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[Zanzetkuken The Great]

Arms Race Hub Thread
International (Turn) Thread

========================================================
From: Desk of Prime Minister Mahathir Rahman
To: The Board of Weapons Design

Attached are all details of the weapons we have and their distribution amongst our military
forces.  As can be seen, we have limited variety for deployment, and many vastly outstrip
our current ability of production.  The Republic trusts that you will be able to solve these
issues rapidly.  If you do not, then there will be consequences.
========================================================

Spoiler: Designs (click to show/hide)

Personal Equipment
MK-47 Assault Rifle: (2 Ore)(Personal, Medium, General) This is a blowback operated rifle using .30 caliber rounds, designed to be an automatic weapon with a similar size and role to the Model 1 Service Rifle. It has a rear pistol grip, a slotted wooden foregrip and a 30 round magazine which mounts on the side. It is based on the Cascade's action, but heavily reinforced to withstand the pressures incurred by full size rifle rounds. The heavy moving bolt significantly affects accuracy when firing automatically, even at medium range. The weapon has a heavy barrel to prevent overheating and help with the recoil, which makes the weapon weigh around 16 pounds, but the recoil from rapidly firing rifle rounds is still a significant issue. Fires 600 rounds per minute. Costs 2 ore.
M3 Sorraia GPMG: (3 Ore)(Personal, Large, Officer) A .30 caliber machine gun fed from a belt. 50-round belts can be strung together for extended fire or stored in a belt box attached to the Sorraia, which for practical purposes is similar to a magazine. Unlike the Brumby, it uses a recoil action, and is configured to fire around 800 rounds per minute, achieved with the help of a muzzle booster (which looks like a flared end on the barrel). It is slightly lighter, at 22 pounds. Comes with an integrated bipod, can be used on a tripod for emplacements. It uses similar heat sinks to the Brumby, which are now shrouded. It has a changeable barrel, which is necessary for emplacement use. It is effective to a greater distance than the Brumby when so mounted, about 800 yards.
UF-P33: ((Personal, Large, General) A parachute based upon the Arstotzkan AS-P32 design.  It is large and round, and has various straps, clips and buckles to allow a soldier to carry a light primary weapon, ammunition, and a grenade, or a large weapon with limited ammo.
UF-M4 Radio: (1 Ore)(Personal, Large, Officer) A 30 pound vacuum tube radio that improves over the Model 3 from not needing to be assembled before use and having an internalized battery. It is both man-portable and can fit into most vehicles without affecting performance.  Range had to be sacrificed to keep the weight low and the battery fairly often runs down on long offenses.
UF-M35 Cobra: (1 Ore, 1 Oil)(Personal, Medium, General) A disc shaped landmine based upon the M34 Viper Landmine.  This design has a greater amount of explosives within the mine, but is also smaller.  The end result is that the mine has the same explosive power at a smaller size and lower cost.
AS-SP30: (1 Ore)(Personal, Small, General/Officer) An old Arstotzka-made 9mm semi-automatic pistol. It has a 10-round magazine and can fire quickly with moderate accuracy, at short range. Moderate stopping power. It is pretty reliable. It has a threaded barrel and can be fitted with a suppressor.

Vehicles
T2 Breaker: (5 Ore, 2 Oil)(Vehicle, Medium, Specialized) A tank built from new Rolled Homogenous Armor, like tanks should be made of. It is medium armored throughout, with a slanted front but mostly square. The turret is specially cast as a rounded dome and rotates with electrical motors. Includes a new 1.6 inch rifled Breaker cannon, with a long barrel, suspension and muzzle brake. The Breaker cannon can fire about 24 times a minute, it is single loaded by hand. It also has a coaxially mounted Sorraia. The exit hatch in towards the mach of the tank and includes a pintle-mounted Sorraia. The tank is a heavy, it sits on wide cowled treads and is powered by a big 12-cylinder diesel engine, and can get up to about 23 mph. Crewed by a driver, loader, gunner, and commander. It is reinforced with extra slat armor and has been standardized with a radio.
UF-L2 Bengal: (3 Ore, 2 Oil) (Vehicle, Medium, General) A truck based upon the L-1 Tiger. The primary difference is within the base of the truck being reinforced and its rear wheels being doubled up.  This costs it speed, but renders it more resistant to sabotage.

Artillery/Anti-Air
Bumblebee AT/AA: (Costs 2 ore)(Vehicle, Medium, Specialized) A 3.6 inch gun. It can be aimed down close to the ground, or up the sky, and most of the new technology it includes is for this second purpose. It is aimed by a gunner who sits in a seat which inclines and declines with the gun itself, and has an iron sight which consists of two rings, the front of which has a "spiderweb" design. The gun is aimed with two traversal wheels. The gun is designed to fire new fuzed flak rounds, which have an adjustable timer set by a dial on the gun itself. There is also a mechanical targeting calculator, which is a box around the size of the Model 3 Radio that has a dial for target range, and rate of change of range, which can set the fuze time for shells accurately as the target moves. Additionally given an altitude and angle, the sight will automatically offset so that the gunner need merely keep the crosshair over the target. It is pretty effective, and also cheap and reliable. However, adjusting targeting calculator takes too long to aim at dive bombers and close, low-altitude planes. Fires about 15 times a minute.

Aircraft
Model 4 Yellowjacket: (3 ore, 3 oil)(Vehicle, Medium, Specialized)A fighter aircraft, built fully of aluminum. It has flat low wings on a relatively long, narrow fuselage which holds its V12 motor. The motor is fuel injected, and cooled by a water radiator. It has six exhaust pipes poking out under the wing on each side, and a canopy-covered pilot seat close to the tail. It is relatively sturdy and maneuverable, it is fast and makes tight maneuvers but is "temperamental", prone to going into out-of-control rolls and requiring a tight grip on the joystick. The canopy includes a tubular gun sight. The six Sorraia guns in the wings provide ample firepower, but the six guns and their ammo are somewhat heavy. Moves faster and maneuvers better than the Wasp, as well as having a higher altitude ceiling.
UF-1939 (5 Ore, 5 Oil)(Vehicle, Large, Specialized) A six-engine aircraft based upon the AS-1931-HAFB to transport the initial assault force to take a major port upon the island to allow UF-CV39s to have a place to land.  Much of its armaments had to be sadly removed in this revision in order to hold more soldiers.

Navy
UF-CV35: (6 Ore, 3 Oil) (Ship, Medium) A diesel-powered troop transport designed to carry further units onto an island for an invasion.  It mounts an Bumblebee AT/AA on the bow for air defense.

Spoiler: Deployment (click to show/hide)

Infantry
9 (Units)
  l- General - MK-47, UF-M35 Cobra, AS-SP30
  l- Officers - M3 Sorraia GPMG, UF-M4 Radio, AS-SP30
  l- Vehicles - UF-L2 Bengal

2 (Units)
  l- General - MK-47, UF-M35 Cobra, UF-1942, UF-P33
  l- Officers - M3 Sorraia GPMG, UF-M4 Radio, UF-1942, UF-P33

Armor
2 (Units)
  l- T2 Breaker
1 (Unit)
  l- Bumblebee AT/AA

Air Force
2 (Units)
  l- UF-1939
1 (Unit)
  l- Model 4 Yellowjacket

Navy
4 (Units)
  l- UF-CV35

Spoiler: Resources (click to show/hide)

1 Ore
1 Oil
0 Uranium
0 Chemicals
0 Exotic

[Taricus]

Okay, looking this all over first thing we could use is a new ship, preferably one that's actually designed for sea combat.

[Baffler]

We're also using the older version of the MK-47 without the intermediate cartridge or recoil compensation. That doesn't feel as immediately important as getting a destroyer (or perhaps some kind of torpedo/dive bomber based on the yellowjacket) but they have that fancy AR-34 so it's not something we can ignore for long.

I also notice that we don't actually have any infantry weapons, besides our pistols and landmines, that aren't at least Expensive. Which could be a problem.

[Taricus]

Well, the same can be said of theirs though.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

I think we need to think about creating focus.. - littoral ships? Submarines? Helicopters?

Proposal number 1(We have no naming convention, so...)
Motor Torpedo Boat powered by two Breaker 12 cylinder diesels engine and armed with a single Bumblebee gun, 2 Sorraria's and new Malaysia designed torpedo tubes, carrying two torpedoes.

This design invents few new things, and I hope most of focus will be spent on getting proper torpedoes

Proposal number 2
Light helicopter powered by slightly modified V12 used for Yellowjacket. Armed with a single sorraria it is transport helicopter, created for rapid delplotement over contested islands

We should take this if we want to focus on helicopters. It is very nice weapon for island hoping warfare

Proposal number 3
Light APC using new 6 cylinder engine, armed with a single Sorraria and capable to carry 6 men. It should be slow and light enough to be transportable by UF-1939\air droppable and have great all-terrain capabilities

It will greatly help our initial airborne landing

Proposal number 4
0.50 calibre machinegun.

We need those for newer fighter\revision of the current, 0.3 armed fighters in 1947? Common. All other vehicles need it, too. Some buff for infantry can't hurt, either

Proposal number 5
Light coastal artillery. long barrelled 5 inch guns meant to protect ports against enemy navy. Preferably come with electronics\radar  assisted targeting

we need to defend our coast and weapon for our navy. Next turn we can design a ship armed with those. It may sound obsolete approach for the era but I doubt we will have access to missiles soon and it can be a nice intermediate step

Proposal number 6
Curse Florenia that never gave us their RPG and design our own single use anti-tank weapon

Anti-armor capabilities need some improvement

[Taricus]

Helicopter is a good idea, yeah. Arm it with two though, on side pintle mounts. That way it's a little better at covering our troops. Or make it a recon aircraft so that we don't fail horribly trying to make a proper transport 'copter on our first try.

[Baffler]

I like helicopters, but I still think we'd be better off going navy first. Gaining control of the neutral islands and establishing a naval presence in the early game is going to be critical, but we don't have the technical base to get a decent submarine yet. How's this look? It's bigger than Proposal 1, but should be a lot more versatile.

Borneo Class Corvette
A small warship intended for convoy escort and coastal support. It has a displacement of 1,500 tons, and a target speed of 30 knots. Armaments include bumblebee guns mounted on elevated platforms at the bow and stern, equipped with atomic motors for rapid tracking, and a complement of 6 sorraia GPMGs. It has an innovative fire control system, utilizing a manned topside director, a conical scan acquisition and tracking radar, an analog computer to compute ballistics solutions, and a gyro stabilization unit to allow its guns to accurately track both air and seaborne targets.

[Taricus]

Looks good, you have my backing for it.

[Zanzetkuken The Great]

Borneo Class Corvette
A small warship intended for convoy escort and coastal support. It has a displacement of 1,500 tons, and a target speed of 30 knots. Armaments include bumblebee guns mounted on elevated platforms at the bow and stern, equipped with atomic motors for rapid tracking, and a complement of 6 sorraia GPMGs. It has an innovative fire control system, utilizing a manned topside director, a conical scan acquisition and tracking radar, an analog computer to compute ballistics solutions, and a gyro stabilization unit to allow its guns to accurately track both air and seaborne targets.

Don't forget the target cost and the ship's size class (V. Small, Small, Medium, Large, V. Large).

[Ukrainian Ranger]

I am not a huge fan of 1500 ton displacement vessel full of electronics until we get more ore\oil\chemicals... look: it is a medium sized ship, new technology (targeting computers) and will lack at least 8 resources, (6ore, 3 oil, 1 chemicals looks like a minimum) making it a major effort and one ship per turn Should we roll 3 or 1 and we are looking at theoretical stuff.

Piranha MGB *I suggest fishes for navy*
Very simple rugged motor gun boat that reuses existing technologies and uses no high tech solutions. It's hull made from wood strengthened by thin metal armour in key places
The boat is Powered by T2 Breaker's 12 cylinder diesels engine and armed with a single dual-purpose Bumblebee gun + firing positions for crew\marines to use whatever personal weaponry they have

While its main goal is to hunt enemy UF-CV35 transports and provide basic AA cover against low flying targets, the boat is capable to carry small boarding parties\deliver supplies
[Ship, very small, ore 2, oil 2]

I want to start with a simple cheap design that will make an immediate impact in island capturing campaign but will remain viable later.

And alternative: helicopter

Pigeon, light helicopter
Innovative design roughly based on WW2 helicopters. This helicopter has very light frame, unarmed and utilizes a powerful motor capable to carry pilot, respectable amount of fuel and necessary equipment. It is created solely for reconnaissance roles and should be capable to land on unmodified UF-CV35. It houses new, more modern radio system backwards compatible with UF-M4, photocamera and various equipment to make pilots life easier

[Vehicle, Small, Specialized cost: 1 ore, 2 oil, 1 chemicals (for advanced radio and stuff), new techs planned for use: helicopters, advanced electronics]

This is a very different route. We start helicopters early to get proper ones later, but its combat usefulness will be very limited by extremely expensive\major effort cost and



and one more offer:

Bolt, light jet bomber
Small light jet bomber design that uses many advanced imported materials and technologies. It is capable to carry only one small bomb. To save space, weight and improve aerodynamics it has no machineguns. The aircraft has average range and poor manoeuvrability but its speed should allow it to to outrun piston era enemy fighters and avoid anti-air artillery fire.

It is designed to be used in hit and run tactics and surprise bombing raids against both naval and land targets.
[Vehicle, Small, Specialized expected cost: 2 ore, 2 oil, 1 chemicals, 1 rares, new tech expected: jet engine]

This one has limited usefulness, high cost, will get outdated in the era of jet fighters and missiles  but will allow us to kickstart our air force getting us jet engine earlier. I expect it to be extremely expensive (+2 levels from resources cost, 1 from jet engine) but with it being small, we will get 1 unit per turn. More when we will get more resources

What is more important - the five turns of jet powered aircrafts being more expensive will start NOW, giving us a long term advantage in airforce in the mid game.

[Zanzetkuken The Great]

Which design is it people want me to roll for of all the suggested?

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Hey, you really need to give us some time We don't have enough engenieers to discuss\vote, yet.

My vote goes for :
Bolt, light jet bomber
Small light jet bomber design that uses many advanced imported materials and technologies. It is capable to carry only one small bomb. To save space, weight and improve aerodynamics it has no machineguns. The aircraft has average range and poor manoeuvrability but its speed should allow it to to outrun piston engine fighters and avoid anti-air artillery fire.

It is designed to be used in hit and run tactics and surprise bombing raids against both naval and land targets.
[Vehicle, Small, Specialized expected cost: 2 ore, 2 oil, 1 chemicals, 1 rares, new tech expected: jet engine]

And I suggest others to vote for it
Reasons why I want it
a) Early jet engine for further use
b) The closest island to conquer is just across a thin straight, so bombing runs will have some effect
c) Should enemy ships get too close they will get a nasty surprise from bomb-dropping jets
d) Accelerating island conquest by doing something to transport our troops is tempting but few +points to rolls will not increase our chances that much and I prefer to aim for long term advantages
e) The earlier we start building airforce the larger it will be in 3-4 turns
f) I want to focus on airforce. I plan to spend revision on improving this design and improving Yellowjacket or improving Yellowjacket and transport ships should we get a real good design roll.

[Taricus]

Yeah, the problem with that is until we get something resembling a guided munition that jet bomber wouldn't be effective. Besides, we can convert our current transport plane into a bomber fairly easily for all the benefits that brings.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Again, it is a simple aircraft acting as a step in the right direction. We can't design a real jet fighter. Partly because we have no weapons to stick on it, partly because we have no resources for a medium sized jet aircraft.

Yet I disagree that converting transport plane in a bomber again will have the same effect. That one will be strategical bomber, while this one is for close air support. It is absolutely different role. And such conversion offers little long term benefit, because it gives us no useful experience and such bombers will become obsolete real soon.


_______

Sure, I could vote for this

Borneo Class Corvette
A small warship intended for convoy escort and coastal support. It has a displacement of 1,500 tons, and a target speed of 30 knots. Armaments include bumblebee guns mounted on elevated platforms at the bow and stern, equipped with atomic motors for rapid tracking, and a complement of 6 sorraia GPMGs. It has an innovative fire control system, utilizing a manned topside director, a conical scan acquisition and tracking radar, an analog computer to compute ballistics solutions, and a gyro stabilization unit to allow its guns to accurately track both air and seaborne targets.

to get the turn faster but.

Realistic minimum cost for it is - (medium, 6 Ore, 3 Oil, 1 chemicals) This is 8(+3 expense levels) short if we are very lucky, 9(still +3)  short if we are lucky, 10 (+4) short if we are unluckly. All electronics included are at least +1 expense level from new tech. Making it either major effort with one ship per turn or theoretical.

I simply can't vote for it.
PS. what is atomic motor?

[Baffler]

A typo, it's supposed to say electric. And I suppose you're right about the expense. It's not a bad design, but better to hold off.

Bolt, light jet bomber
Small light jet bomber design that uses many advanced imported materials and technologies. It is capable to carry only one small bomb. To save space, weight and improve aerodynamics it has no machineguns. The aircraft has average range and poor manoeuvrability but its speed should allow it to to outrun piston engine fighters and avoid anti-air artillery fire.

It is designed to be used in hit and run tactics and surprise bombing raids against both naval and land targets.
[Vehicle, Small, Specialized expected cost: 2 ore, 2 oil, 1 chemicals, 1 rares, new tech expected: jet engine]

I can get behind this one. We can only produce 4 of them this turn (though I suppose they're highly unlikely to be shot down unless we get some absolutely terrible rolls,) but we should have more resources when we capture some of the other islands and this thing is well suited to attack troop transports from a base on shore.