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[andrea]

The war of glorious arsttzkan conquest a few years ago showed how important extra territory and resources are. since there is neutral land in between, I think we should focus our efforts on taking as much as possible, as quickly as possible.

one thing I am concerned with is, can our navy carry and deploy armored units? we might need some proper landing boats if we want to land a good force before having to conquer a safe port.

[RAM]

Is there any chance that we could pull off a ground-effect craft? I could seriously go for some ekranoplan...

Spoiler: ground support aircraft (click to show/hide)

Name: Medusa(I am not familiar with the naming conventions, feel free to suggest something appropriate.
Type: Vehicle (Medium)
Designation: ideally attached to general infantry, but it requires airfields and such so probably specialised...
Description:
Regear the engine and propeller from the AS-HF-32 To slower flight. Mount 2-4 engines on top of the wings, each with a separate reserve fuel-supply. Use broad wings for a lower stall speed. Apply heavy armour, probably use steel.
Strip down an AS-DT25 and centrally-mount it with a gunner to maintain it. Add a pair of AC-18s mounted above the wings either side of the fuselage. Attempt to give the gunner a rear-pointing bumblebee AA turret.
This craft is intended to hunt mobile ground targets and ignore obsolete aircraft.
Projected Cost:5 ore, 5 oil

[Zanzetkuken The Great]

Which design is it people want me to roll for of all the suggested?

[Aseaheru]

 I think we need to wait on Funk showing up again, to see if they still support the GL or one of the new things.

 RAM, for naming, I think its probably going to be along the lines of "initials of what the thing is dash date" while trying to prevent confusion.

[Funk]

im still for the GL.

As for naming lets have thing plus date, only useing initials gets to confusing.

[Kot]

im still for the GL.

Meanwhile the other side built jet troop planes and are now invading whole neutral ground at once. Like, kaman (hue) people...

Anyway, for future reference -

Spoiler: NG-H51 (click to show/hide)

New Guinean Helicopter, model of 1951 is a proposed reliable, all-weather synchropter using two AS-HF-32 engines, one for each rotor. Due to it's big fuselage it is capable of transporting 14 people and at least 1500 kg of equipment with max fully loaded speed being at around 200km/h. It's max range is range 630km, which could be extended to 1320km with auxiliary fuel tanks. The helicopter utilizes wheel landing gear, a bullet-resistant windshield, radio, self-sealing fuel tanks, provisions for external or internal auxiliary fuel tanks, external cargo hook, two sliding doors with machinegun mounts and rear ramp with possibily of mounting an AC-18 (do we have it or not, since the plane uses it?) there. The armament can be enchanced by twin fixed Bumblebee AT/AA on side mounts or bombs.

Target cost: (3-4 ore, 3-4 oil)
Size: Medium
Designation: Vehicle

[Aseaheru]

 That is going to have issues. That model appears to be for turbines, not the engines we have to deal with currently.

 Do we have a name for the engines we have right now? I think they are just abstracted... And I really hope you are talking about using two of the engines from the AS-HF-32, and not two of the entire aircraft.
 Also to note, twin 90mm cannon for ground attack roles? Oof. That seems slightly overkill, and probably wont be that accurate...

[Kot]

That is going to have issues. That model appears to be for turbines, not the engines we have to deal with currently. Do we have a name for the engines we have right now? I think they are just abstracted... And I really hope you are talking about using two of the engines from the AS-HF-32, and not two of the entire aircraft.

Shshshs, nobody is going to notice. Also, using two whole planes for engines sounds like great idea, we should try it.

Also to note, twin 90mm cannon for ground attack roles? Oof. That seems slightly overkill, and probably wont be that accurate...

Ey, we don't have rockets, I'm not sure if we do actually have the old Arstotzkan autocannon, and even if it seems to be too weak for that... also, if you overkill, you don't need accuracy. Those things will literally rip buildings and tanks apart.

[Aseaheru]

 If they hit.

[Kot]

Twin 90mm cannons hit everything in front, with enough firepower shitty accuracy is a quality on it's own.

[Aseaheru]

 Depending on if they are rigged to fire at the same time or independently, they only fire every two or four seconds, the four seconds being for slightly more manageable recoil. Not quite enough volume of fire to spray and pray an area, and heck, they may be unable to even do that. Depends on if we can make a 90mm autocannon out of them.

 Then theres weight to contend with...


 Anyways, as it stands we have two votes for the GL, Kot for the helicopter, RAM for his ground attack variant of the heavy fighter that includes a 90mm gun, and Andres wanting some form of transport beyond ships that need a harbor and big-ole aircraft.

[RAM]

I thought it was a single 50mm forward and twin, umm, heavyish, umm, I did a forum search and looked it up, but umm, I meant the same weapons that the existing fighter had. Aren't they about 10-20 mm? Did I put in the wrong thing? It would be really nice to have local copies of the current technology and not need to dig them up out of the other thread... And then there is the flak turret on the back, which is probably impractical... But awesome, it would be grand to use it to discourage pursuit, and the odd flak burst over a troop formation would likely discourage retaliation as the plane turns away after an attack run.

*sighs*

[RAM]

Spoiler: The descriptions I could find of the items referenced in the technology descriptions. (click to show/hide)

AS-AC18: An advanced primer ignition autocannon, which ignites cartridge primers before the round is fully chambered. It fires the new, large, 20x100mm round, fed from a top-mounted 25 round C-shaped magazine with a powerful spring, usually armor piercing, about 600 times per minute. The weapon is quite large with a simple action but heavy barrel, weighing over 40 kilograms, and it requires being mounted to a carriage, foundation, or vehicle to fire with accuracy, although recoil is reduced by the nature of its action. It is dependent on a careful balance between the force of the shell and the force of the action, which means that different ammo types cannot be interchanged without recalibrating the gun. It has a terrifying ability to punch through armor and emplacements. Costs 3 ore due to its size and the size of its ammo.

-7.62mm Rifle rounds. Largish round for small arms with good stopping power.

-AS-F14A: A 7.62mm, semi-automatic rifle. It is an open bolt blowback action, and uses a 12-round box magazine which protrudes below the gun. Unlike the Nosin, the bolt has a small, non-rotating handle on the side of the gun. It has adjustable iron sights. The weight of the moving action makes the gun difficult to control compared to the Nosin, but this is mitigated by using a full size and weight barrel compared to the original carbine version. The blowback action is now more reliable, though still open bolt. Also available as a carbine.

-Nosin-Magant: Officer weapon. A Russian Mosin-Nagant rifle, brand new ones roll off the assembly lines, and then a highly skilled team changes the letters with chisels. A bolt-action rifle with a five-round clip which fires 7.62mm rounds. Good accuracy, but with iron sights which have a post adjustable up to one kilometer, designed for long-range but inaccurate barrages. Good stopping power against infantry. Detachable bayonet.

-AS-P32: Arstotzka's new parachute rigging. The parachute itself is large and round, and various straps, clips and buckles allow a soldier to carry a light primary weapon, such as the Nosin, AS-F14 or MC16, and their ammo and a grenade, or an AS-1924 but not much ammo. Alternatively, a paratrooper could also bring an AS-1911 mortar and a few rounds, but only their sidearm with it. Radios need to be dropped separately.

*fails to find references for the M3 radio or M34 landmine*

"RHA"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolled_homogeneous_armour
"New Armor Rules
In real life, armor is almost always steel until after world war II. It ranges from 6-25mm on early tanks to around 100mm max, with a greater effective thickness thanks to angling. The stuff normal tanks use is rolled homogenous armor, a type of forged, hardened steel, while you're probably using mild steel so far (something only training versions of tanks are normally made from). Aluminum is lighter, titanium weighs as much as aluminum but is strong like steel, and rubber or cement armor exist as well but are best used as part of a composite. There are a number of alloys to be discovered but I will probably not get into them.

I will establish armor values, which stack from different factors in a way similar to expense. A round striking armor has a penetration value at medium range, with a +1 bonus for close range and a -1 penalty for long range. Armor penetration values will be hidden from you for now. Armor values are as follows:
1) Thin, <10 mm (all measures approximate and used for historical reference)
2) Light, 10-24 mm
3) Medium, 25-50 mm
4) Heavy, 51-100 mm
5) Extra Heavy, 101-150 mm
6) Extreme, more than 150mm. Only historical example I can find is the Maus tank and ironclad ships.

Materials give a bonus to that value. Mild Steel (your current shitty tanks) is -1, RHA is 0. Aluminum is 0 but lighter, Titanium is +1, and composites or more exotic armors may be +1 or higher with various effects on the weight and cost. Good spacing and angling can give a further bonus (which might be wholly or partially negated by APBC rounds or an opponent's good marksmanship).

When building armor, you can specify the thickness and material of the armor in different areas, as well as attempt to research new materials and techniques (you're not getting titanium any time soon though). Right now, extreme armor would be too expensive to build and sink in the mud if you did. Thicker armor also presents an engineering challenge in general; making thick armor is a technology on its own.

I'm of course open to suggestions and will likely revise this rule set. In particular, I don't yet have a hard cost modifier tied to different thickness (I want to consider it with the size of the vehicle to be armored). Keep in mind that 0 armor is still armor and can stop stuff like 9mm pistol rounds."

The description of the AS-T25 is already the primary reference for the as-DT25.

L-1 Tiger: The Tiger is, despite its fierce name, a truck. It has a long, narrow nose in front of the cab containing a twelve cylinder engine, and the steering wheels are next to it under round cowls. It has a bed where a hopper, tanker, seats, trailer hitches or other things can easily be attached. There are six rear drive wheels, on independent suspension. Costs 3 ore, 2 oil.

-AS-DB-HF-23: An airplane built entirely from aluminium. This lighter, sturdier frame allows the plane be reasonably fast with a 9-cylinder radial engine and make aggressive dives and recoveries for bombing, with half a ton of bombs. The radial engine is designed entirely around an AS-AC18 which fires through the prop shaft, necessitating a relatively heavy and thick prop shaft. It has decent maneuverability, with its metal design allowing for strong forces on the wings and tail, and large control surfaces, but it is best at dogfighting while not carrying a bomb load. Costs 4 ore, 3 oil.
...
-AS-1931-HAFB: A three-engine bomber with a shoulder wing. It is constructed of a geodetic aluminium frame with resin-treated fabric skin. The pilot sits in a cockpit on the front of the plane with a pyramidal canopy, and between the two wings is an AC18 gunner, on top of the plane, with a 360 degree rotation under a trapezoidal canopy.  It has an engine in the nose and one slung under each wing, the engines are turbocharged and fuel injected. Despite its size, this enables it to almost keep pace with AS-HF-24s and gives it a high altitude ceiling. These engines burn a lot of fuel, and so the craft is not capable of especially longer range than Arstotzkan fighters. It carries a two-ton payload of bombs, and a bomber with a sight which can be adjusted based on a written table for airspeed and altitude. At full altitude, these bombs are incapable of hitting precise targets, and especially moving targets. The plane also has fixed landing gear. Costs 5 ore, 4 oil.

*no reference found for UF-19*

[Zanzetkuken The Great]

*no reference found for UF-19*

Thought I had changed that over to the Bumblebee...must've missed it by accident.

[Aseaheru]

The landmine and the radio are moskurg designs.

Which makes me sorta sad as one was made by my side which I still cant remember how to spell the name of.