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Author Topic: Can building destroyer destroy bridges, walls, floors, grates and hatch covers?  (Read 5548 times)

ringringlingling

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Can building destroyer destroy bridges, walls, floors, grates and hatch covers?
« on: November 01, 2016, 12:12:10 pm »
There used to be some things building destroyers couldn't destroy.

Has that changed?
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Dunamisdeos

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Re: Can building destroyer destroy bridges, walls, floors, grates and hatch covers?
« Reply #1 on: November 01, 2016, 12:19:10 pm »
They cannot destroy constructed walls or constructed floors.

They can destroy grates and hatch covers from above. They cannot destroy them if they are below and also there is no path to the square above.

Bridges will be deconstructed if they are raised/lowers with certain creatures on/below them. A raised bridge is invulnerable.
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ringringlingling

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Re: Can building destroyer destroy bridges, walls, floors, grates and hatch covers?
« Reply #2 on: November 01, 2016, 12:28:11 pm »
I see.  Thanks.
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Dunamisdeos

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Re: Can building destroyer destroy bridges, walls, floors, grates and hatch covers?
« Reply #3 on: November 01, 2016, 12:34:12 pm »
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ringringlingling

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Re: Can building destroyer destroy bridges, walls, floors, grates and hatch covers?
« Reply #4 on: November 01, 2016, 12:39:59 pm »
Lol
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GhostDwemer

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Re: Can building destroyer destroy bridges, walls, floors, grates and hatch covers?
« Reply #5 on: November 01, 2016, 02:13:44 pm »
A raised bridge is almost perfectly secure. It depends on the material: if something hot enough to melt/burn any of the materials used moves over the center of where the raised bridge would be if lowered, the bridge will deconstruct. Had it happen with a wooden bridge and a dragon, and with a stone bridge and magma, where the stone was magma safe but I messed up and put in a non magma safe mechanism.
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Skorpion

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Re: Can building destroyer destroy bridges, walls, floors, grates and hatch covers?
« Reply #6 on: November 01, 2016, 04:45:32 pm »
Yes, no, no, yes, no.
And no.

But things can't be protected with a single-tile moat any longer. Things climb and jump.
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Elves do it in trees. Humans do it in wooden structures. Dwarves? Dwarves do it underground. With magma.

Dunamisdeos

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Re: Can building destroyer destroy bridges, walls, floors, grates and hatch covers?
« Reply #7 on: November 01, 2016, 06:40:13 pm »
My understanding is that the bridge itself is invulnerable but the mechanism is not.

Additionally, 5 tiles is the minimum needed to ensure that a creature cannot jump over a moat, if I am not mistaken. Also, they can climb walls, so an overhang is recommended.
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Loud Whispers

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Re: Can building destroyer destroy bridges, walls, floors, grates and hatch covers?
« Reply #8 on: November 01, 2016, 08:04:45 pm »
Quote from: Dunamisdeos on November 01, 2016, 06:40:13 pm
My understanding is that the bridge itself is invulnerable but the mechanism is not.

Additionally, 5 tiles is the minimum needed to ensure that a creature cannot jump over a moat, if I am not mistaken. Also, they can climb walls, so an overhang is recommended.
A layer of fortifications, or usage of natural rock (that has been smoothed) also greatly improves anti-climbing defence. Best for Forts that can cast out of obsidian or ice
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GhostDwemer

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Re: Can building destroyer destroy bridges, walls, floors, grates and hatch covers?
« Reply #9 on: November 02, 2016, 01:34:23 am »
Quote from: Dunamisdeos on November 01, 2016, 06:40:13 pm
My understanding is that the bridge itself is invulnerable but the mechanism is not.

If that's the case now, someone should update the wiki because it still reflects my personal understanding, which is that bridges are not invulnerable to heat in the same way that constructed walls are invulnerable.  But my personal experience with bridges deconstructing due to dragon fire and magma is from several versions ago, so I could be wrong. http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Bridge
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Dunamisdeos

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Re: Can building destroyer destroy bridges, walls, floors, grates and hatch covers?
« Reply #10 on: November 02, 2016, 12:50:24 pm »
Quote from: GhostDwemer on November 02, 2016, 01:34:23 am
Quote from: Dunamisdeos on November 01, 2016, 06:40:13 pm
My understanding is that the bridge itself is invulnerable but the mechanism is not.

If that's the case now, someone should update the wiki because it still reflects my personal understanding, which is that bridges are not invulnerable to heat in the same way that constructed walls are invulnerable.  But my personal experience with bridges deconstructing due to dragon fire and magma is from several versions ago, so I could be wrong. http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Bridge

I should probably say that RAISED bridges have been invulnerable in my experience, though I do tend to select magma safe materials by habit. I could be wrong, I've not actually done any science on it.
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Sanctume

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Re: Can building destroyer destroy bridges, walls, floors, grates and hatch covers?
« Reply #11 on: November 02, 2016, 12:56:00 pm »
A raised bridge with non-magma safe mechanism will deconstruct the bridge when magma is adjacent
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Dunamisdeos

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Re: Can building destroyer destroy bridges, walls, floors, grates and hatch covers?
« Reply #12 on: November 02, 2016, 01:12:37 pm »
Yeah but a wood bridge with a magma-safe mechanism is safe, maybe? At least that's what I'm trying to push here. :3
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FACT I: Post note art is best art.
FACT II: Dunamisdeos is a forum-certified wordsmith.
FACT III: "All life begins with Post-it notes and ends with Post-it notes. This is the truth! This is my belief!...At least for now."
FACT IV: SPEECHO THE TRUSTWORM IS YOUR FRIEND or BEHOLD: THE FRUIT ENGINE 3.0

Fleeting Frames

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Re: Can building destroyer destroy bridges, walls, floors, grates and hatch covers?
« Reply #13 on: November 02, 2016, 01:22:17 pm »
At least in 42.06, nah it won't if it doesn't reach the center square. Wording fail?

From deathgame:



Note that for two-long south and east opening bridges the center is on the hinge tile, so this is fine:

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GhostDwemer

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Re: Can building destroyer destroy bridges, walls, floors, grates and hatch covers?
« Reply #14 on: November 02, 2016, 03:41:07 pm »
Quote from: Dunamisdeos on November 02, 2016, 01:12:37 pm
Yeah but a wood bridge with a magma-safe mechanism is safe, maybe? At least that's what I'm trying to push here. :3

It is safe from the non raising side, with or without a magma safe mechanism. The heat source has to contact the central tile of where the bridge would be if down. Then it will burn or melt, if any of the components will burn or melt given the heat source, and with dragon fire, that's pretty much everything except for blue and gray spoilers.
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