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[Khorin Athol]

What's a brother gotta do to start a war with the elves? Five years running I slaughtered their merchants, killed their diplomats, seized their goods, tried to spam-trade them wooden items, everything I could think of. I even tried killing just one Merchant and letting the rest leave to tell the tale.

Five years of harassing the Elves trying to provoke them and nothin'! What gives?

Here's how dumb Elves are: every year, their diplomat told me how pleased he was that we hadn't chopped down any trees (dirty hippies).

There weren't any frigging trees on the frigging map, you sylvan idiots.

I even tried removing the [BENIGN] tag from dandelion-eaters in the raws (no idea if that should have made of a different but it didn't).

***

So I gave up on that fort and started one in a site where elves were already at war with the Fortress of Drinks, my civ (maybe because of my past actions, or maybe by coincidence?). Three years in and no sign of elves, either caravan or ambushers. At one point the game threw a NEMESIS LOAD FAILURE error message and crashed (first time I've seen DF crash in many years). I have a bad feeling that was somehow elf-related.

Anyone got the down-low on when and how sieges are generated in general? In the past, I've embarked just a few tiles from the gobbos and had them not show for five years, or ever!

Current version FWIW.

[Broseph Stalin]

Add the babysnatcher tag to their entity before you gen a world, (nearly) guaranteed war.

[Goatmaan]

I thought you were supposed to kill them all but one, to tell the tale?

  Goatmaan

[Fleeting Frames]

Regarding tree-cutting, cutting down underground trees totally counts.

War:
- They have to path to your site.
- They have to want to attack your site, and some other dwarf site that is totally far more away come here you not stupid non-idiots armok demands blood
- They must have the population to attack. As a rule, dark pits, hamlets and i retreats have tiny pop.
- I've once found genning world to the edge of war(by genning it to war and then dialing back a year in params) and then embarking to result in multiple simultaneous wars due off-site diplomacy.

[Khorin Athol]

Add the babysnatcher tag to their entity before you gen a world, (nearly) guaranteed war.

Brilliant, those dirty baby snatching elf bastards! Brilliant.

Re: The embark where I started at war with the elves...am I guaranteed they will path to my fort's tile and Ambush me eventually, now that they're at war? I've just got to wait? Or is it that not that simple? I ask because I like this fort, I have no goblin neighbors, and I don't want to start shit with the Humans.

Re:

They have to want to attack your site, and some other dwarf site that is totally far more away come here you not stupid non-idiots armok demands blood

So, in regards to the first clause...what's it take to piss them off? Because the Elves I was "trading with" (i.e. robbing and murdering for years) definitely could path to my fort (I don't know about the population thing) and I feel like I gave them adequately excessive provocation?

[Fleeting Frames]

In that gen? Dispute over hunting trophies with a different fort, iirc.

And not guaranteed. Even if you have 10k elves on a forest retreat, they might all get killed by a single guy when attacking a different fort, or only have like 10 guys in a retreat that wishes to attack and never get enough pop to mount one due something like wild zombie ogre rampages or being conquered by humans (humans dislike cannibalisms, so wars with elves are not uncommon).

[Killgoth]

In that gen? Dispute over hunting trophies with a different fort, iirc.

And not guaranteed. Even if you have 10k elves on a forest retreat, they might all get killed by a single guy when attacking a different fort, or only have like 10 guys in a retreat that wishes to attack and never get enough pop to mount one due something like wild zombie ogre rampages or being conquered by humans (humans dislike cannibalisms, so wars with elves are not uncommon).

I think I remember some guy saying he upped elven survival chances in world gen buy giving elves a base legendary skill in archery.  Probably not that helpful, but maybe he will see this thread and post more details.

[Shonai_Dweller]

I did that. Seemed to work at the time, but need more worldgens to be sure. I stopped because natural skills aren't working for adventurers right now (which means having to roleplay as the only non-legendary archer elf in the world).

[Khorin Athol]

does the [BENIGN] or [LIKES_FIGHTING] tag in the raws actually effect how a civ will behave, or just individual creatures?

[steel jackal]

did you try selling them wood?
it seems that elves value the life of trees higher than that of their own lives.
if you try to sell them wood every time they show up they will eventually send a diplomat to ask you to chop down a smaller amount of trees, and if you go above the limit they set, they will not be happy about it.

[PatrikLundell]

The elves send a pompous tree cutting restriction demanding spy when your fortress is eligible for diplomatic relations (i.e. when you get a count/baron...), which is entirely unrelated to attempts to sell them wood. But getting this spy, refusing the demands, and offering to sell wooden items should at least annoy them. I wouldn't be surprised if slaughtering most of the caravan after the generous sale offer (but leaving at least one to tell the tale) would add a little to this, but the wood part is probably the most offensive, as said.

[overseer05-15]

I'm not helping, but this thread in particular is hilarious when pumped through Gizoogle.[/derail]

[Khorin Athol]

did you try selling them wood?
it seems that elves value the life of trees higher than that of their own lives.
if you try to sell them wood every time they show up they will eventually send a diplomat to ask you to chop down a smaller amount of trees, and if you go above the limit they set, they will not be happy about it.

As I said in the OP, I tried selling them wood over and over and over and over and over. Then I killed them, because that "rude bauble" comment offended me.