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[Neonivek]

Just a small suggestion.

Given that Titans are pretty much Genus Loci (little gods) it might be prudent to make them neigh on immortal.

After being killed they return to the earth where they spawned from and after a matter of days, months, years, centuries they return.

Either that allow that form of immortality to exist on a titan to titan basis.

[IndigoFenix]

Titans seem to be the symbolic guardians and manifestation of the untamed natural world, so it would make sense for them to be associated with the savagery of the surrounding lands.

They can attack settlements that encroach on their territory and, if killed, could regenerate, but only if the land remains 'untamed' - building new villages over their land should prevent their regeneration.  The conflict between titans and civilization could be symbolic of the conflict between civilization and 'the wild'.

It would also make sense for their presence to be related to the 'magic' in the land (good/evil/savage regions) - if the titan of a region is destroyed and the land is paved over, it becomes mundane.

[cochramd]

Going to have to respectfully disagree with you, OP. Whenever a titan or forgotten beast dies at one of my forts, I get a happy thought from knowing that I won't have to deal with it ever again, and the majority of titans you'll see at a fort aren't locals.

[Neonivek]

Going to have to respectfully disagree with you, OP.

That is fine, I appreciate your perspective on this matter.

[mirrizin]

Is the problem that you're running out of titans?

[Neonivek]

Is the problem that you're running out of titans?

No, I just think it fits rather thematically with the Titans.

They are essentially just Incarna of locations, manifestations. The idea that they cannot truly be destroyed is a rather interesting one and is one that has been used in mythology before.

AND this is the sort of game where immortality, well of this type, is a genuinely interesting gimmick. At least until Demons get the same ability later on.

[IndigoFenix]

If demons are resurrected in the underworld, it wouldn't really change gameplay much, but it would make the game more interesting.

[NW_Kohaku]

I like the concept.  Megabeasts should be more meaningful than just one-off events where a dragon rams straight into my cage trap.

I think perhaps more stratifying of megabeasts as a genius loci, embodiments of the laws of nature and magic within a given area of the world, and "more common" demi-megabeasts and night creatures that might roam would be demanded of this idea as well, though.

That said, I also put forward the idea of basing regional magic levels off of the continued existence of megabeasts, and think that DF's eras as a whole support a notion that megabeasts exist as a "cosmic keystone" that supports the magical ecosystem, and when they die, you haven't just put some magic trophy on the wall, but have actively aided the gradual decay of the world into mundanity.

[Detoxicated]

I like the concept.  Megabeasts should be more meaningful than just one-off events where a dragon rams straight into my cage trap.

I think perhaps more stratifying of megabeasts as a genius loci, embodiments of the laws of nature and magic within a given area of the world, and "more common" demi-megabeasts and night creatures that might roam would be demanded of this idea as well, though.

That said, I also put forward the idea of basing regional magic levels off of the continued existence of megabeasts, and think that DF's eras as a whole support a notion that megabeasts exist as a "cosmic keystone" that supports the magical ecosystem, and when they die, you haven't just put some magic trophy on the wall, but have actively aided the gradual decay of the world into mundanity.

Your arguments are flawless regarding the history of DF eras, I really like your idea.

[IndigoFenix]

This would go nicely with the plan to change the good/evil/savage system to something more sphere based.  Megabeasts and titans are already associated with spheres, so perhaps lesser magical creatures could be as well, along with a tag (like MAGICAL) implying that they require a 'source' of at least one of their spheres to survive.  Every region could start out with a 'guardian' creature that would allow associated magical beasts to appear in its domain.  Once it is killed, the magical beast population dwindles and disappears.  Plants and regional effects could also be associated with spheres and depend on guardian creatures.  Imagine if you could lift the curse from a reanimating evil region by killing the death beast presiding over it. 

Worshippers of said beast might bar your way, making things more interesting.  It would also be a good idea if some megabeasts were benign - at least until you cut down too many trees and angered the Great Lord of the Fairy Forest.  Elves would suddenly seem a lot more justified.

The only problem with this is that we would need a lot more magical creatures, plants, and regional effects to be associated with the many spheres.  Toady was probably planning on making more procedural generators anyway though.

[NW_Kohaku]

Worshippers of said beast might bar your way, making things more interesting.  It would also be a good idea if some megabeasts were benign - at least until you cut down too many trees and angered the Great Lord of the Fairy Forest.  Elves would suddenly seem a lot more justified.

The only problem with this is that we would need a lot more magical creatures, plants, and regional effects to be associated with the many spheres.  Toady was probably planning on making more procedural generators anyway though.

That pretty much was the Xenosynthesis suggestion.

Anyway, yes, it's probable the best way to handle such a thing is just coming up with ways to apply changes to a template creature, in the way that giant creatures are just creatures made bigger, or creature-people are creatures made humanoid-ish and sapient. Like I was saying over there, you could make "song sphere" creatures by making birdsong into something more like an actual chorus as per a Disney movie, while "healing sphere" creatures start regenerating like Wolverine.

[Melting Sky]

Titans seem to be the symbolic guardians and manifestation of the untamed natural world, so it would make sense for them to be associated with the savagery of the surrounding lands.

They can attack settlements that encroach on their territory and, if killed, could regenerate, but only if the land remains 'untamed' - building new villages over their land should prevent their regeneration.  The conflict between titans and civilization could be symbolic of the conflict between civilization and 'the wild'.

It would also make sense for their presence to be related to the 'magic' in the land (good/evil/savage regions) - if the titan of a region is destroyed and the land is paved over, it becomes mundane.

Cool ideas. I think in order to keep Titans from becoming cheap and spammy you would want to make the period of time it takes them to reform a rather lengthy one. A time scale measured in decades seems reasonable. That way only the most ancient of player owned forts would ever have a chance of seeing the return of a Titan they slew in the fort's infancy.

[Deboche]

Titans seem to be the symbolic guardians and manifestation of the untamed natural world, so it would make sense for them to be associated with the savagery of the surrounding lands.

They can attack settlements that encroach on their territory and, if killed, could regenerate, but only if the land remains 'untamed' - building new villages over their land should prevent their regeneration.  The conflict between titans and civilization could be symbolic of the conflict between civilization and 'the wild'.

It would also make sense for their presence to be related to the 'magic' in the land (good/evil/savage regions) - if the titan of a region is destroyed and the land is paved over, it becomes mundane.

I like this, it reminds me of Princess Mononoke and the Forest Spirit.

That said, I also put forward the idea of basing regional magic levels off of the continued existence of megabeasts, and think that DF's eras as a whole support a notion that megabeasts exist as a "cosmic keystone" that supports the magical ecosystem, and when they die, you haven't just put some magic trophy on the wall, but have actively aided the gradual decay of the world into mundanity.

I lean more toward thinking that even the so-called mundane world is magical and a decay of magic would mean a decay of everything. If you pop off a titan, either another one will turn up or some other magical manifestation elsewhere. If you pave over a magical field, you're just changing the raw material and might end up with an urban beast made of sewage or rags.

[Robsoie]

Agree completely when making Titans more meaningful, as unfortunately currently they're no different than your average giants or giant version of anything else, except they're generated randomly , that lead more into hilarity than awe inspiring events when you get a coral titan and your weakest dwarf insta-kill it with a simple kick.

Something should also be done with the

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

demonlords of gob civs too

In the past, they were just

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

random demon that escaped hell and found their way up dring worldgen

but in current version, it's much different

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

with one of the gods that insert a demonlord into reality to fit a specific goal, leading to the vault, the slab and etc...

That is sadly only fluff text that has none of the impact it should have at gameplay time, out of

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

just being able to banish or enslave said demonlord under specific conditions, but still impact nothing else despite such demonlord whole purpose in the reality

Man, you think by the time those things should not require spoilers tags anymore.

Hopefully, the whole myth generator stuff will have real consequence on gameplay, not only worldgen text

[NW_Kohaku]

Actually, I wonder if goblin leaders even deserve spoiler tags, since they are, you know, revealed at the start of gameplay if you just ask someone in Adventure Mode, and the new myth generation will outright tell you these things at the start of worldgen. It's probably just the candy and HFS that deserve spoilers and not the special sub-race of goblin leaders.