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Author Topic: Birth of the Bureaucracy (6/∞), Turn 6  (Read 15515 times)

DontBanTheMan

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Re: Birth of the Bureaucracy (5/∞)
« Reply #180 on: February 28, 2017, 06:00:01 pm »

Well, seeing as conversation has died down I figure it's time for the

Action Phase

(( I might make another thread for Senate Discussion, to keep the Gov. Meeting and the Senate Meeting separate while still progressing the game at a decent pace. Vivalas (thanks, I appreciate it!) and Playergamer, both sheets are approved and you are now in the game effective immediately. ))
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Vivalas

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Re: Birth of the Bureaucracy (5/∞)
« Reply #181 on: February 28, 2017, 08:38:43 pm »

"Greetings fellow officials of the state, I've been quite sick since the revolution but my doctors assure me I'm in good health now. I have read the transcripts of your meetings while stuck in a hospital bed, and I have a lot to say.

First of all, I would like to note that we can't have a proper government and a banner with which to rally our citizens behind without a flag. And in my bedrest I commissioned an artist to draft a bunch of flags, and one of them particularly caught my mind.


Spoiler (click to show/hide)

((I have plenty more options we could vote on, feel free to suggest your own, once I have access to a computer I'll throw a small list up, all of them are pretty good.))

There was quite a few more ones I liked, but that one in particular was the simplest and most symbolic of them all. The star stands for our nation, Estrella, and the red and white bands are the blood and resulting unity that make us who we are. Finally, the blue is the open space of the sky, symbolizing the infinite potential we have to expand and spread our republican values.

Now on to the more important stuff, our civil systems. First off, could I request a basic overview of our current education, legal, and healthcare systems? They're most likely in shambles as a result of chatoic mismanagement and the revolt, but I would like a basic idea before I go and do a detailed survey of my ministry.

I would also like to begin laying out my idea for legal reform. First of all, I want to split off the section with laws into a separate two-part document: the Legal Charter of Estrella. The first part of the charter will be the Legal Code of Estrella, explaining the workings of our judicial system and the rights of our citizens. The next part, the Penal Code, will be the list of all crimes and infractions in our lands. I haven't drafted this document yet, but if you like the idea, I shall begin immediately.

And finally, I plan to establish a proper court system for Estrella. My plan is for each province to have a circuit court for all legal disputes, each state to have a higher appelate court for criminal and civil case appeals, and for all criminal crimes to be tried in district courts based out of courthouses situated in each city. The appelate and circuit courts would be based in the state capitals. The judges will all be officials elected from their jursidictions, reviewed by a panel headed by the Ministry of Civil Service and supervised by me, to ensure they all have the proper experience.

In addition, each appelate court will elect a chief justice from among themselves, these chief justices will have executive privileges but also be able to be convened as a Supreme Court of Estrella for instances of appeals going higher than the state courts. This court shall serve as the final say for all legal suits in our lands.

I shall assume the responsibility of providing legal representation for Estrella when the nation is sued in court. If the Dictator wishes of course we may revoke this right. In the event I am unable to attend the court due to workload, I will be able to appoint a qualified attorney to do so in my steed.

This and other provisions will go into the final charter when / if it is drafted, I would just like to hear your opinions. I will also propose reforms to education and healthcare once I get the word on that from our lovely government bureaucrats.
"

@DontBanTheMan, alright, including my IC questions, how exactly does creating subordinate assets to other assets work? In my example, such as creating courts under a state or province, would that be added weight for the manager of that asset, or not unless they supervise it directly? Also who has the power to do that, the minister of law (me?), the Dictator (since they run the state / province etc.)?

Actions:
1. Start a detailed survey and inventory of our healthcare system.
2. Start a detailed survey and inventory of the legal system.
3. Start a detailed survey and inventory of our education system.

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"On two occasions I have been asked,—"Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out?" I am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question."
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DontBanTheMan

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Re: Birth of the Bureaucracy (5/∞)
« Reply #182 on: February 28, 2017, 10:47:14 pm »

@DontBanTheMan, alright, including my IC questions, how exactly does creating subordinate assets to other assets work? In my example, such as creating courts under a state or province, would that be added weight for the manager of that asset, or not unless they supervise it directly? Also who has the power to do that, the minister of law (me?), the Dictator (since they run the state / province etc.)?
(( Think of Assets as anything you directly oversee. If it isn't your asset, you cannot directly control it, and actions have a chance of being misrepresented. The higher down the chain of subordinates it is, the less under your direct supervision it is. For example: say you have a president (commander in chief), general, and various commanders until you arrive at last at the individual level. Though the president is technically in command of every individual soldier, he does not deal with them. He also doesn't deal with tactics; he directs strategy. That's really the difference between subordinates and assets; subordinates are so you can direct an overall strategy, while assets are managed tactically. The president wouldn't micromanage the barracks layout of each individual unit; that's what his subordinates are for.

Assets are like that, but on a broader level. So though Taricus is directly overseeing six units, he still doesn't deal with every individual soldier. He is, however, capable of overseeing every aspect of their training, equipment, etc. If he had a subordinate dealing with them, he'd tell the subordinate generally what he wanted (ex.: Imperial Unit), and then the subordinate would deal with the training, equipment, etc. as he saw fit.

Now for the situation you asked about.  Let's say there's ten provinces, each with three courts. If each court is considered an asset, if you directly oversaw all thirty courts that would be thirty assets. If you put one person in charge of each province's courts, that'd be ZERO assets you'd manage, three assets each manager would manage, and TEN subordinates that you would manage (too many). If you then got three "area" managers to manage 3-3-4 managers each, that would leave you with three subordinates and zero assets, each area manager with 3-3-4 subordinates, and each manager with three assets. However, your direct control over the courts would be much less than if you directly oversaw them - though you could direct policy and the like with your control over the area managers, you wouldn't be able to direct individual courtrooms or individual cases. This could be alleviated by the appeals courts you mentioned; if you added appeals courts, it would depend on who managed which. Say each province had an appeals court, each area had one, and the nation had one. This would give each manager, area manager, and yourself an extra asset to manage. This has the upside of filtering all the very important cases directly to you without overloading your assets. Though you still wouldn't have much control over every single case, that doesn't really matter too much as you'd be directing policy and the like with your appeals court and your picks for area managers.

Now, would each court be an asset? Eh. Depends on how large they are. Assets are generally decided by how much you can personally deal with. The most skilled bureaucrat in the world doesn't have the time or attention to deal with everything all at once. The more cases there are, the more overloaded each individual asset would get. Agencies that are too large will eventually need to split into multiple assets, as they become too large to manage effectively. Assets can never be too small, but the maximum size is variable (largely dependent on the number of employees, number of clients, and amount of work required to maintain them). ))
« Last Edit: February 28, 2017, 10:49:27 pm by DontBanTheMan »
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Taricus

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Re: Birth of the Bureaucracy (5/∞)
« Reply #183 on: March 01, 2017, 01:52:44 am »

"Ah, welcome then Jasso. Now the flag is... well, it's suffice barring an alternative to it.

Now, legal wise I'm not the most experienced person, but the courts you refer to as the first call of justice would be district courts. The circuit court would have to be mobile in order to tend to the smaller settlements outside of the cities. Furthermore, the judges are to be appointed, not elected. I want to ensure that we've got competent personnel in as judges; if they want to be elected into government they can run for the senate. Furthermore, there should a high court beneath the supreme court, to act as a filter an allow for any crimes trialled at that level to have a means of appealing the decision. Additionally the court system must be an inquisitorial system; we don't need the average person thinking the court of law is an opponent rather than just trying to get to the bottom of things.

Finally, two things, one is that I am the supreme court, and thus the ultimate arbiter of law. Secondly, under no circumstances is legal precedence to have any formal status within the legal system, if it does crop up I might start setting a precedent for for any judge or minister advocating it to die a horrific death."
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Zanzetkuken The Great

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Re: Birth of the Bureaucracy (5/∞)
« Reply #184 on: March 01, 2017, 04:26:13 pm »

Personal Actions:
1) Set aside one-fifth of the money given by the Dictator for expanding the Taxation Service, to be distributed to each of the establishment efforts performed by Bendt Vacek and Aser Winther as an backup fund in case their original allotment runs low.
2) When the taxes are being collected, have the Ministry of the Economy form a report stating how much wealth we had collected and the new annual cost of the Taxation Service.


Bendt Vacek Orders:
1) Use one-fifth the money given by the Dictator for expanding the Taxation Service to fully establish the Taxation Service in State C so the tax code applies to as many citizens in that state as possible.
2) Use one-fifth the money given by the Dictator for expanding the Taxation Service to fully establish the Taxation Service in State 4 so the tax code applies to as many citizens in that state as possible.


Aser Winther Orders:
1) Use one-fifth the money given by the Dictator for expanding the Taxation Service to fully establish the Taxation Service in State 2 so the tax code applies to as many citizens in that state as possible.
2) Use one-fifth the money given by the Dictator for expanding the Taxation Service to fully establish the Taxation Service in State 3 so the tax code applies to as many citizens in that state as possible.




(You wanted work on the Taxation Service.  You're getting work on the Taxation Service.)
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Vivalas

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Re: Birth of the Bureaucracy (5/∞)
« Reply #185 on: March 01, 2017, 08:57:41 pm »

Just some more flag ideas (I personally like the first one the best):
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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"On two occasions I have been asked,—"Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out?" I am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question."
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The Imperial Question | Stranded Among Stars

Zanzetkuken The Great

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Re: Birth of the Bureaucracy (5/∞)
« Reply #186 on: March 01, 2017, 09:12:47 pm »

Just some more flag ideas (I personally like the first one the best):
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

(Wonder if it wouldn't be a good idea for DontBanTheMan to make the Senate thread, and having the decision of a flag being its first debate topic.)
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Taricus

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Re: Birth of the Bureaucracy (5/∞)
« Reply #187 on: March 01, 2017, 09:13:41 pm »

((Last one looks good and is pretty neat. And has none of that eye-searing red as well. A separate senate thread would make it harder to co-ordinate things though. ))
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Zanzetkuken The Great

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Re: Birth of the Bureaucracy (5/∞)
« Reply #188 on: March 01, 2017, 09:16:50 pm »

((Last one looks good and is pretty neat. And has none of that eye-searing red as well. A separate senate thread would make it harder to co-ordinate things though. ))

(Exactly like real government!   :P)
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Taricus

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Re: Birth of the Bureaucracy (5/∞)
« Reply #189 on: March 01, 2017, 10:17:01 pm »

((Point, still, game needs to be somewhat easy to co-ordinate, at least for DBTM's sake :P ))

Action one: Scientific and engineering recruitment: Recruit the engineer studying flight under wing and provide up to 8 wealth in financing experiments and prototypes.
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Zanzetkuken The Great

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Re: Birth of the Bureaucracy (5/∞)
« Reply #190 on: March 01, 2017, 11:31:46 pm »

((Point, still, game needs to be somewhat easy to co-ordinate, at least for DBTM's sake :P ))

Action one: Scientific and engineering recruitment: Recruit the engineer studying flight under wing and provide up to 8 wealth in financing experiments and prototypes.

(Aren't we only working with 1700s tech (Stated here)?  It isn't until around 1804 that the first steam locomotive was figured out and another eight years before a practical design was figured out.  How are we going to make aircraft beyond spotting balloons?)
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Taricus

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Re: Birth of the Bureaucracy (5/∞)
« Reply #191 on: March 01, 2017, 11:33:22 pm »

((Found the flight engineer last turn in a PMed action. And to be honest I have no idea on the time period save that it's around 1700s to 1800s so... ))
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Zanzetkuken The Great

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Re: Birth of the Bureaucracy (5/∞)
« Reply #192 on: March 01, 2017, 11:44:42 pm »

((Found the flight engineer last turn in a PMed action. And to be honest I have no idea on the time period save that it's around 1700s to 1800s so... ))

(Either way, the first actual plane wasn't invented until 1903, and the first dirigibles weren't until 1843.  Even if we get tail end of the 1700s, we're still at least forty years of industrialization advances off from there, so if this guy manages to pull either of those off, I'm going to be curious as to how the hell he did it.)
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Taricus

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Re: Birth of the Bureaucracy (5/∞)
« Reply #193 on: March 01, 2017, 11:52:14 pm »

((Steampunk probably. Mind, they hasn't actually built anything functional yet as they're still working on it))
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Zanzetkuken The Great

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Re: Birth of the Bureaucracy (5/∞)
« Reply #194 on: March 02, 2017, 12:06:16 am »

((Steampunk probably. Mind, they hasn't actually built anything functional yet as they're still working on it))

(Maybe, but we're still at the stage where steam power's a bit weak, and unless we're placed near the end of the century, we're still a ways off from even the most basic road vehicle (1801) or locomotive (1804).  It would be neat if it works, but if it does, I'll have questions.)
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It's Zanzetkuken The Great. He's a goddamn wizard-dragon. He will make it so, and it will forever be.
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<DozebomLolumzalis> you filthy god-damn ninja wizard dragon
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