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[smjjames]

This is the beginning of the end.

Remember when I said this? Yeah. It's not going to take four years I think. My prediction is that significant, dare I say damning, evidence that Trump used Russia to get elected will surface from Flynn. Trump will probably get impeached and possibly tried for any number of old timey word crimes. Sedition, collusion, whatever fits the bill best. Just my inexpert opinion.

Trump getting impeached means the Mike Pence becomes president....

I think Pence is actually a worse human being than Trump.

Is Paul Ryan worse than Pence? Because if you skip over Pence, that's who is next in line of succession.

[Frumple]

Probably not, though that may have more to do with pence than paul. Possibly the better question is if ryan would do anything but run screaming into the hills if the presidency actually came for him. From what I recall he never really wanted to be in the position he is, and it's not been treating him all that well. Not 100% sure he'd do anything but say "fuck that" and resign if he was actually due to become POTUS.

... which might be a neat scenario in itself. I can't recall if the position has gone that far down the line before.

[wierd]

I dont think so. Historically, Politicians have been very good (due to selective pressure) at retaining their offices, and or, procuring and not abdicating offices/positions of power.

They also tend to be highly protective of their physical persons, for the same reasons.

This latest cadre of politicians, believing themselves untouchable, have embarked down a most peculiar avenue that is divergent from that trend, however.

[smjjames]

Probably not, though that may have more to do with pence than paul. Possibly the better question is if ryan would do anything but run screaming into the hills if the presidency actually came for him. From what I recall he never really wanted to be in the position he is, and it's not been treating him all that well. Not 100% sure he'd do anything but say "fuck that" and resign if he was actually due to become POTUS.

... which might be a neat scenario in itself. I can't recall if the position has gone that far down the line before.

It's never gone down the line any further than the VP.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

Paul Ryan ran for Veep, if you'll recall. I'm sure he'd be amazingly happy to be President, assuming the Republicans didn't figuratively/literally all kill each other trying to get appointed Speaker the second it looked like Trump and Pence were going down.

Regardless, a guy like Ryan can only dream of the blood consecration possible in a symbolic reservoir like the Oval Office. It's right up his alley assuming none of his predecessors installed any exotics sinks in the White House, which is plausible given the position.

[Baffler]

The resolute desk serves that purpose, I believe, but the back to back Clinton and Bush administrations were extremely taxing for its purpose, and rumor has it President Obama wasn't as diligent as he probably should have been in dissipating out the excess energies beyond those he added to it himself. Trump's strategy of absorbing the energies into his own doesn't seem to have produced quite the result he hoped.

Another thread on the Flynn bit, walks back a bit while providing context and circumstantial evidence.

Again, "is rumored to." You would think by now, after months of "rumors" turning out to be literally nothing that people would be more skeptical.

[PTTG??]

The resolute desk serves that purpose, I believe, but the back to back Clinton and Bush administrations were extremely taxing for its purpose, and rumor has it President Obama wasn't as diligent as he probably should have been in dissipating out the excess energies beyond those he added to it himself. Trump's strategy of absorbing the energies into his own doesn't seem to have produced quite the result he hoped.

Another thread on the Flynn bit, walks back a bit while providing context and circumstantial evidence.

Again, "is rumored to." You would think by now, after months of "rumors" turning out to be literally nothing that people would be more skeptical.

Ah yes, people do tend to give unsupported rumors less and less credence as time goes on. That's why Hillary is president.

[Frumple]

Hey, baff said months, not decades. Maybe it's some sort of inverted bell curve.

[Max™]

Still digesting this long piece, but one thing jumped out at me;

[...]Bannon is very smart[...]

...oh fuck, I think Bannon is patient zero for a mutated infectious strain of Dunning-Kruger effect. It must have gestated in the rich petri dish of ignorance that is Donnyshitbag and now it's started infecting others, except unlike the normal DK effect, this one makes people think Bannon is anything but a pseudo-intellectual twat.

It's a shame, I liked this planet, but really we should just lift off and RKKV the crust off, check back in a few million years and see how it's doing.

[PTTG??]

Does anyone know of an independent report of the protester/counter-protester fight? They are all either "Vigilant Patriots Deliver Swift and Just Vengeance to Traitors" or "Traitors Punished Swiftly and Justly by Vigilant Patriots."

[Wolfhunter107]

Like, just about every mainstream report out there? Heck, I haven't found a single report that's biased towards either side, let alone towards the pro-Tump people.

[misko27]

Tough times for the Trump Administration. Highlights from the article:

• Trump's style of blaming people has apparently spread to his Administration, and created an atmosphere of fear and betrayal.
• Reince Priebus apparently is under fire internally due to having a vast network of loyalists, including individuals like Sean Spicer, and this network is blamed for being quick to defend him, and slow to defend Trump
• Scott Pruitt, EPA Administrator, is blamed by several for not moving fast enough to enact the Trump Agenda (read: gut the agency), leading some to accuse him of harboring his own agenda.
• Complaints by donors upset with the slow pace of change, incompetence, or strange direction; in particular Sheldon Adelson is upset about certain Obama-era officials remaining in office despite being disliked by the Israel lobby.
• Other targets internally include the President's political team, it's communication team, the office of political affairs, Jarad Kushner (Trump's son-in-law) and others. Much of the grousing comes from Trump loyalists, mad that there are RNC people taking up various positions (who are accused of disloyalty).

But then there's this very interesting bit at the end of the article:

Yet the blame game is taking a toll on an exhausted White House. At the highest levels of the West Wing, the mood has grown so tense that staffers have begun calling up reporters inquiring whether other senior aides are leaking damaging information about them.

"The various warring fiefdoms and camps within the White House are constantly changing and are so vast and complicated in their nature,” said one former Trump campaign aide, “that there is no amount of reporting that could accurately describe the subterfuge, animosity and finger-pointing that is currently happening within the ranks of the senior staff."

The internal dynamics of that administration must be something to behold.

[Playergamer]

Don't forget "Traitorous Patriots Punish Vigilant Warriors of Justice."

And the answer is there isn't an unbiased report. There's no real way of actually knowing who started it, or who escalated it, so pretty much every story is written according to author bias.

Although the guys I disagree with definitely started it.

[smjjames]

Tough times for the Trump Administration. Highlights from the article:

• Trump's style of blaming people has apparently spread to his Administration, and created an atmosphere of fear and betrayal.

We did see a glimpse of this style of management of his over the campaign.

• Reince Priebus apparently is under fire internally due to having a vast network of loyalists, including individuals like Sean Spicer, and this network is blamed for being quick to defend him, and slow to defend Trump

Rumor is that knives are out for Gary Cohn as well.

• Other targets internally include the President's political team, it's communication team, the office of political affairs, Jarad Kushner (Trump's son-in-law) and others. Much of the grousing comes from Trump loyalists, mad that there are RNC people taking up various positions (who are accused of disloyalty).

But then there's this very interesting bit at the end of the article:

Yet the blame game is taking a toll on an exhausted White House. At the highest levels of the West Wing, the mood has grown so tense that staffers have begun calling up reporters inquiring whether other senior aides are leaking damaging information about them.

"The various warring fiefdoms and camps within the White House are constantly changing and are so vast and complicated in their nature,” said one former Trump campaign aide, “that there is no amount of reporting that could accurately describe the subterfuge, animosity and finger-pointing that is currently happening within the ranks of the senior staff."

The internal dynamics of that administration must be something to behold.

Yeah, I'm imagining a cross between Game of Thrones and House of Cards, I've never watched either, but I know that both of them involve very high levels of palace intrigue. With Game of Thrones being 'Watch your back ALL THE TIME' level. Probably the only person that ISN'T a target is Trump himself.

I wonder how it compares to past adminstrations? There's always going to be some infighting, yeah, but if there was any in Obamas WH, it rarely surfaced in public. There was definetly some in Bush 43's WH. But those two are stable as heck by all appearances compared to what we're seeing with Trump.

538 did a thing on the power centers/factions in the Trump admin. about three weeks ago. Not sure if the bureaucrats count as a faction, but point is, there are many power centers and Trump apparently fosters cutthroat competition between the factions. And he loves it.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

538 did a thing on the power centers/factions in the Trump admin. about three weeks ago. Not sure if the bureaucrats count as a faction, but point is, there are many power centers and Trump apparently fosters cutthroat competition between the factions. And he loves it.

In terms of apparent influence, I'd rank them:

1. Trump Family (nepotist to the end, made at least one direct policy change based on a suggestion from Ivanka, incest is truly a force to be feared)

2. Wall Street (AHCA written by insurance executives, tax corruption policy focus, not sure how NAFTA interacts with these people)

3. Bannon (travel ban attempts, anti-China, getting some vibes from the SCOTUS nominee)

4. McCain (hates McCain himself but Trump goes out of his way to suck off the military, was insistent on McMaster, also Mattis but he and McMaster both seem to be outside the Trumpsphere^TM and I foresee there being Problems if Trump starts insisting on a God-Sorting military strategy to either.)

5. Pence (what ever happened to the First Amendment Defense Act, again? Oh, committee hell. Trump seems to avoid even pretending to care about the religious right.)

6. Party People (impending night of the long knives, believe it, also who the fuck eats cinnamon gum Trump is right on this one)

7. Bureaucrats (Trump is openly hostile to them and some of them are engaged in active subversion against the administration)