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[PlumpHelmetMan]

Are there any ideas yet for how creation myths will function in worlds with little or no magic?

[KittyTac]

Are there any ideas yet for how creation myths will function in worlds with little or no magic?

In truly magicless worlds, why not add something fixed like "this planet formed from asteroids a few billons of years ago"?

[Shonai_Dweller]

Are there any ideas yet for how creation myths will function in worlds with little or no magic?

In truly magicless worlds, why not add something fixed like "this planet formed from asteroids a few billons of years ago"?

Because the creation myth forms the myths and legends that each race believes about their own creation. It won't be true in mundane worlds, but will be just as important.

[KittyTac]

Are there any ideas yet for how creation myths will function in worlds with little or no magic?

In truly magicless worlds, why not add something fixed like "this planet formed from asteroids a few billons of years ago"?

Because the creation myth forms the myths and legends that each race believes about their own creation. It won't be true in mundane worlds, but will be just as important.

Oh. I thought it was something absolute.

[Shonai_Dweller]

Are there any ideas yet for how creation myths will function in worlds with little or no magic?

In truly magicless worlds, why not add something fixed like "this planet formed from asteroids a few billons of years ago"?

Because the creation myth forms the myths and legends that each race believes about their own creation. It won't be true in mundane worlds, but will be just as important.

Oh. I thought it was something absolute.

Mythgen directly effects everything in the world. It's not just background fluff. Mundane worlds, like our own, will feature civs whose ethics, values, legends, beliefs, laws, etc are based on their version of the myth. No magic, sure, but that never stopped religion having a massive impact on our world.

And interestingly, whenever Toady mentions this, he's always careful to say that the myth is "probably" not true. Not sure what that implies, but there's a good deal of fantasy literature that dwells on fantastical stuff suddenly happening to mundane worlds. The mind boggles.

[PlumpHelmetMan]

My main concern is just where worldgen would start in worlds where creation myths are (probably) false. Would there be a whole process of geology and evolution slowly shaping the world or would it just skip straight past the myth stage like it does now, or maybe something else entirely?

[Shonai_Dweller]

My main concern is just where worldgen would start in worlds where creation myths are (probably) false. Would there be a whole process of geology and evolution slowly shaping the world or would it just skip straight past the myth stage like it does now, or maybe something else entirely?

I expect magical geographic features are correctly tagged with a fantasy level so they don't happen at the most mundane point. Then it would just create the myth as always and start worldgen.

[PatrikLundell]

My main concern is just where worldgen would start in worlds where creation myths are (probably) false. Would there be a whole process of geology and evolution slowly shaping the world or would it just skip straight past the myth stage like it does now, or maybe something else entirely?

I expect magical geographic features are correctly tagged with a fantasy level so they don't happen at the most mundane point. Then it would just create the myth as always and start worldgen.

Good/Evil is going to be replaced by something spherish with Myth&Magic, but apart from that a fully mundane world would probably go through essentially the same creation as now (without Good/Evil), but with a Myth generation background preamble (influencing history, as civs build on it).
Normal magic worlds would probably also go through essentially the current world gen process, but with Myth causing magic land forms to (dis)appear and possibly other magic effects to be added (at least as a replacement for Good/Evil). There's no reason to mess with the current geography process for any of this (adjust for the new stuff, yes, but not replace it). Whacky magic is different, but I'd expect the current geography logic to remain (even though the layers are replaced with something completely different), if for no other reason that there are so many other things that are more urgent to change that there probably isn't time for fixing what ain't urgently broken.

[JesterHell696]

Will night trolls ever come to abduct dwarves in your fortress?

I hope. That would be very fun, especially if you could send your own dwarves to rescue them.

Then, since they transform at the time of birth, if it's a woman, perform surgery to remove the night troll embryo.

OK, I have a couple questions about this.

1. is it the same for male abductees? as in do they transform when the night troll mother gives birth?

2. If their abducted again their will(it is an abduction right?) does that mean that the night troll has to force them for the first insemination as they have not transformed yet and are still unwilling?


I mainly ask because there was a big discussion about adding rape to DF in the sex suggestion from the suggestion forum but this makes it sound like rape is already in DF, if so then DF's night trolls remind me of the trolls from the Berserk manga...

[KittyTac]

Will night trolls ever come to abduct dwarves in your fortress?

I hope. That would be very fun, especially if you could send your own dwarves to rescue them.

Then, since they transform at the time of birth, if it's a woman, perform surgery to remove the night troll embryo.

OK, I have a couple questions about this.

1. is it the same for male abductees? as in do they transform when the night troll mother gives birth?

2. If their abducted again their will(it is an abduction right?) does that mean that the night troll has to force them for the first insemination as they have not transformed yet and are still unwilling?


I mainly ask because there was a big discussion about adding rape to DF in the sex suggestion from the suggestion forum but this makes it sound like rape is already in DF, if so then DF's night trolls remind me of the trolls from the Berserk manga...

Not enough !!SCIENCE!! has been done on this.

[Derpy Dev]

I mainly ask because there was a big discussion about adding rape to DF in the sex suggestion from the suggestion forum but this makes it sound like rape is already in DF, if so then DF's night trolls remind me of the trolls from the Berserk manga...

Who the hell suggested that and why?

Nevermind, don't tell me...

[golemgunk]

OK, I have a couple questions about this.

1. is it the same for male abductees? as in do they transform when the night troll mother gives birth?

2. If their abducted again their will(it is an abduction right?) does that mean that the night troll has to force them for the first insemination as they have not transformed yet and are still unwilling?

I always imagined they were transformed into a night creature before mating. If the game code literally considers them non-troll until the birth that's probably just placeholder and the mechanics of night trolls will get fleshed out more later, maybe with the myth stuff.

[KittyTac]

OK, I have a couple questions about this.

1. is it the same for male abductees? as in do they transform when the night troll mother gives birth?

2. If their abducted again their will(it is an abduction right?) does that mean that the night troll has to force them for the first insemination as they have not transformed yet and are still unwilling?

I always imagined they were transformed into a night creature before mating. If the game code literally considers them non-troll until the birth that's probably just placeholder and the mechanics of night trolls will get fleshed out more later, maybe with the myth stuff.

You can actually find non-troll prisoners in their caves. And rescue them. Not sure if the consequences of a monster appearing in a town are calculated though.

[Max™]

If you make a dwarf converter caste and they kidnap an elf and convert it into a dwarf spouse and it becomes pregnant I have no idea why there would be a step where it goes back and has the (already converted) dwarf spouse pregnancy start as an elf and only get converted from an elf baby to a dwarf spouse baby upon birth.

[LordBaal]

Never thought rape could become so difficult to understand and follow. I'm confused.