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[Eruonen]

Besides, the higher entity that actually rules the fortress (the player) can do whatever he pleases, like killing off nobles, even if he has no reason to.

[Quintin Stone]

If nobles are so noble, why are they so darn easy to kill?  Why are other dwarves so willing to kill them?

It's all a sham!

[Torak]

I cant tell if you're acting like a moron or really think this.

[pushy]

quote:Originally posted by Trorbes:
<STRONG>and sand comes in a variety of colors which I believe make different types of glass.</STRONG>

Not true. There are three types of glass - green, clear and crystal. Sand (any colour) on its own will make green glass. Sand and pearlash makes clear glass. Rock crystal and pearlash makes crystal glass.

[Hypcso]

The thing I hate the most, is having a caravan bring it's own items.. and then having my nobles make a mandate that something it's carrying, THAT IT BROUGHT WITH IT, are illegal to export. As they promptly walk off the map, and the noble goes miserable instantly and berserks within a few minutes. For items that didn't even belong to the fortress in the first place.

[numerobis]

quote:Originally posted by aha:
<STRONG>Want communism - move to China  </STRONG>

I'm currently running a communist dwarf commune, actually.  Building a largely useless, expensive, dam megaproject.

[aha]

quote:Originally posted by Hypcso:
<STRONG>The thing I hate the most, is having a caravan bring it's own items.. and then having my nobles make a mandate that something it's carrying, THAT IT BROUGHT WITH IT, are illegal to export. As they promptly walk off the map, and the noble goes miserable instantly and berserks within a few minutes. For items that didn't even belong to the fortress in the first place.</STRONG>

Well, this is a bug. This is different matter altogether.

[Pandarsenic]

I get rid of idiot nobles exactly as I get rid of goblin sieges:

With large quantities of pointy objects and mechanisms.

[Forumsdwarf]

quote:communism

Capitalists too have little love for nobles.  Every new wave of nobles leaves me thinking, "We're from the government and we're here to help."

Price controls, unfunded mandates, arbitrary regulations, high taxes, excessive penalties ... Nobles turn an honest businessman's dream into a bureaucratic big-government nightmare.

Would that we could stuff unreasonable regulators into broom closets in our real-life businesses.

Then there are the environmentalists, but at least in DF if Elves chained themselves to trees it would just mean an extra ax stroke or two.

Speaking of business ventures, shouldn't the "Original 7" own shares of stock?  And whenever one of "The 7" died his shares would revert to the company ... and we should be able to reward favored employees with stock options ... and stock options should make employees work harder ... I guess how you view the relationship of productive dwarves to means of production to useless freeloaders depends on whether you view the fort as a business venture or a city.
I always just assumed Dwarf Fortress was about 7 dwarves with a crazy dream to make a huge pile of money.  That's the American Dream, though, not necessarily the Dwarf dream.

[False Keraptis]

Amen, Forumsdwarf!  Seven dwarves with little sense, and lots of greed, that's what it's about.  I always give my leader the job title, "chairdwarf," and the other original seven get to be "_____ partners"  (miner partner, brewer partner, etc.).  It would be cool if they could get some benefit when the economy starts - maybe they'd get the rents the other dwarves pay?

[Kagus]

Here's a very simple and and effective way for dealing with nobles:  Assassination.  

No, I'm not talking goblins or kobolds or even elves in black cloaks with long poisoned daggers.  I'm talking the nobles themselves.

We all know the upper classes have a habit of hating each other and doing anything in their power to take someone else's power.  Simply give them the ability to do this, and your nobles will be so busy plotting and counterplotting with each other to bother making riduclous mandates for the commoners to do.

This way, nobles will not only distract each other, but also kill each other off from time to time.  Be it by shoving them off their chasm balcony (I'm not sure why, but I've always wanted to build apartments with a view of the chasm.  Seems very high-class somehow), stabbing them in the back, poisoning their favorite goblet, or putting a menacing spike in their chair, nobles will always find some way (or someone) to knock off their rivals.

Happen to like a particular noble?  Give him more bodyguards to deter the more violent notions of his brothers-in-greed.

[Slappy Moose]

I only hate the nobles that don't work.

I like my mayor because he works his ass off all the time, is a double legendary (miner and engraver, maybe miner and stone crafter) and he has awesome stats.

Plus I just wub him :3

[makar]

quote: Point that I was trying to make, is that noble, by definition matters more than all your craftsdwarves together. Nobles demands are not to be questioned.

Can't afford to loose your smith? Train up two.
Goblin sieges also put your military in severe risk - should we get rid of them too?

Could we have some severe penalties for killing off nobles? For example decimation squad from the King. Army of battledwarves would stroll in and decimate the population - that is kill off every 10th able-bodied dwarf and drag the current mayor off in chains.

Lets be clear, about one thing,

If nobles have impossible mandates, they do that because they are too stupid to see reality. Usually this also means that he is stupid enough to cause that suicidal cave in, to flip that lever that opens the floodgates into his room etc.

What can the common dwarf do against such noble stupidity.
Nothing, considering that it is not their place to correct their betters  

[Forumsdwarf]

quote:I only hate the nobles that don't work.

Hear hear!  I'll feed them and give them trinkets, just because it's the path of least resistance, but one bad mandate and it's straight to the padded room.
Nobles give new meaning to the phrase "Welfare Queen".  Lock 'em in a room and toss their government cheese down a hole in the roof.  It's more than they deserve.

Re: Dwarf Corporation
"Chairdwarf", I like it.

[Hamenopi]

The truth is.. Armok prefers the blood of nobles over craftdwarves. Who would you rather have pissed? A duke... or a god?