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[Aklyon]

I've bought and played this game for a couple of hours. For now, I'm actually liking it quite a bit. It's more similar to Dawn of War 1 than Dawn of War 2, yet designed more around competitive matches. It's fun, but if you're looking for an RTS where you're turtling like hell and loving it, this is not for you. You're meant to play effectively and aggressively and not doing this will cause you to lose.

So they're trying to make a starcraft?

Yes, but even faster.

Well I know what game I'm not getting then.

[forsaken1111]

Sounds like it's nothing like the previous DoW games, and sounds like something I'd have absolutely no fun with.

[SharpKris]

dammit i had such hopes for this

[umiman]

dammit i had such hopes for this

Same, I really wanted it to be good.

Between the lackluster campaign, 3 races, lack of maps, those goddamn shield generators and turrets, lack of keybinding, the dumbass cover system, lack of unit customization in-game, frigging Denuvo, and most especially... lack of sync kills.

How can I justify paying CAD$72 on this?

[Sergarr]

and most especially... lack of sync kills.

Wait, what's that?

[umiman]

and most especially... lack of sync kills.

Wait, what's that?

Sync kills were basically what separated Dawn of War from juggernauts of the time like Warcraft 3: Frozen Throne and Rise of Nations.

Stuff like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fn1MqVHkwBw

And this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rz3STqxEdiw

It was like the Mortal Kombat of RTS since before then I don't think there were any RTS anywhere even close to being that bloody. Sure it sounds juvenile, but it basically defined the series. It was the only reason my friends and I even played it back in the day as the original DoW 1 without the expansions was pretty mediocre without it (and the voice acting). It's only after the release of the expansions did the game really come into its own.

Hell, the entire credit end sequence of DoW 1 was just a compilation of sync kills. That's how big it was back then.

They removed it because it doesn't work in an MP focused game. Such a stupid decision. Between sync kills and the voice acting, that's basically the entire DoW franchise. Without it it's just a Warhammer 40k themed RTS.

[Sergarr]

Oh, so the fatalities! Yeah, I know of them. They're very cool. Also, bullshit on "they don't work in MP games", I've literally never heard anyone complaining about them in MP settings.

[umiman]

Oh, so the fatalities! Yeah, I know of them. They're very cool. Also, bullshit on "they don't work in MP games", I've literally never heard anyone complaining about them in MP settings.

Yeah, it's frigging dumb. They completely lost sight of what made the franchise good to begin with.

It's like the Nürburgring syndrome. When a car maker says a car is designed for the Nürburgring, what they mean to say is that they stripped out all the soul and joy from it, removed all comfort and luxury, and optimized it for a very specific setting that almost no one will care about.

Same when a designer tries to take a good, regular game and tries to make it into a completely competitive multiplayer-only game. Why? It just destroys everything that made the game fun to begin with. Not everyone wants to become a super Starcraft 2 super expert mega pro. Those people are playing Starcraft 2. And even though Starcraft 2 was designed with the competitive scene in mind, it included extensive campaigns, tonnes of content, tonnes of maps, custom maps, and so on.

Command and Conquer 4 tried being optimized for multiplayer as well and look where it got them. One of the worst rated games on Steam. And even that honking pile of shit had a better campaign than this.

[Aklyon]

C&C4 also has the infamous honor of being a Command & Conquer game with no basebuilding.

A single class with turrets does not count, and the game might as well exist as a movie for all the care people have for it.

[aristabulus]

...
Command and Conquer 4 tried being optimized for multiplayer as well and look where it got them. One of the worst rated games on Steam. And even that honking pile of shit had a better campaign than this.

C&C4 also has the infamous honor of being a Command & Conquer game with no basebuilding.

A single class with turrets does not count.

I dunno, I think C+C4 probably suffered more from Westwood's corpse not having any marrow left in its bones.  MP focus probably didn't help, but EA's gonna EA.

-----

I'm a little sad to hear that DoW3 is troubled, but I still haven't finished DoW1...  or started DoW2.  So maybe they'll sort some of it out by the time I get around to playing?  *fingers crossed*

[Jopax]

The issue of C&C4 was that it was a F2P thing meant for the chinese market which got bought by EA and hastily and clumsily got bashed together with the C&C franchise, the end result being a shitshow of shit.

This on the other hand tries to be both DoW1 and DoW2 in certain ways, while at the same time getting rid of what made either game fun, interesting and unique. Leaving a shallow expirience without any of the flair or charm of the previous games. The only thing they managed is alienating old fans, and I doubt any newcomers will hang around for long if the game isn't vastly improved and expanded upon in game modes and mechanics, but Sega being Sega they'll whore all of that out with DLC, so bugger that prospect.

Also Sync kills were an issue since certain ones could lock units in long, unbreakable animations which left them open to getting easily focused and killed while they did their showy little dance of death.

And I agree that devs should stop chasing that goddamned holy grail of esports. Few games succeed there and even then they aren't guaranteed a long life since anything could come by and steal the scene. That isn't to say that they should forgo balance, but when faced with a choice of making something fun, interesting or just plain cool or leaving it out because it's hard to balance perfectly beacuse esports I think the choice should be clear there. Catering to a stupidly small minority of players is retarded and gets you nowhere.

[Folly]

Oh, so the fatalities! Yeah, I know of them. They're very cool. Also, bullshit on "they don't work in MP games", I've literally never heard anyone complaining about them in MP settings.

Does anyone else remember 'Fury'? It was a competitive team-arena type game, where every weapon type had multiple fatalities, and they were all glorious. The executor was vulnerable during the animation, but the game used the holy-trinity system of healers tanks and dps; healers would often toss a huge heal on enemies just when you were about to kill them, so finishers basically allowed attackers to give the enemy healers the middle finger by locking a weakened opponent into an inescapable death. It was incredibly satisfying every single time.

I miss that game.

[sambojin]

I'm really going to play the devil's advocate here. It kind of looks fun.

Not nearly the coolness or scale of battles of DoW1 (why the hell they didn't just remake this, but better, I don't know), not quite the hero-tastic DoW2 experience, but sort of in between.

Not super refined or polished, but kind of a quick and dirty RTS. Sort of a Clash Royale of closedish-squad-stuff pushes, but actually RTS'y.

It's got its faults, but might be fun for a quick bash, or to watch some games on Twitch once non-deadlock meta is worked out. Maybe not worthy of the title or franchise, or what we/you/me/anyone wanted, or even worth the full price, but it kind of looked like good simple fun.

An RTS for when you can't be bothered playing a proper RTS. I can't be bothered with tightly timed build queues or super-APM micro these days at decent Starcraft 2 style levels (even while my next RTS purchase will be Wargame: Red Dragon, which doesn't require any of that either, but is way more complex in a similar genre, so whatever), but this could be fun sometimes. As easily relatable to me as W:RD (I'm a 40k nerd as well as a military one), but so much lighter and less demanding to play. So just a good, clean, light, easy game to play.

Maybe. Not at that price, and it's not what I wanted, but it seems to have its qualities.

[umiman]

This has tight build queues and absurd levels of micro.

It's not a casual RTS.

[Urist McScoopbeard]

This has tight build queues and absurd levels of micro.

It's not a casual RTS.

That does not a good RTS make.