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[Reverie]

I'm talking about likely permutations. We know who TempAcc thought was scummy.
As far as getting the godfather vengekilled, it's an acceptable loss for scum. Him being godfather makes little difference in such a case, and you guys had a contingency plan in case I wasn't the one to die.
Also, I think you're wrong about what makes sense or would be easy. Do you really think you could make enough waves to convince the townie on the noose to vengekill who you were pressuring? Propping one mafiaso up by sacrificing the other is easy, but clever. With a game this short, it wouldn't have been likely for town to catch on in time—except you were openly confident coming into D2. Enough to request that we squabble amongst ourselves and in self-defence pending your judgement.

Nope.

[origamiscienceguy]

The townie who was lynched would probably vengekill the guy who I thought was scum because I was "pretending to be on their side" according to your theory, then they would listen. So why wuldn't I just pressure him to vengekill another townie and win the game outright? It ends the day earlier. Your theory makes no sense, and I don't see why you continue trying to find a reason to lynch me. Unless you are scum. That is.

[origamiscienceguy]

The townie who was lynched would probably vengekill the guy who I thought was scum because I was "pretending to be on their side" according to your theory, then they would listen. So why wuldn't I just pressure him to vengekill another townie and win the game outright? It ends the day earlier. Your theory makes no sense, and I don't see why you continue trying to find a reason to lynch me. Unless you are scum. That is.

[Reverie]

It's really a matter of risk vs reward—you could have tried to influence the vengekill, putting yourself out there dangerously to end it quickly, or you would have been patient and played it safe. Your conservative play and general waffling supports the latter if you were expecting to let end-of-D1 facts speak for you. You know...sitting back, waiting for the rest of us to bicker over which among us will get hanged next. That last bit is what really set my scumdar going.

[TempAcc]

_{Boo I am the bes goast}

[origamiscienceguy]

It's no risk reward! It is the same reward, but what you are suggesting is that I added the risk for some reason.

You think that I made a plan with roo that he would start a lynch on a random townie, while I started a weaker case of him. Then, when random townie was lynched, he vengekilled roo because I had a case on him.

Why the hell wouldn't I just push a weaker lynch on another townie, so that townie vengekills townie?? Where is the risk reward?

[Reverie]

I'm drunk atm, so I'll refrain from playing properly until tomorrow, but by 'risk' I mean putting yourself out there/association with roo. The way I see it, you've been playing it safe up until now in anything not concerning roo. Just lately, that includes your weak vote on me (you could try to expound on that, but you chose not to so far) and trying to be backseat arbiter.


Anyways, until tomorrow. Please post, Elephant Parade.

[origamiscienceguy]

I'm voting you because what you're saying is, quite frankly, absurd. Why "play it safe" by getting roo vengekilled when I could "win" by getting a townie vengekilled?

[Reverie]

Oh, are you now? You voted me before I said anything at all. You clearly didn't respond to my theory when I shared it. Were you expecting Elephant Parade to be suspicious of me and were hoping to piggyback on his argument? Also, why you'd decide to build an alibi as opposed to trying to plant a vengekill suggestion was made clear already. It was easier. Probably more convoluted, yes, but this way didn't require you to stick your neck out. Unless you have some explanation for why you entered D2 so cocksure, because you've just been tiptoeing around that bit.

[Elephant Parade]

I'm drunk atm, so I'll refrain from playing properly until tomorrow, but by 'risk' I mean putting yourself out there/association with roo. The way I see it, you've been playing it safe up until now in anything not concerning roo. Just lately, that includes your weak vote on me (you could try to expound on that, but you chose not to so far) and trying to be backseat arbiter.


Anyways, until tomorrow. Please post, Elephant Parade.

I get home at this time four days a week. I'm not going to skip school for Mafia

[Jack A T]

<snip>

TempAcc: Please do not post direct commentary on the game while dead.  Please also edit that out.

[Elephant Parade]

I generally don't do long posts, I generally do short posts commenting about what I think about developments, or theorysing and responding to people's questions. My attacks on people, instead of being long posts are always put in several posts, with me adding on to them as time goes on.

You didn't do much theorizing or thinking, though. You talked to roo and gave single-line replies to questions directed at you. You didn't attack anyone other than roo, or discuss—I don't think any of your one-line replies could be counted as "discussion", though it's possible I overlooked one—anything not related to roo. Again, this went on for six days.

I was nearly certain that tempacc was town throughout the whole day, and after a point, none of you ever changed anything (your votes generally stayed on Temp acc) which in turn meant I didn't change anything.

Why would we change anything? TempAcc had stopped defending himself entirely, and we had no real reason to believe he wasn't scum. It was on you to change things.

...Which, to be fair, you tried to do—albeit with an argument that only worked if you were assumed to be town, which is pretty useless for everyone else.

If I was scum, this conveluted plan makes no sense. I would get the godfather to push a lynch on a town member, then try to get my godfather vengekilled?? It makes infinately more sense to put pressure on another townie so that THEY can get vengekilled which means day one win. Why extend the game longer than it needs to be? Makes no sense.

(Note: This conversation is a bit confusing, so I may have misunderstood it. What I think Reverie is accusing OSG of is engineering roo's vengekill to gain towncred.)

You had been attacking roo the entire game, so it would make sense for you to continue to do so. If, on the other hand, you had suddenly pushed for the lynch of someone entirely different, it might have stood out as suspicious. Furthermore, pushing for the lynch of the godfather would give you a ton of towncred D2, which would be pretty useful. Not as useful as a flat-out win, obviously, but useful.

FYI, I'm not sure I agree with this argument; though it seems possible, it is pretty convoluted. I'm going to think on it.

[Reverie]

I slept on this, and I must say, I might be wrong. The biggest vulnerability in my argument is that roo bringing the game to impending hammer simply to set up the bus for OSG is very dangerous, since any bandwagon on roo stemming from that would have lost you guys the game.

However, not pressing your attack on roo after you voted him and that skirmish settled could be seen as not pressing your luck. You sat on your hands, and at the beginning of D2, circumstances favoured you sitting on your hands some more. Like I said, it's convenient.

Concerning the bigger picture though, I don't know. I feel like I'm missing something.

[Jack A T]

Everyone has been prodded.

[Reverie]

I guess it's obvious that I'm pretty burned out on this :/

Between the two of you, I think OSG is our mafioso. Some contortion on D1 brought him to where he was here on D2, expecting us to sort this out between ourselves while giving him license to coast. Elephant Parade, meanwhile, has played a solid game (other than being hammerer for the mislynch and being strangely contrary to his own argument a few times). I'm going to lock this in. I expect OSG will lock in his vote on me and it's really up to Elephant Parade at this point to make his decision certain, at which point we can switch to red votes and finally end this game.