a spade what it is."

Some other choice remarks

Uncle Clarence who sexually harassed Anita Hill, and a closeted Klan court, that is a throwback to the 19th century, handpicked by Daddy Bush, Ronald Reagan, Gerald Ford, between Clarence and that stacked court, they are about to undo Roe vs. Wade, just like they are about to un-do affirmative action. The government lied in its founding documents and the government is still lying today. Governments lie.

The government lied about inventing the HIV virus as a means of genocide against people of color. Governments lie.

The government gives them the drugs, builds bigger prisons, passes a three-strike law and then wants us to sing "God Bless America". No, no, no, not God Bless America. God damn America

[Max™]

I caught some of that presser Trump did earlier, I've never actually watched a slow motion train derailment before, it's as awful as I expected.

it would kinda require the internet be destroyed for it to actually be forgotten completely at this point. The internet never forgets.

Do you realize how fragile the internet is? I highly doubt that the current iteration of it will be a permanent fixture of human society. At some point, all this WILL be destroyed, and uncountable things will be lost forever. Just as a great many things have been lost forever in the past. Are hard drives more durable than books? Than stone engravings?

Very late response is very late.

Is it true that data storage and decay are problems that we only really just started stressing about, and still aren't worrying about appropriately? Yes.

Until then we seem to be following the route of multiple locations tracking checksums to identify and correct errors. Will we have to deal with this problem more permanently? Yes, and it will only be permanent in the sense of "not falling apart in the lifetime of the maintainers most likely" until we get to some sort of "so we decided to convert the solar system into computronium" stage.

For things to be lost so completely that not even the internet remains a viable method of checking data integrity, well, now we're talking about a beyond-nuclear-apocalypse level civilization ender, as that is one of the initial goals behind networks like this, surviving a nuclear war.

At that point does it really matter if the radioactive mutants trying to eat your flesh are neohypermegaultranazis?

[wierd]

Several mediums for geological timescale data storage have been proposed, such as special glass based storage devices that are written once using two collimated lasers to make small structural (and thus refractive index) changes to the glass in small areas inside, and use that to store digital data.

The problem is that long term data storage is very... UNPOPULAR.

Everyone wants to be able to update the data in realtime, because of reasons, (some benign, some not..) and geologically stable data storage does not permit that. As a result, most data is stored either on flash memory (due to its high access rate), or on mechanical magnetic spinny disks still.  Flash memory has a data shelf life of something like 10 years. It is basically the storage of charge states inside a crystal matrix, that can slowly discharge over time, resulting in data loss.  Here's a primer on the tech.

http://computer.howstuffworks.com/flash-memory.htm

Magnetic spinny disks you probably already know about, and magnetic hysteresis and other sources of bit flipping on the platter, are well known, and mitigated in a wide variety of ways by many different disk manufacturers, but the high density of the data on the platter makes them poor choices for seriously long term offline storage.

Not even CDR type disks are appropriate for archival data retention, as the dyes used to make the disks degrade chemically over time, and have a data storage life no greater than 20 years or so.

Basically, all the mainstream storage systems are not geared toward data retention in the event of a major decline, and the vast, VAST majority of digital data will be lost inside of a human lifetime if such a decline happens as a result.

You can blame the invisible hand of capitalism for that, along with modern business's insane fixation on being able to destroy and replace data in place for PR reasons. If humans can destroy the data quickly and easily, you can be sure as shit that mother nature can as well.

[smjjames]

Well, the most obvious thing to place data storage would be someplace where any sort of environmental factors would be minimal. That would be space, however, you have to shield it from cosmic radiation and make sure it stays in orbit or otherwise doesn't get smashed by other things.

If you don't want to just put something in orbit and have lots of shielding, the alternative is to dig inside some geologically inactive planetary body, be it a moon or a big asteroid, preferrably one without an atmosphere or a nonreactive one.

This discussion is better suited for the science thread though.

[Not good with names]

The Obama's former pastor was rather nasty, and would have fit in with these protestors quite well if he wasn't on the opposite end of the racial spectrum.

This is a direct quote from after the 2008 election, when asked about his relationship with the President

"[T]he Jewish vote, the A-I-P-A-C vote, that's controlling him, that would not let him send representation to the Darfur Review Conference, that's talking this craziness on this trip, cause they're Zionists, they would not let him talk to someone who calls a spade what it is."

Some other choice remarks

Uncle Clarence who sexually harassed Anita Hill, and a closeted Klan court, that is a throwback to the 19th century, handpicked by Daddy Bush, Ronald Reagan, Gerald Ford, between Clarence and that stacked court, they are about to undo Roe vs. Wade, just like they are about to un-do affirmative action. The government lied in its founding documents and the government is still lying today. Governments lie.

The government lied about inventing the HIV virus as a means of genocide against people of color. Governments lie.

The government gives them the drugs, builds bigger prisons, passes a three-strike law and then wants us to sing "God Bless America". No, no, no, not God Bless America. God damn America

I dunno, Clarence Thomas is a piece of shit and the CIA did invent crack cocaine then countered it with a war on drugs (Just not on its operators).  I couldn't tell you what the Darfur review council is, but I dunno, pretty much the rest of the world is getting tired with the apartheid in Israel.  I don't see anything about creating a black state or anything so I don't really see how it's up there with you know, white supremecists calling for a white revolution.

Edit: I suppose the Aids thing could be a stretch, but even if the government didn't invent it they surely ignored it for 15 years.

[Rolan7]

To be fair, it is white supremacists applauding Trump's comments.  It's worth thinking about, but it doesn't make him a white supremacist any more than Obama is an...
What's an extreme group that actually supported Obama...
That crazy reverend he used to listen to?

I think that reverend was evangelical? That's like calling evangelicals an extreme group.

I really hope this "furry fish" logic was a joke ):

Evangelicals are... overly pushy and politically-motivated in my opinion, but I certainly wouldn't call them an extremist group like Klansmen.  Or Jeremiah Wright, who barely qualifies as extreme either now that I've gone over what he said...  Well, it's a relative word that depends a lot on context.  He was really out there.

Naturally, Obama denied knowledge of Wright's old statements and generally distanced himself from those "controversial" views.
Edit:  In contrast to Trump

[smjjames]

I tried wikiiing the darfur review council and nothing came up, even a google search didn't come up with anything. I half expected conspiracy stuff to show up, but nope. There are hits for the UN Security Council and the UN Human Rights Council, so, really, only that guy knows what he's talking about.

To be fair, it is white supremacists applauding Trump's comments.  It's worth thinking about, but it doesn't make him a white supremacist any more than Obama is an...
What's an extreme group that actually supported Obama...
That crazy reverend he used to listen to?

I think that reverend was evangelical? That's like calling evangelicals an extreme group.

I really hope this "furry fish" logic was a joke ):

Evangelicals are... overly pushy and politically-motivated in my opinion, but I certainly wouldn't call them an extremist group like Klansmen.  Or Jeremiah Wright, who barely qualifies as extreme either now that I've gone over what he said...  Well, it's a relative word that depends a lot on context.  He was really out there.

Naturally, Obama denied knowledge of Wright's old statements and generally distanced himself from those "controversial" views.
Edit:  In contrast to Trump

Furry fish logic? And yeah, I wasn't being serious with calling evangelicals extremists, just going like 'one person does not equal a group' or perhaps the fallacy that one person necessarily represents the whole. Perhaps I should have used the sarcasm tag to show that I wasn't being serious with that comment. Though frumple seems to have caught onto my sarcasm.

Edit: Or rather "one radical doesn't necessarily make the whole group radical"

[Rolan7]

I know you weren't calling them extremists.  I was worried that you thought I was calling them extremists, heh.

Huh, I thought the furry fish thing was well-known, but I can't find it.  I guess my dad made up the example.  Basically a generalization fallacy:
Some animals are furry
Fish are animals
Therefore some fish must be furry

By saying Reverend Wright was extreme, I certainly didn't mean that Evangelicals are extreme.  Didn't even know he was Evangelical, heh.
(Doesn't even perfectly match the furry fish analogy, I know)

[Frumple]

... amusing thing is there's apparently a (rare, possibly now extinct?) species of fish that looks rather a lot like it has fur. Can also run into a few different species that get infected with a particular sort of mold that leaves them what amounts to furry. No fish have fur, but some fish are furry.

E: Or, in other words, always be cautious making generalisations about animals. Nature is a tricksie little jackass that likes screwing with people, and likes to always have that one gods only know what the hell one hiding in some mountain valley that just like, "Yeah, no, class commonalities can bite my scaly mammal ass."

[Egan_BW]

I'd say less "rare, possibly extinct" and more "Some guy in the seventies saw one once".

[Frumple]

The best kind of rare!

[alway]

A short history of "Extremists on both sides."
https://twitter.com/KevinMKruse/status/897600764394254337

[wierd]

I feel there is still grounds to be cautious there Alway. It is always good to be self-critical, and accepting of one's flaws, regardless of who brings attention to them. Destroying property and vandalism (since the flag story is apparently true), are both criminal offenses, performed because of PERCEIVED support from government. I feel i should not be demonized for pointing out that such acts are wrong, and should not be celebrated, and further assert that such drawing of attention is not defacto support for white nationalism, or its ilk either.  What it really is, is reminding people that what we have the RIGHT to is PEACEFUL protest, and that the law is for everyone.

I will just counter your false equivalence claim with a guilt by association claim.  The two things may not be equal in severity, but they are both criminal acts.

[Rolan7]

... amusing thing is there's apparently a (rare, possibly now extinct?) species of fish that looks rather a lot like it has fur. Can also run into a few different species that get infected with a particular sort of mold that leaves them what amounts to furry. No fish have fur, but some fish are furry.

E: Or, in other words, always be cautious making generalisations about animals. Nature is a tricksie little jackass that likes screwing with people, and likes to always have that one gods only know what the hell one hiding in some mountain valley that just like, "Yeah, no, class commonalities can bite my scaly mammal ass."

I kept getting results about "furry trout" until I added -trout to my searches.  I don't even know what that's about.  I'm going to assume troutkin and you can't stop me.

[smjjames]

I feel there is still grounds to be cautious there Alway. It is always good to be self-critical, and accepting of one's flaws, regardless of who brings attention to them. Destroying property and vandalism (since the flag story is apparently true), are both criminal offenses, performed because of PERCEIVED support from government. I feel i should not be demonized for pointing out that such acts are wrong, and should not be celebrated, and further assert that such drawing of attention is not defacto support for white nationalism, or its ilk either.  What it really is, is reminding people that what we have the RIGHT to is PEACEFUL protest, and that the law is for everyone.

I will just counter your false equivalence claim with a guilt by association claim.  The two things may not be equal in severity, but they are both criminal acts.

Whether they actually burned the flag that was on the flagpole or not is the iffy part. They burned something but it could have been a county flag that someone bought and then burned, which wouldn't be a crime in and of itself since it's technically private property.

(and yes, I know there are people who want to make flagburning equal to treason)