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[wierd]

The flipside of that, is unpopular, but correct, speech also gets stifled.

To combat that, you have to train yourself to still consume the offensive content, evaluate it in a cool and rational way, then either accept it despite disliking it, if it is indeed true-- or coolly rejecting it on merits, THEN show them the door.


Simply showing them the door, produces echo chambers, QED, QAnon, RedPill, et al. (more recently, "Truth", Trump's new social media platform.)

Something 'higher' than mere objection to the content, must rule the roost, or you just get a fractured society.

[EuchreJack]

Unfortunately, online communities are moving towards censorship. The Marketplace of Ideas is dying.
It was my reason for bringing up the Freedom of Speech issue, as I am well aware of the legal rights to free speech.
Free Speech is also not a universally protected right, even in the limited context of Government Action.

[EuchreJack]

Arguably, it's better to have all views on American Politics in one thread, where people can get a more balanced view of things, rather than have all the Republicans/Democrats/Europeans/etc. ejected from the thread, creating two echo chambers instead of one slightly hot thread.

I still have the ability to create threads, you know...

[Micro102]

The flipside of that, is unpopular, but correct, speech also gets stifled.

To combat that, you have to train yourself to still consume the offensive content, evaluate it in a cool and rational way, then either accept it despite disliking it, if it is indeed true-- or coolly rejecting it on merits, THEN show them the door.


Simply showing them the door, produces echo chambers, QED, QAnon, RedPill, et al. (more recently, "Truth", Trump's new social media platform.)

Something 'higher' than mere objection to the content, must rule the roost, or you just get a fractured society.

Qanon & anti-vaxxer communities grew rapidly before any sort of censorship on them happened. Censorship didn't cause that. If these groups were shown the door in the beginning, they would be nowhere near as big as they are now. I'd say it's caused by a general lack of education and critical thinking skills, followed by being exposed to a bunch of bad ideas.

I've heard a lot of people say that you need to read books on all sides of a story and that the truth is always somewhere in the middle. But if one of those books is full of truths, and one of those books is filled with lies, then you don't reach truth, you reach half lies. You need to be able to tell when someone is full of shit, and unfortunately a huge chunk of people seem incapable of doing that.

[Doomblade187]

I think they should not ban them from entering the country. They should let them in, arrest them and put them in internment camps until Putin is gone.

Speaking as a USigan, WE DO NOT WANT TO REPEAT INTERNMENT CAMPS. (Never mind that we kinda already do down at the border.)

[anewaname]

When an authoritarian leader cooperates with an external authoritarian leader, it is to bring exterior political force against interior political opponents.
 

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Trump didn't stop anything from happening with Russia. Trump cooperated with Putin's agenda and Putin cooperated with Trump's. Both gained politically against internal political opponents.

Also, Trump didn't stop anything from happening with Kim Jong-un. That was another "reality" show event.

In each cases, both authoritarian leaders gained something they could show to their people and they gained it from an external source that could not be countered by local politics. They rose themselves up politically and their political rivals could not raise themselves up the same way.

And the herd-followers say "Our herd-leader successfully fought the great foe, that is why he should be leader, and you wannabe leaders need to do it better before I will accept you as a leader".

I agree. But Biden doing nothing, nothing, nothing isn’t better.
I hate Trump, but I hated worse people criticising him for military spending — especially in light of this scenario, which I thought would happen, but China to Taiwan instead.

I never expected to be happy with with Biden, but some of the people Trump brought in horrified me. What happens when access to centralized federal databases is given to people who believe that certain segments of the population should be targeted for profiteering purposes? Trump's military spending and his demands that others increase their spending was good, but he did it for the wrong reasons. His intent was to have obedient power he could wield against internal opponents as well as external opponents.

Better idea: we should normalize calling American billionaires oligarchs too.

Yes!

[EuchreJack]

Better idea: we should normalize calling American billionaires oligarchs too.

Yes!

You misspelled Oilgarch.

The flipside of that, is unpopular, but correct, speech also gets stifled.

To combat that, you have to train yourself to still consume the offensive content, evaluate it in a cool and rational way, then either accept it despite disliking it, if it is indeed true-- or coolly rejecting it on merits, THEN show them the door.


Simply showing them the door, produces echo chambers, QED, QAnon, RedPill, et al. (more recently, "Truth", Trump's new social media platform.)

Something 'higher' than mere objection to the content, must rule the roost, or you just get a fractured society.

Qanon & anti-vaxxer communities grew rapidly before any sort of censorship on them happened. Censorship didn't cause that. If these groups were shown the door in the beginning, they would be nowhere near as big as they are now. I'd say it's caused by a general lack of education and critical thinking skills, followed by being exposed to a bunch of bad ideas.

My point about belief is relevant here.
People don't join the Qanon & anti-vaxxer movements because they're thinking critically, and they don't join because they're under-educated.  They join those movements because they want to believe them.  They're basically religious organizations.
The Qanon stuff in particular is clearly nonsense on first blush.  If you're not looking for something crazy to latch onto, you'll dump it immediately.
Anti-vax is basically people just pissed off at always being told what to do by the Government.  If the Government started saying that the Vaccine has already been given to enough people and they weren't going to bother trying to distribute it anymore, the Anti-Vaxxers would mostly fizzle out.
And people unvaccinated would be protesting the unfair Government denial of access to the vital vaccine.

[The_Explorer]

I just realized.

Russian game developers can still take money out if they are a developer on STEAM (at least if they sell trading cards and steam cash shop stuff, they get a small percentage of that income)

Steam has thus far refused to take a stance on this, meaning russians can use steam to launder money (which has been and can be done actually), which can then go to their invasion of ukraine.

I am hesitant to uninstall steam, but its making me want to. All my games are on steam sadly :|

[Random_Dragon]

I am hesitant to uninstall steam, but its making me want to. All my games are on steam sadly :|

And so is S.T.A.L.K.E.R., hecc.

[MaxTheFox]

The flipside of that, is unpopular, but correct, speech also gets stifled.

To combat that, you have to train yourself to still consume the offensive content, evaluate it in a cool and rational way, then either accept it despite disliking it, if it is indeed true-- or coolly rejecting it on merits, THEN show them the door.


Simply showing them the door, produces echo chambers, QED, QAnon, RedPill, et al. (more recently, "Truth", Trump's new social media platform.)

Something 'higher' than mere objection to the content, must rule the roost, or you just get a fractured society.

Good advice when talking to sane people, but every single single Nazi, tankie, ancap, anprim, and pedo apologist is full of shit and doesn't deserve to be heard out.

I just realized.

Russian game developers can still take money out if they are a developer on STEAM (at least if they sell trading cards and steam cash shop stuff, they get a small percentage of that income)

Steam has thus far refused to take a stance on this, meaning russians can use steam to launder money (which has been and can be done actually), which can then go to their invasion of ukraine.

I am hesitant to uninstall steam, but its making me want to. All my games are on steam sadly :|

You would have changed nothing TBH.

[Rolan7]

It's as if someone is actively panicking and saying wild shit and you go to reassure them.  "Hey, it's okay.  Take a deep breath.  You're okay."  Let the literal chemicals clear out so they can think clearly.

"Counterpoint:  Everything is fucked up and villains are out to harm you.  They are jews and gross degenerates and communists.  They did this to you."
- This is predation and I do not support it.  They have a right to speak but I reserve the right to decry any company that supports such speech.

[The_Explorer]

I just realized.

Russian game developers can still take money out if they are a developer on STEAM (at least if they sell trading cards and steam cash shop stuff, they get a small percentage of that income)

Steam has thus far refused to take a stance on this, meaning russians can use steam to launder money (which has been and can be done actually), which can then go to their invasion of ukraine.

I am hesitant to uninstall steam, but its making me want to. All my games are on steam sadly :|

You would have changed nothing TBH.

yeah, thats why ended up not partly that and all my games are on steam. I can simply just not spend more on steam, but...no one on steam seems to care, and the few posts who bring it up on steam forums, even on steam reddit get deleted lol...so I take it that steam doesn't care at all and will in fact ban people who keep posting about it. It take a site like PCgamer or kotaku to bring it up or a bigger news group, not just one nobody person. Even if I stopped buying games, more harms the developers than steam (especially indie games) and it wouldn't even be a scratch in a wave in comparison to everyone else who would keep buying games on steam.

Though in the future, maybe keeping every game on steam probably not the best thing.

[Micro102]

I mean..... if hundreds of millions of dollars of Steam cards start being traded in Russia and Steam doesn't do anything to stop that, then I'd be on board for some Steam hate. But I really doubt that is going to happen.

[TamerVirus]

The Russian economy will merge with the TF2 hat economy

[George_Chickens]

I just realized.

Russian game developers can still take money out if they are a developer on STEAM (at least if they sell trading cards and steam cash shop stuff, they get a small percentage of that income)

Steam has thus far refused to take a stance on this, meaning russians can use steam to launder money (which has been and can be done actually), which can then go to their invasion of ukraine.

I am hesitant to uninstall steam, but its making me want to. All my games are on steam sadly :|

I'm sorry, what? Are you seriously suggesting the Russian government is going to consider laundering Steam cards to fund its war? That's absurd.