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[Werdna]

My favorite opening move for a "fast" embark (useful to get underground in minimum ticks) is to channel a tile down 2z near the wagon, then have the digger expand a small starter room at 2z around it (to avoid tree root problems).  Designate a dump zone over the channeled tile, then have the other dwarves mass-dump the entire contents of the wagon down into that hole.  I designate a food stockpile on the pile at the bottom to keep it from spoiling.  Use d-o-r to make sure nobody walks under the crap-storm and set up a separate, proper entrance to the room - don't use the hole as an entrance.  When you're done, mass-unforbid on the pile to recover food/booze/needed items, and floor/hatch over the hole.  Don't mass-reclaim the pile until the wagon is empty though, unless you fancy a thirsty dwarf cushioning your anvil's fall with his soft head...

The end result is a mass QSP of all your stuff, underground, that you can now build your workshops around.

[mirrizin]

I like to plan a lot of my digging from the start, using the "prioritize" to set it all for 7, then tunnel through it using higher priorities to make sure that the farms and key workshops get dug out first. Often it takes a few years for my miners to work through it all, which keeps them rather busy.

[Thorfinn]

Immortal, I wasn't trying to be a jerk. I'm just not sold on above-ground forts. Maybe it's just I was doing them wrong. What's the advantage? Re: wheelbarrow, it's not the log, which since the addition of bigger trees are pretty much free, it's the time the dwarf spends making it. If I weren't on a beeline for magma, it wouldn't be that big of a deal, but I immediately lose 1/7th of my dwarves, more if I hit an aquifer. It's not that I can't handle it, rather that instead of maybe having a magma shop near the surface about the same time as the first immigrant wave, it happens about the time of the first caravan, or maybe thereafter.

callisto, if I had a nickel for every time the darned cook snatched up the seeds to the garden vegetables and cooked up all my plump helmets... One would think I'd eventually learn to do this, but somehow I rarely remember.

Sanctume, those look like interesting opens. Better than what I've tried, to be sure. But before I can get everything buttoned up, I encounter too much fun. If I'm visualizing it right, the 11x11 requires 40 walls, 40 fortifications and 157 floors, for instance. Most of the time, there shouldn't be fliers, but the gods of random do not smile on me. Do you convert blocks you bring along, or do you try to do it with on-site wood?

Werdna, over the last couple days, I've tried that a dozen times or so, and so far, it's taken longer than just channeling under and roofing over. Now, granted, you end up with everything QSP'd, which is a big bonus, though most of my embark goods will go away once the cook starts, um, cooking. The big advantage to channeling under is you end up with a region that's ready for surface crops.

mirrizin, great idea. I need to make better use of priorities. But lordy, I can't plan that far ahead. Until I know where the stone is, and, as importantly, where the aquifer is, any medium to long term planning is by gosh and by golly.


The embark I've just started on, I have everything I need and all the skills I want. I bought up all the "free" barrels and bags. However, no magnetite, hematite or limonite, no lignite or bituminous. No iron goods available, though there is steel, both bars and armor/weapons. The only flux is marble, the only magma-safe is quartzite, the only ores sphalerite, galena and tetrahedrite. (Maybe it's a sign I'm not supposed to run for the magma this time.) How would you spend the remaining 700+ points?

[EDIT]
Strikethrough doesn't work?
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[EDIT2]
Oh, this promises to be a happy little burrow. Six are at least "somewhat quarrelsome", two think that merrymaking is evil while three find merrymaking and partying worthwhile activities, four are intolerant of people with different ways, five are quick to form negative views, and only one can "handle stress".
[EDIT2]

[Werdna]

Hmm, maybe I didn't describe it well enough.  The only part you channel is the hole next to the wagon for the fast QSP.  At the bottom, adjacent to the hole I dig (not channel) a "starter room" in the soil where my dwarves typically spend their first year or more, depending on what sort of fort I am really planning.  I also create a separate entrance to keep dwarves out of the hole.  When I am done I roof the QSP to prevent entry from invaders.  This method is very useful in hostile biomes because it gets everybody inside fast.

Now, channeling down and roofing over is a solid plan to avoid cave adaptation, but as you noticed it is pretty labor-intensive.  Since my dwarves spend the first year mostly outside throwing up a palisade, chopping trees, collecting fruit, bridging rivers, digging a moat, and landscaping, I don't worry about cave adaptation until a few years in.  I will point out that the big advantage of above-ground forts is that cave adaptation is an order of magnitude more manageable.

I recently tried a new embark and forgot a few 'gotchas' about this QSP method - big one is, you have to go into (o)rders and enable dumping of outdoor "refuse" or they'll ignore it.  Sounds like you figured that one out.  Minor ones are, don't mark sand bags for dumping because it dumps the sand, unless you're intentionally doing so to get at the cheap bags.  I also don't dump the seeds - I don't think the dwarves dump these bags out, but I do usually have a farmer planting a farm during the dumping, so I want them available during that time.  I always stick a seed-only no-barrel stockpile next to the farm plots to speed that up.

[Thorfinn]

That's basically what I understood you to say.

Maybe the difference is that I take every "free" barrel, even a barrel of one mosquito brain. True, someone might hate mosquitoes, but it's not likely that's the barrel of cooked food he will choose. I top it off with a couple hundred logs or stone, so it's a huge pile to move, 6 or more deep on most of the whole 5x5. Channeling under it takes less time than moving it all, and in the mean time, the rest of the dwarves have been bringing back wood, or harvesting plants, or maybe hunting, as well as building floors as soon as they are channeled under.

I'm tempted to try it with a more conventional start. With a smaller pile of goods, it seems it would work great.

[Garrie]

I like to plan a lot of my digging from the start, using the "prioritize" to set it all for 7, then tunnel through it using higher priorities to make sure that the farms and key workshops get dug out first. Often it takes a few years for my miners to work through it all, which keeps them rather busy.

I like this concept.

[anewaname]

The embark I've just started on, I have everything I need and all the skills I want. I bought up all the "free" barrels and bags. However, no magnetite, hematite or limonite, no lignite or bituminous. No iron goods available, though there is steel, both bars and armor/weapons. The only flux is marble, the only magma-safe is quartzite, the only ores sphalerite, galena and tetrahedrite. (Maybe it's a sign I'm not supposed to run for the magma this time.) How would you spend the remaining 700+ points?

My 3x3 embarks always have flux in one of the biomes, so when the ore options on embark are limited, I plan on trade/invader/mining to obtain iron and copper and ignore the expensive steel bars. I take about 10 tetrahedrite to get some early silver for weapons to sell in the first year and then spend a lot on sphalerite, bismuthinite, and cassiterite, most of which sits idle until I get to the magma. Copper always shows up from invaders, traders, or mining, so the sphalerite is for brass mugs/tradegoods, the bismuthinite is a stone-substitute to make blocks in case I need to make a d-slit to get through the aquifer to get to more stone and the remainder is for bismuth bronze, and the cassiterite is for the bronze alloys (because if there is an iron shortage then bronze will be useful for armor). I still race for the magma for the cheap smelting costs. You could also buy 50 turkeys and butcher 40 of them in the first few months, for a large pile of meat and leather. This takes a lot of dwarf labor but if the surface is evil/untamed and there is an aquifer, it will keep some dwarfs busy while you are trying to get through the aquifer to get to stone.

[muldrake]

callisto, if I had a nickel for every time the darned cook snatched up the seeds to the garden vegetables and cooked up all my plump helmets... One would think I'd eventually learn to do this, but somehow I rarely remember.

If you don't like doing this manually, seedwatch is one of the more useful dfhack functions.  I always forget to do this manually and while it hasn't yet killed me it has certainly led to inconvenience.

[Lozzymandias]

First things first:
1) dig down.
2) hollow out first bit of my central hall. Designate meeting area
3) Mason shop
4) door.

Security established
5) gather a swathe of wild plants.

6)Then I hollow out the rest of my central hall. Once the fort is in operation it's wood storage but in the in between its a temporary camp. Build makeshift shops like a carpenter and mechanics for beds and traps, two of life's necessities.

7) start digging out the two industrial zones. Begin emptying wagon into the stockpiles in them. Dissassemble the shops and move to zones as and when.

8)parallel to that build the contents of the first 20 rooms: doors beds and cabinets

9) when enough industrial space is dug out, bedrooms, then farms.

10) drawbridge to hermitically seal the fortress since we have farms.

[Tymewalk]

I'm still pretty new, so this may not be the best plan of action.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

While paused:
1) Dig out a 3x3 area to channel into the ground.
Sometimes I'll dig into a mountain instead if that's what I'm near, but usually I channel down.
2) Designate some plants for gathering and trees to be chopped down.
3) Make sure someone has both of those.
4) Turn off the fisherdwarf's fishing skill.
5) Get a second miner.

Unpause and wait until it's channeled down into the ground. Pause again and:

6) Dig a hallway down about 20 squares.
7) Somewhere in the middle carve out the area for a trading depot.
At the end, carve out:
 - An 11x11 general stockpile
 - A 5x5 room for stairs
 - A 3x3 room for a farm plot with another 3x3 room attached to it for the brewery

After that there's no real rule to what I do, it heavily depends on what I want done first. Usually it's shops but sometimes other things take priority.

[anewaname]

I'm still pretty new, so this may not be the best plan of action.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

After that there's no real rule to what I do, it heavily depends on what I want done first. Usually it's shops but sometimes other things take priority.

This *is* the best rule.

[CyberianK]

I don't understand all those peoples here channeling into the ground I don't channel anything (but I'm a noob).
I dig 3x3 up/down stairwells 12 layers down. Can someone explain why they channel?

other moves:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Then I usually designate circular rooms dfhack /digcircle around that stairwell.
Remove wagon but let most goods liey there only small stockpiles in the beginning for selective goods so not too much hauling
Go through food options and brewing options and other fort options
first simple workshops all on the surface 2 carpenters for doing lots of wood tools I need
train dogs and put turkey in nestboxes
build wood walls around surface part later getting fortification and roof
build stone hatches for stairs
build sleep areas 11 layers down for chop noise

[King Kitteh]

I really love making large plans for my fortress with designations as my first move. By the time I start digging I know almost exactly where everything will go.

I might not even unpause the game during my first session on a new site.

[anewaname]

I don't understand all those peoples here channeling into the ground I don't channel anything (but I'm a noob).
I dig 3x3 up/down stairwells 12 layers down. Can someone explain why they channel?

Because wagons cannot roll down stairs! Most players dig stairs downward but eventually they want a trade depot and those are safer underground. Channelling has others uses as well, like those deep pits that you dump things into and safely digging a path for magma and water.

[StagnantSoul]

1: Decide which quarter of the map my fortress will inhabit.
2: Designate a mineshaft going 20 z's downwards in the opposite quarter.
3: Make a cross pattern of tree mining and stone smoothing in the middle of the map, which will eventually be a stone road.
4: Turn on either Diggy Diggy Hole or Panzerkampf.
5: Play.