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Author Topic: How much easier has dwarf fortress got?  (Read 6610 times)

DeCervantes

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How much easier has dwarf fortress got?
« on: July 08, 2016, 07:01:19 am »

So dwarf fortress used to be a horribly difficult game were a single angry dwarf could turn your fortress in a horror show and the constant attacks by animals, forgotten beasts and goblins made it seriously difficult to keep them happy. I have the personal feeling ( and I think I am not alone in this) that the game is easier now: goblin attacks are less common, forgotten beasts seem to show less often (to me at least) and dwarfs are in general less psicotic.

Whats your opinion on the topic? What has become more easier? What was more difficult in previous versions?
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Cormack

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Re: How much easier has dwarf fortress got?
« Reply #1 on: July 08, 2016, 07:02:53 am »

It's very easy now. Everything's automated, you literally don't have to move a finger. You'll have a huge fortress in no time.
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George_Chickens

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Re: How much easier has dwarf fortress got?
« Reply #2 on: July 08, 2016, 08:24:48 am »

It's quite a lot easier. Tantrum spirals seem to have so much less effect and goblin armies are nonthreatening. I have faith in the toad that all will come fine in a few releases.
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Dyret

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Re: How much easier has dwarf fortress got?
« Reply #3 on: July 08, 2016, 10:50:17 am »

I think tantrum spirals are what I miss the most. Those were always good fun.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2016, 10:57:14 am by Dyret »
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Taffer

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Re: How much easier has dwarf fortress got?
« Reply #4 on: July 08, 2016, 11:53:19 am »

Some players seem to miss the old tantrum spirals, but I always disliked them. They didn't make sense to me. New releases also made undead weaker, but I think that change was also a big improvement.

I think lots of players want to see more difficulty, but I'd prefer that difficulty to come in the form of resource scarcity and enemy sieges, not dwarves with the intellectual and emotional maturity of 5 year olds.

Wood and food are both probably too easy to acquire at the moment, and enemies don't try to tunnel into your fort. Fixing those things will go a long way to restoring balance.
« Last Edit: July 29, 2016, 05:01:08 pm by Taffer »
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tiresius

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Re: How much easier has dwarf fortress got?
« Reply #5 on: July 08, 2016, 12:04:04 pm »

Food is no longer a challenge unless you embark in a place where it is difficult to start out.

Too-common tantrum spirals were like killer carp, funny at first but hard to argue their continued existence.

Some of the automation is good like auto-butchering and some of the work management changes.

Sometimes you have to make your own challenge.
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Taffer

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Re: How much easier has dwarf fortress got?
« Reply #6 on: July 08, 2016, 01:13:37 pm »

New releases haven't been all bad as far as difficulty. One important resource is harder to acquire in bulk in the current version: boulders and blocks. My fortresses were overflowing with stone in previous releases, and standard advice was to keep stonecrafting on at all times to clear it up and make some money off of it. It's better balanced now, in my opinion: I can still get plenty of good stone by carving boulders into blocks, but my fortresses aren't full of cheaply made--yet valuable--stone crafts at all times. I'm not overflowing with stone as much as I used to be, but it's still easy to acquire when I need it.

Further, there are now uses for many items that were previously only trade fodder. Mugs and instruments, for example.

Hopefully development continues this trend. "Difficulty" should come in the form of invaders, resource scarcity, and keeping your dwarves happy and productive, not in the form of tedious game mechanics.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2016, 01:34:17 pm by Taffer »
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Max™

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Re: How much easier has dwarf fortress got?
« Reply #7 on: July 08, 2016, 05:00:09 pm »

Armor damage is a big step away from easiness.
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Robsoie

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Re: How much easier has dwarf fortress got?
« Reply #8 on: July 08, 2016, 05:05:56 pm »

While the 43.x serie is slightly (and fortunately) less easy than 42.x and 40.x , it's still an easier game than it used to be.

Sometimes you have to make your own challenge.

Hopefully future release will make things less easy than they unfortunately are so making intentional mistakes or setting self challenges will not be necessary to have an actual challenge again.
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tonnot98

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Re: How much easier has dwarf fortress got?
« Reply #9 on: July 08, 2016, 08:13:18 pm »

Well, an armor nerf is coming up, so that's likely going to make it a hell of a lot harder for fortresses focusing on military.
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MDFification

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Re: How much easier has dwarf fortress got?
« Reply #10 on: July 08, 2016, 09:15:43 pm »

Wood and food are both probably too easy to acquire at the moment, and enemies don't try to tunnel into your fort. Fixing those things will go a long way to restoring balance.

There is an INIT option for digging invaders I believe, but it's not on by default unfortunately.
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Capntastic

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Re: How much easier has dwarf fortress got?
« Reply #11 on: July 08, 2016, 09:30:33 pm »

Good thing the game's not feature complete otherwise I'd see a reason for hassling Toady about the difficulty
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Chase

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Re: How much easier has dwarf fortress got?
« Reply #12 on: July 08, 2016, 09:38:10 pm »

Good thing the game's not feature complete otherwise I'd see a reason for hassling Toady about the difficulty

I'm excited to see if it will ever be feature complete.
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Capntastic

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Re: How much easier has dwarf fortress got?
« Reply #13 on: July 08, 2016, 09:59:47 pm »

Good thing the game's not feature complete otherwise I'd see a reason for hassling Toady about the difficulty

I'm excited to see if it will ever be feature complete.

Here's to another ten years and more, folks!
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Max™

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Re: How much easier has dwarf fortress got?
« Reply #14 on: July 08, 2016, 10:11:36 pm »

Wood and food are both probably too easy to acquire at the moment, and enemies don't try to tunnel into your fort. Fixing those things will go a long way to restoring balance.

There is an INIT option for digging invaders I believe, but it's not on by default unfortunately.
What? No there isn't. There are mods which do this to some extent with dfhack I think, but not vanilla yet.

Well, an armor nerf is coming up, so that's likely going to make it a hell of a lot harder for fortresses focusing on military.
I think it's already here, 43.04 and 43.05 have armor damage/joint connection strain and whatnot.
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