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[vassock]

What are some really complex, in-depth games you guys know about?

Obviously: Dwarf Fortress is one.

Aurora 4X: Really complex 4X game.

Stronghold and Stronghold: Crusader: somewhat complex medieval siege games.

Cataclysm: DDA: sandbox rougelike, post-apocalyptic.

Unreal World: Cataclysm: DDA, but in the Iron Age.

[itisnotlogical]

The Elder Scrolls II: Daggerfall. It's not really complex in that what you do from moment-to-moment is difficult to accomplish, but there's dozens of gotchas and "How was I supposed to know that?" things that can ruin characters before you even begin playing. The dungeons are also unending labyrinths of secret doors, twisting hallways, flooded rooms and monsters that will probably wreck your shit.

[Yoink]

7,62 High Calibre/Hard Life.

[vassock]

7,62 High Calibre/Hard Life.

Yep, really good game. It was great until you figured out that the constant crashes were being caused by an unfixable memory leak.

[vassock]

The Elder Scrolls II: Daggerfall. It's not really complex in that what you do from moment-to-moment is difficult to accomplish, but there's dozens of gotchas and "How was I supposed to know that?" things that can ruin characters before you even begin playing. The dungeons are also unending labyrinths of secret doors, twisting hallways, flooded rooms and monsters that will probably wreck your shit.

I played it a bit. How would you ruin a character? Other than maybe selecting an allergy to a certain metal or making yourself weak at night.

[ThtblovesDF]

Isn't this new Children of a dead Earth one of those?

Anyway, also:

Space Station 13
Dominions (4) [D
Paper Magic or MTGO
Depending on your flavor, many games fit, like Minecraft, KerbalSpaceProgramm or Besiege
Skyward Collapse

[gimlet]

Distant Worlds:Universe is up there.
Command: Modern Air Naval Operations
War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition
Space Empires IV
Jagged Alliance II 1.15

[Robsoie]

There's Orbiter that is complex and with some addon getting even more indepth for the simulation, while being really great.

[lastverb]

Command: Modern Air/Naval Operations - war SIMULATION, if you like complex, you will get fun hours/$ ratio satisfied despite big price tag
GearCity - Detroit like car company sim
To End All Wars - or other Ageod sims
Heroes&Generals - not your usual fps game (if fps can be complex without being walking/horizont scanning simulator like ARMA, then this is the one)
Airborne Assault: Conquest of the Aegean - warsim, the best description i can give is: Close Combat, but with tokens and bigger scale.
Capitalism Lab - imo best economic game you can find

MatrixGames - 'complex strategy games' is basically the definition of their shop

Well, I know that warsims i named might rise a bar of 'complexity' to the point of realization 'oh, i never wanted to play complex games' in most users.

[EnigmaticHat]

Armaggedon Empires is a board game styled strategy game that isn't trying to be realistic on any level, but its quite complex.  Its one of the only strategy games I can think of where the emphasis is on the supporting elements (commanders, planners, scouts, intelligence, air support, logistics, ect) rather than the combat units.  There's a lot of cool shit it in it too, and the best equipment has to be found out in the wastes rather than built yourself.

Be aware once you get over the learning cliff its kind of easy unless you give the AI unfair advantages or use self imposed challenges (not unusual for complex games tho).

[LoSboccacc]

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=202304

Free submarine roguelike, very in depth

Also check put armored command, tank roguelike

[PrimusRibbus]

Heroes&Generals - not your usual fps game (if fps can be complex without being walking/horizont scanning simulator like ARMA, then this is the one)

Not entirely sure if I agree with Heroes&Generals being complex (I'd personally describe it as obtuse by virtue of mechanics working together in odd ways), but I will say that if H&G qualifies as complex then WW2Online needs a PhD.

[Reelya]

The Elder Scrolls II: Daggerfall. It's not really complex in that what you do from moment-to-moment is difficult to accomplish, but there's dozens of gotchas and "How was I supposed to know that?" things that can ruin characters before you even begin playing. The dungeons are also unending labyrinths of secret doors, twisting hallways, flooded rooms and monsters that will probably wreck your shit.

I played it a bit. How would you ruin a character? Other than maybe selecting an allergy to a certain metal or making yourself weak at night.

The main way is that there's a meeting you need to attend about 30 days after you leave your first dungeon. If you miss that meeting, the main plot never triggers.

The other main issue is the quirky level up systems that Bethesda love, you really need to know how they work when selecting your starting skills, otherwise you can end up with characters who are severely under/overpowered in odd ways.

I think this was actually more pronounced as a problem in Morrowind however - if you didn't optimize your misc. skills at EVERY level you missed out on most of the stat upgrades, causing you to need to do dumb shit like jumping marathons to make sure you've trained the right stats just the right amount at every level. If you weren't careful in what you left as main/minor vs misc skills then you were fucked basically.

[Jimmy]

Dungeons and Dragons 3.5e / Pathfinder


...well, you never said it had to be a computer game.

[jocan2003]

what was the game submarine SS13 mix catastrophe/fuckup siumulator with monstruous monster ?