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[JimboM12]

What we need is a good tabletop on PC game of W40k. Something reminiscent of Hearts of Iron 4. You can choose what your factions units are equipped with and whats attached to that unit. Imagine it like HoI4 with the unit creation, but with morale mechanics.

It will never happen because Games Workshop just seems to hate money. At least they hate sharing money or their IP party toys with 3rd party devs who have new, innovative ideas.

But what I want is just a solid game where I can play as a commissar and lead my charges into battle only to execute the one trying to reload because it looked like he was making a break for it and having us win with 79% casualties. A great victory for the Imperium. Maybe as a mod for Mount and Blade 2.

[nenjin]

I think partly it's that they don't want to create a complete digital replacement for their table top business. Because I know if I could get 100% of 40k in a computer game, the odds of me spending on figs goes down dramatically.

On the other hand considering that's exactly what fans crave and they'd probably shower such an effort in money....yeah maybe GWS does just hate money.

[JimboM12]

I think partly it's that they don't want to create a complete digital replacement for their table top business. Because I know if I could get 100% of 40k in a computer game, the odds of me spending on figs goes down dramatically.

On the other hand considering that's exactly what fans crave and they'd probably shower such an effort in money....yeah maybe GWS does just hate money.

Whats funny is it's one of those games that could have micro-payments that people would actually be quiet about if it was a MMO style game.

But then, those who invested in the mini-figs would have to pay again to translate their constructed units into the game.

Unless it wasn't an MMO style game but instead just a solid 60 buck purchase of sandboxy goodness. They could even do the DoW thing and release the base game with 4 main factions (Space MEHREENSsssss, Chaos bros, ORK bogans and Eldar chicks) and release single faction expansions with mini singleplayer campaigns for a reasonable price.

Hire me, GamesWorkshop.

[Krevsin]

"Sure thing, mr Jimbo but first we need you to bash your head against this brick for 15 minutes. It's standard procedure for new hires."

 

[Grim Portent]

Even if a tabletop equivalent game sold to 10 million more customers than the tabletop game itself does GW would probably still lose money on it in the long run. They rely on people expanding or updating their miniature collection and rulebooks on a regular basis, selling someone a computer game and DLC is a one off bit of income worth £300 per customer at most once all the DLC is factored in, that's about what it costs to get a small army in the tabletop, which is usually then made much bigger and eventually joined by other armies in the same collection.

I have 4 40k armies, a bunch of miscellaneous kits for armies I wanted to try the painting style of, wanted for conversion parts or bought on a whim and didn't do much with. Probably spent somewhere in the region of 2 or 3 grand on the game since I started 8-9 years ago. If GW brought out a new basic Chaos Marine kit I'd probably drop £200 on them within three months to replace the lower quality miniatures from the current Chaos Marine box.

GW would rather have 10 customers like me buying models than 500 buying a computer game, and some of the former ten would stop buying models if they could get the tabletop game in a digital form.

[nenjin]

I think it's an outmoded business model by a company that has survived on whales (no offense) since the early 80s. Hobby games have traditionally been a captive audience. People play 40k because it's 40k, not because it's the most superior table top game ever made. There's not really a replacement good for 40k. (Or more appropriately, if you feel there is a replacement good for 40k, you're probably not a hardcore fan.)

So GWS has built a business model on their captive audience. But times are different. The equation of money + time is different for the demographic they're supposed to be marketing at. (Kids, teens, young adults.) My guess is they haven't replenished the ranks of the faithful as much as they would have hoped, and the hobby is probably supported by older gamers more than any other demo. Which would make me think they'd alter their business model to adapt. But it really seems they haven't. All they've done is unleashed the licensing department but as you said, that income is supplemental to what they still consider their core business. And as much as I like hobby modeling and wargames.....I think GWS could trim a lot of fat if they moved more aggressively into digitizing their IP. To me 40k isn't the figs or the wargame anymore; it's the universe and the setting. I'm willing to embrace 40k again and again as video games and books and hell, even movies if they'd make a decent one, as long as the price is right. But to GWS they keep viewing using their IP in such a manner as undercutting their core strength....a strength that people have been poking fun at for damn near my entire adult life.

I was starting to think for a while that with Relic and THQ and the continued success of Dawn of War, GWS would see the light. But I guess since they can't control video game development in house, since they aren't a video game studio, they're always going to keep the idea of a "real" 40k video game at arms length. And instead we'll keep getting these spin offs and variations and genre adaptations like Deathwing, Eternal Crusade, Sanctus Reach, Battlefleet Gothic, Eisenhorn, etc and so forth. Sometimes I'm still a little surprised they let Bloodbowl be truly digitized, but I guess it's had its heyday. Unlike 40k which is still under active development.

And I mean....if GWS did go full video game adaptation of the 40k universe and its battle systems, it would probably be the most DLC-happy extravaganza of microtransactions that the gaming world has ever seen. Because GWS still considers a customer untapped if they haven't dropped a couple grand with them. I often wonder what their actual margins are, how they survive when they're vested so heavily in big spenders rather than the broader market.

[Urist McScoopbeard]

-snarp-

This. This so much. I love you, Nenjin.

[ZebioLizard2]

And the sad thing is if they went digital it'd still most likely be better then the Warmachine one.

[JimboM12]

Welp, time for me to develop a game studio to make a knock off.

Space Guard and Imperial Marines, anybody?

Edit* I had a few more 'good' ones: Sisters of Combat. Forces of Chaos Untidiness. Tau Pi (That's for you math nerds). The Monarchy of Man. The _Spanish Inquisition. Omega Marines.

....shut up, I'm tired.

[Scoops Novel]

"Sure thing, mr Jimbo but first we need you to bash your head against this brick for 15 minutes. It's standard procedure for new hires."

 

[Grim Portent]

I don't see GW having much incentive to make a computer version of tabletop compared to continuing to try and drop the initial investment involved in starting tabletop. They currently look to be planning to incorporate some elements of AoS into 40ks next edition, which probably means it'll be possible to start playing with just one box of 10 models and then just add whatever else you think looks cool to your army as you expand.

The entry cost for AoS is something like £18 if all you want to start with is a box of Speargoblins or Gors or similar and aren't playing with the General's Handbook points system.

[Urist McScoopbeard]

Far be it from me to understand the integral business policies of GWS, but no matter what they do with tabletop it just doesn't seem feasible in the long run. Their customer base can't be EXPANDING can it??? Especially considering all the services and culture lost. Remember global campaigns?

[Grim Portent]

Far be it from me to understand the integral business policies of GWS, but no matter what they do with tabletop it just doesn't seem feasible in the long run. Their customer base can't be EXPANDING can it??? Especially considering all the services and culture lost. Remember global campaigns?

No one really knows much about their customer base because they have a long standing policy of not releasing sales figures. All we really have is anecdotal evidence and the knowledge that no other miniatures wargame has managed to expand anywhere close to as much as warhammer did over the years.



The current CEO appears to be trying to fix a lot of the damage caused by his precursors over the years, moving away from the 'we're a model company, not a game one' philosophy that GW had for a long time, bringing back cheap starter boxes, a lot of legacy armies and less important factions getting rules for the first time in decades, interacting more with the customer base and so on.

GW is however currently going through the steps of the 40k End Times, which involves rolling a lot of factions into each other. Current round up is all the Eldar getting smushed together and given a name that can be copyrighted, presumably so it becomes easier to go after 3rd party model makers making 'totally-not-Eldar' and to make it easier to license out the IP, which they really should have done 30 years ago, but better late than never. What this winds up being like, means for the franchise in the long run and means for licensing games is kind of up in the air.

It's possible once the 40k End Times are done they'll allow a game set in the 40k setting that imitates the tabletop game to come out similar to how Total War: Warhammer didn't come out until after Fantasy End Times, since it won't compete with the miniatures the same way it would before the End Times.

[nenjin]

Attention all 40k players: Amazingness has descended upon us.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AwwtKCppDHk

That thing that every 40k table top player has said they need in their life? IT'S HERE. And it's been here for over a year!

It's based on Table Top Simulator, which someone has apparently 40k-ified. I don't know where to get the files but....I'm going to try and get this as soon as possible, before the virus C&D orders and cyclonic lawyers get unleashed on the brilliant bastard who made it.

[Urist McScoopbeard]

THAT looks amazing!