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Author Topic: AmeriPol thread  (Read 4472412 times)

Dunamisdeos

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Re: AmeriPol thread
« Reply #45270 on: May 25, 2021, 01:56:51 pm »

I am not in favor of a thirty day rule. I mean c'mon. My wife was two months pregnant before she had any indication whatsoever.

Is this actually a hard 30-day rule? There are no circumstances by which you can have a legal abortion past that time? Or are there provisions?
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Maximum Spin

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Re: AmeriPol thread
« Reply #45271 on: May 25, 2021, 06:12:11 pm »

This seems to be quite the loggerheads on this issue. Is there supporting medical evidence in regards to the efficiency of the product? As it likely is a subject of medical interest, I would guess such studies abound.
Yes. The FDA regulates pregnancy tests, so it had to be studied to be put to market. Did you think I was just making things up?
See for example: https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/cdrh_docs/reviews/K060128.pdf

The general thrust of this document is that the particular kind of test in question is not less accurate than preexisting marketed tests.
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Vector

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Re: AmeriPol thread
« Reply #45272 on: May 25, 2021, 07:03:23 pm »

Is this actually a hard 30-day rule? There are no circumstances by which you can have a legal abortion past that time? Or are there provisions?

Proooooobably rape, incest, possibly nonviable fetus. Of course, proving those things when the penalty for fucking up is being charged with murder, hmm.
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Iduno

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Re: AmeriPol thread
« Reply #45273 on: May 26, 2021, 08:52:49 am »

Well, it's good to know the people who got voted in have the best interests of billionaires in mind, even if working people can't get enough money to survive.  Remember, they just cut unemployment benefits, and take them away if you don't take a minimum-wage job, after refusing to increase the minimum wage to a level that was livable 15 years ago. No money for that.

https://twitter.com/JordanUhl/status/1397265814810677255

They also appear to be okaying another big deal to sell bombs to Israel, despite them having just broken a ceasefire to kill off civilians.


Edit: About the abortion thing.They usually end up criminalizing miscarriages, because you can't really prove otherwise. Which is great for someone who is already going through trauma.
« Last Edit: May 26, 2021, 03:38:15 pm by Iduno »
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Duuvian

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Re: AmeriPol thread
« Reply #45274 on: May 26, 2021, 11:15:56 pm »

https://www.amazon.com/Clearblue-Early-Detection-Pregnancy-Test/dp/B085S5KTZL?&tag=clearblue05-20

https://www.amazon.com/Clearblue-Digital-Pregnancy-Smart-Countdown/dp/B0000B11WE/

https://www.walmart.com/search/?cat_id=0&query=clearblue+easy+digital+pregnancy+test

I'm not selling these, I swear!

It appears online shopping is preferable as far as cost goes. That's the one the study was done on.

What would be a logical cycle of testing using that product to accurately detect a pregnancy within the window allowed? In other words, how often would the product have to be used to reliably  achieve one of it's functions? I think this would require mathematics, far from my specialty.
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Vector

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Re: AmeriPol thread
« Reply #45275 on: May 27, 2021, 12:17:44 am »

Looks like ... it's a 71% accuracy rate anyway, at least for the first one on your list.

Guys.

This is not a good plan.
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Duuvian

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Re: AmeriPol thread
« Reply #45276 on: May 27, 2021, 12:57:29 am »

I also found this in the comments:


"Question:
about how accurate are the weeks the product gives you?
Answer:
The ones that claim they count how far along you are in weeks is completely a sham. Medical professionals measure pregnancy based on the last day of your last cycle, meaning by you next missed period you would be a month pregnant no matter when you conceived. There is litterally no way to tell someone is "2 weeks pregnant" when implantation can happen around that time. You really need a medical PROFESSIONAL to tell you how far along you are not a pee stick made in bulk by machines in some factory. Good luck!"

EDIT: Quotes around the copy paste from comments. I do not know if it is fair reasoning or not, but it makes sense to a simple man such as myself in my ignorance, perhaps.
I know next to nothing about menstruation, past that it happens sometimes to be honest, and is nicknamed "a monthly" at times of convenience. If the test is only usable 4 or 6 days before the next expected "period", with 99% accuracy only after the expected day, wouldn't that make determining pregnancy and scheduling an appointment within a 30 day window quite difficult? I must assume that appointments would take time to set up, unless it is much more streamlined than usual medical appointments.

EDIT2: I may be misunderstanding the comment. Maybe there is a counter in these digital tests to guess how far along the pregnancy is. However I do think it raises a valid argument about the window of time, possibly, and further necessitates a cycle of usage of the product should a woman be sexually active without desiring pregnancy, likely with the additional use of contraceptives I would assume but perhaps not always.

Thus it would still be useful to the discussion to determine a theoretically effective cycle of use, even if one must ignore for now what appears may be a potential for a very short window of action left open, though I am not quite sure of that yet without further insight from a greater mind on what that window would be exactly. However, I must say: ugh math, surely someone here enjoys it more than I do? There may be some variables to figure in to the equation, and perhaps it would be fair to give a reasonable example as well as the extremes if such turns out to be possible. However variables such as how times of fertility would effect a cycle of usage are beyond me, thus I suggest the extreme example of a simpler cycle of usage would be easier to figure out though of less utility. I am poorly equipped to understand such variables intimately, and so with my current knowledge I would be limited to a less functional example of calculating how often the testing would need to overlap to achieve efficiency without including things such as times of fertility; and on top of that I would likely fudge my math along the way somehow since I don't do math very often, thus my request for a mathematically inclined person to advise us.
« Last Edit: May 27, 2021, 01:36:02 am by Duuvian »
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wierd

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Re: AmeriPol thread
« Reply #45277 on: May 27, 2021, 01:46:06 am »

This is all straight up perception management from the GOP, as they clutch their pearls in moral panic.



I have my own hot take, but I believe I can qualify it a lot better than these tools can.


I am of the opinion that if you have gotten 2 abortions prior, you need a mandatory consult.  This is not because I think you need to be harassed about your choice(+) for a 3rd abortion, but because the statistics* are highly favoring your being coerced into unprotected sex, if you meet that criteria-- and identifying you so that you can be protected from your abuser is rather important.

+ I am WELL aware that this looks like a dogwhistle, goddamn it.  I am WELL aware that fucking idiot GOP motherfuckers will use it as an opportunity to do nefarious shit also, However, ignoring the problem that festers from not doing the consult is fucking monstrous.

* (1)(2)(3) I think you get the damn idea.


To me, that is a sensible intervention in abortion statistic rate, that is well supportable as a position.

Trying to make it functionally impossible to get the abortion, just to appease some bullshit religious objection to "Killing babies!",  can go die in a dumpster fire full of hot burning bacon grease.
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Vector

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Re: AmeriPol thread
« Reply #45278 on: May 27, 2021, 02:00:46 am »

I'm gonna put out there that every single time I visit a gynecologist I have to fill out an intake form divulging my complete history of domestic violence and types of domestic violence I have experienced, number of abortions, miscarriages, and live births I have had, what forms of birth control I use, whether and with whom I am sexually active, the date of my last period (I have to give this for juuuuust about every meeting with any doctor I have, including things like "getting a vaccine"), and whether my partner and I have any disagreement about that birth control. Also use of cigarettes, alcohol, and exercise.

Rather than requiring consultation when trying to get an abortion, I would focus on expanding access to gynecology. Right now it's considered to be under the category of "specialist care" and is therefore not always covered by health insurance.
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Rolan7

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Re: AmeriPol thread
« Reply #45279 on: May 27, 2021, 02:03:49 am »

avsdf
Pff Alright fam, from my also non-breeding perspective that looks pretty alreight!

Here in the real world, we have to keep talking about unwanted pregnancies.  Which are much more likely when education is DENIED.  And when legitimate options aren't available, hedge-witches find a way. :+1:

Except that hedge-magick is shitty, so if you moralistic people care about women at all, you'll support their rights to proper care.

Religion doesn't have to mean amoral.

This said in response to Wierd who I know is... well, I don't know.
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wierd

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Re: AmeriPol thread
« Reply #45280 on: May 27, 2021, 02:05:02 am »

I did not clarify-- I am including early pharmacist provide chemical abortions in the "needs consult" demographic-- so that if you go and ask for plan B a lot, you need to do the consult.  This is not just the clinical visit kind.


As for insurance needing to be fucking nuked and told that it fucking *WILL* cover basic healthcare, yes-- I am all for that. Yes, Gynecology is necessary for women. Urology is necessary for men.  Those fucks can just get over their bean counting assfuckery.
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Vector

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Re: AmeriPol thread
« Reply #45281 on: May 27, 2021, 02:15:34 am »

The first thing I did when Trump came into power was call my parents, who were on the way to visiting me, to pick up two orders of Plan B at the pharmacist in case Things Escalated Quickly. One was in case I was raped, the other one was so that if a friend was raped, I wouldn't have to make a hard choice.

I didn't end up needing either of them and they have subsequently been donated to a Planned Parenthood when Biden was voted in (they were going to expire within the next year).

Other thing is that, to buy that stuff OTC, if you wanna keep track of it, then you have to have your ID in order. Having your ID in order so that they know if you're gorging on Plan B is -- a barrier to accessing voting, and therefore -- would present a barrier to accessing health care among the poorest and especially among teens, and therefore therefore --
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"The question of the usefulness of poetry arises only in periods of its decline, while in periods of its flowering, no one doubts its total uselessness." - Boris Pasternak

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pronouns: prefer neutral ones, others are fine. height: 5'3".

wierd

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Re: AmeriPol thread
« Reply #45282 on: May 27, 2021, 02:46:33 am »

That is an issue with having IDs being available, not with contraception.  Fix it where the fix is appropriate.

Giving a blind eye because "Restricts access (due to other outstanding problem)!", allows "My abusive boyfriend stockpiles plan B, rapes me practically daily, and has me take the stuff religiously because he does not want child support" as a thing.  See also, all those damn statistics.

See also, the whole Gaetz sex abuse shit, where one of the girls asserted that the perv had "A cabinet full of Plan B".

That is the flipside to "No questions asked."
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Duuvian

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Re: AmeriPol thread
« Reply #45283 on: May 27, 2021, 05:55:01 am »

Whoah I'm reading that and it's the most detailed coverage of that I've seen; and holy shit that guy way crazier than I thought from the coverage I saw on CNN

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I mean it was kind of crazy before I read that but I figured hey someone used the internet poorly and for a certainly questionable purpose, but he was actually handing out fake IDs? That's like the Wonka Golden Ticket if I grudgingly am forced to embarrisingly remember my teenage years somewhat. I think plenty of comedies aimed at young adults can prove my point.

EDIT: Haha, it would be like if Charlie of the Chocolate Factory had to fornicate with the Factory owner to get the factory. I laugh because of the analogy to a beloved character. This is an example of why I don't think I could make commercials for television, as it's funny but not really if you think about it. However, I'd laugh at it at first glance. Like a family guy skit.

EDIT@: Wow nice job DailyBeast (I got them mixed up, I don't read either) or whoever if that's reliable info. In fact because I made the mixup I did just check this but

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/daily-beast/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Daily_Beast

While I can vouch for wikipedia being exceedingly useful, I don't know if mediabiasfactcheck might actually, ironically, be biased, but I don't know that it isn't the case either without spending more time than it's worth to find out. Such is the internet.
« Last Edit: May 27, 2021, 06:47:34 am by Duuvian »
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wierd

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Re: AmeriPol thread
« Reply #45284 on: May 27, 2021, 07:06:13 am »

The reliability of the reporting is not easily quantifiable at this time.

We will have a more complete picture after the investigation and any associated court procedings, once records are unsealed.

However, the providence of fake IDs has been confirmed by other news sources, as well as the plea bargain information from the man Gaetz used to procure young women for his... purposes...

I can find such sources later; i am currently doing my grocery shopping. :)

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