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Author Topic: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American: T+0  (Read 1395355 times)

TheBiggerFish

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American: Post-Apocalypse
« Reply #13740 on: November 23, 2016, 01:05:51 am »

Hmm, intriguing... http://www.cnn.com/2016/11/22/politics/hillary-clinton-challenge-results/index.html If those computer scientists are correct and it's true that the results in Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylvania really were somehow hacked or otherwise manipulated, it's going to instantly throw everything into chaos.

2016 isn't going to be over til it says it's dead all right. BTW, Michigan hasn't even been called yet, which may not in itself be indicative of a problem, but it does seem a bit unusual. edit: Though in the NYmag article, it says that they found a 'suspicious pattern', which could be anything, so, they don't have actual solid proof, just something that looks odd.
Oh my god, what the fuck.  This is ungood.
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PTTG??

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American: Post-Apocalypse
« Reply #13741 on: November 23, 2016, 01:35:53 am »

Hmm, intriguing... http://www.cnn.com/2016/11/22/politics/hillary-clinton-challenge-results/index.html If those computer scientists are correct and it's true that the results in Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylvania really were somehow hacked or otherwise manipulated, it's going to instantly throw everything into chaos.

2016 isn't going to be over til it says it's dead all right. BTW, Michigan hasn't even been called yet, which may not in itself be indicative of a problem, but it does seem a bit unusual. edit: Though in the NYmag article, it says that they found a 'suspicious pattern', which could be anything, so, they don't have actual solid proof, just something that looks odd.
Oh my god, what the fuck.  This is ungood.

If true, this is worst-case-scenario situation. That said, it does smell pretty fishy to me.

Nate Silver has kind of killed it.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2016, 01:41:10 am by PTTG?? »
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wierd

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American: Post-Apocalypse
« Reply #13742 on: November 23, 2016, 01:50:02 am »

What did I just say about uncontrolled variables? Oh right. Fancy that.
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Max™

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American: Post-Apocalypse
« Reply #13743 on: November 23, 2016, 02:18:53 am »

Shade and saturation are only in your head. Reality only sees your hue.
I am part of reality trying to see itself, but my eyes suck so I can only see a narrow band of wavelengths from around 400 to 700 nm, which makes the world look like an occasionally gaudy, largely green, and otherwise mostly black thing. I can not see the x-rays and UV and infrared bouncing around, I can't see the radio waves flooding the room, and I can't see the higher energy colors like Gamma rays but I imagine they taste kinda the same way purple sounds. Nor can I see the neutrino flood pouring through every bit of the planet.

Being fully blind would definitely suck, but we're all mostly blind anyways, in fact I can't even see where I was going with this.
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wierd

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American: Post-Apocalypse
« Reply #13744 on: November 23, 2016, 02:21:18 am »

If you replace the natural, water filled lenses of your eyes with much clearer synthetic ones, you will find that you can see some of the UV and IR spectrum.

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Shadowlord

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American: Post-Apocalypse
« Reply #13745 on: November 23, 2016, 02:37:54 am »

Imagine the most evil person you can.

Okay. I imagined someone who wants to destroy the entire universe - and if it exists, the multiverse - and will do anything to accomplish that goal.

Somebody is always more evil even than that.

Who? Someone exactly like I described but who kicks puppies along the way? :P

What are good and evil, anyways? They're human concepts. There could be space aliens out there (and there are certainly people) who believe that evil is letting the universe, pain, suffering, and death continue, and good is ending it all. #MoralRelativism
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wierd

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American: Post-Apocalypse
« Reply #13746 on: November 23, 2016, 02:41:52 am »

How simple.

No, instead of destroying it, he wants it to endure forever. In a purpetual state of endless, unimaginable suffering, so he can look at it, and laugh while enjoying perpetual longevity and hedonistic pleasure at the rest of existence's expense.

And to think-- there is somebody even more evil than that.

And yes, the fact that 'evil' is a human construct with no absolute, is exactly the point.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2016, 02:46:17 am by wierd »
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Shadowlord

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American: Post-Apocalypse
« Reply #13747 on: November 23, 2016, 02:47:51 am »

but suffering builds character #yourdad
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martinuzz

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American: Post-Apocalypse
« Reply #13748 on: November 23, 2016, 03:33:56 am »

Hmm, intriguing... http://www.cnn.com/2016/11/22/politics/hillary-clinton-challenge-results/index.html If those computer scientists are correct and it's true that the results in Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylvania really were somehow hacked or otherwise manipulated, it's going to instantly throw everything into chaos.

2016 isn't going to be over til it says it's dead all right. BTW, Michigan hasn't even been called yet, which may not in itself be indicative of a problem, but it does seem a bit unusual. edit: Though in the NYmag article, it says that they found a 'suspicious pattern', which could be anything, so, they don't have actual solid proof, just something that looks odd.
Oh my god, what the fuck.  This is ungood.
It does smell really fishy that in the countries that used electronic voting, Hillary got 7% less votes compared to countries that use paper or optical scanner. That's statisitcally huge.
Let me just repost what I posted earlier.
1) was the voting software open source?
2) if not, what company made the voting sofware, and who checked it?
3) who are those companies' shareholders?
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misko27

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American: Post-Apocalypse
« Reply #13749 on: November 23, 2016, 03:37:32 am »

Eyy... watch your step there. Were you implying that moderates tend to be more wise? :P
no. That implication is entirely your own and I disavow it.

Quote
I SUBMIT MYSELF FOR YOUR APPROVAL
one: I am not an authority of any sort or on anything at all and thus do not claim the right to judge anyone. I have no moral, intellectual, or philosophical principles that are either fully original or entirely self-consistent. two: let's do it anyway.
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Quote
IS THIS ADEQUATELY WISE, OH GREAT ONE :P
first: no. what am I supposed to compare it to? what does adequately wise mean? Second: who the fuck am I and who died to make me "Great One"? tell me more about how I achieved this status of Great One. I've been trying very hard to get to it for a very long time, and I'm surprised that it was achieved here and now.
Grey. Endless, featureless grey, only appricably different when placed next to another. There is no white. There is no black. Only more dark, and more light.

Imagine the most evil person you can. Somebody is always more evil even than that.

thankfully the reverse is also true.

I am grey. To the left of me, i am seen as the right. to the right of me, i am seen as left. I am grey. so are they, they just believe they are black or white.
but this is the problem.

A lot of people have convinced themselves that they believe in grey and grey, but they don't. It's like Dozebom above. He said he thinks the world is full of grey and black at times. Well I bet you dollars to pennies that he sure fucking thinks that he's grey and that other people are black (inb4 DAS RACIST), but isn't that really grey and grey, it's just a pessimists version of white and black (an optimists version is white and grey, obviously). In fiction this can be true, but taking fiction so far leads to fundamental problems accepting reality. Tropes are not real. In reality there is only cause, effect, and whatever the fuck quantum mechanics is. This is sorta what you are saying but Dozebom illustrated to me that I was not clear earlier.

Moderates are just as prone to this as anything. If you've (and this you is direct at no one in particular) never met a dumb moderate you may need new glasses. And if you've never met intelligent conservatives or liberals (or socialists, or reactionaries, etc), perhaps you've never bothered to look?
If you replace the natural, water filled lenses of your eyes with much clearer synthetic ones, you will find that you can see some of the UV and IR spectrum.
...? when you say lenses, do you mean a part of the eye itself, or do you mean people who were lenses? this is important to me now.

And to think-- there is somebody even more evil than that.
Not necessarily. This is a fictional example. Obviously no one lives forever so your example is fictional (I didn't need to say this, but I did anyway because it's three am, and my inhibitions go to sleep at 1). If we allow fictional examples, I can conceive of some being of infinite power who could conceivably achieve maximum evil by infinitely torturing everyone single sentient forever, in reverse order of evilness (so more evil less torture), and this allows them to birth an infinite number of universe every second forever, all with infinite devil machines like this one. And all of them are killing your mother and raping your sister and kicking your dog and stealing your ice-cream cone, etc. etc.

I'd argue that at some level of evil the human brain ceases to be able to comprehend it properly, like how we can't naturally wrap our brains around very large numbers. BUT if evil is a purely human concept, then logically, any level of evil above and beyond human comprehension is by definition maximum evil. It's precisely because evil is NOT large numbers that it cannot be infinite. Only concepts we can comprehend are evil. My above example is so horrible that it... probably doesn't even bother you very much. It's just beyond comprehension how evil that is. To try and wrap my head around it, I imagine acts which are by comparison infinitely less evil, but these less evil acts are MORE real to me. The evil of seeing your father bash your mothers head in feels more real, even though clearly it's much less. Evil is comprehension. This then implies that maximum evil is now an achiveable goal! And that there are people alive today who are so evil that you cannot comprehend the vastness of their evil. Sure they could do more evil things, but that really doesn't add to their evil from a human perspective.

You can't do away with evil by reducing it to human perception. Even if you choose to classify evil as a problem of the human mind, it is still a problem, and for any given problem there is the potential of solutions. You can't just leave it there and say 'welp, figured out evil, what's next on the agenda'.
. There could be space aliens out there (and there are certainly people) who believe that evil is letting the universe, pain, suffering, and death continue, and good is ending it all. #MoralRelativism
Sure but those aliens are not likely to last long enough to tell us about it are they? stick that in your pipe and tune it.

It's three thirty am so I'ma go sleep now.
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Shadowlord

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American: Post-Apocalypse
« Reply #13750 on: November 23, 2016, 03:41:44 am »

This is from old, but:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1thcO_olHas

Relevant to vote hacking.
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wierd

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American: Post-Apocalypse
« Reply #13751 on: November 23, 2016, 03:43:26 am »

see Mr silver's review of the claim. Uncontrolled variables, and in one case, non sequitur. (Michigan only uses paper ballots.)

Misko:  Good catch on maximum evil. I would expect that such a thing is unquantifiable any other way though.

By lenses, I mean the kind inside your eyes.  Frequently, people who have cataract surgery, and have their lens replaced, report seeing differently. It is because they now experience more spectra.

http://www.komar.org/faq/colorado-cataract-surgery-crystalens/ultra-violet-color-glow/

The lens in your eye blocks UV. that is the real reason you cannot see it.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2016, 03:49:44 am by wierd »
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Vilanat

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American: Post-Apocalypse
« Reply #13752 on: November 23, 2016, 04:03:53 am »

Heh, It's like a Baron Munchausen grasping for his own hair straws trying to pull himself out of the water.
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itisnotlogical

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American: Post-Apocalypse
« Reply #13753 on: November 23, 2016, 04:30:46 am »

This is from old, but:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1thcO_olHas

Relevant to vote hacking.


And this as well:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w3_0x6oaDmI

Although his explanation trends towards "them gosh durn computing-machines can't be trusted" near the end.
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Sergarr

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American: Post-Apocalypse
« Reply #13754 on: November 23, 2016, 06:39:39 am »

Trump to scrap Nasa climate research in crackdown on ‘politicized science’

Quote
Donald Trump is poised to eliminate all climate change research conducted by Nasa as part of a crackdown on “politicized science”, his senior adviser on issues relating to the space agency has said.

welp shit's fuuuuucked

at least China is sane about it ahaha we're so screwed
« Last Edit: November 23, 2016, 09:24:58 am by Sergarr »
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