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Author Topic: Foundations of Government (IC)  (Read 11439 times)

DontBanTheMan

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Foundations of Government (IC)
« on: January 14, 2016, 11:13:51 pm »

OOC Thread. Any OOC conversation, questions, and applications should go there.

The revolution is over. You chosen few have led the rebels to victory over the oppressive regime and freed your beloved country. A code, written during the rebellion, is presented as the basis of your government - however, it's limited in use and should quickly be expanded and revised. To prevent a dictatorship similar to the previous government, you've decided as one to separate the government into Ministries, with each of you acting as ministers of equal power. This system can certainly be revised, but should serve as a solid example for future generations to follow.

The country looks to you to lead it to glory. Do not disappoint the masses.


Spoiler: Code of Government (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: Stats (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: Turns (click to show/hide)

The list of proposals [up to Turn 6], courtesy of Beneviento, can be found here.
« Last Edit: February 28, 2016, 06:29:11 am by DontBanTheMan »
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mcclay

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Re: Foundations of Government (IC)
« Reply #1 on: January 14, 2016, 11:25:43 pm »

Comrades!
Friends!

We won!

Now, our task is to lead glorious Apland into the future.

The easiest way to do that is by raising value of Apland dollar to challenge dirty pig dog American dollar. However there are currently very little Apland dollars in distribution.
Therefore, as Minsiter of Security, I will guard Apland's economic security and being small printing runs of Apland dollar so that our people may experience the joys of buying.

Begin limited printing of the Apland dollar to raise its value.
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Nunzillor

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Re: Foundations of Government (IC)
« Reply #2 on: January 14, 2016, 11:27:24 pm »

Ministry of Truth

What is the current level of industrialization in the country?
Approximately how much capital does the government have access to?  And what's its current level of spending and income?
What is the approximate level of education in the country?  Are most citizens literate?
How is information primarily consumed?  Newspapers, TV, books, etc.?
What is international opinion regarding the revolution?

Acquire fairly large offices in the previous government's HQ.
Administer a loyalty test to 500 of the previous government's staff.  The individuals with the top 10% loyalty ratings will be accepted as ministers (minimum 50).  The other 100 employees will be selected from the army after a similar screening.  They will receive $4 per day in perpetuity until fired or executed for disloyalty.
Seize all assets in and around the government HQ.  Sell off all art, jewelry, and all other not immediately useful items.  If there's a printing press, keep it.


Proposal: loyalty to the previous government is now illegal.  Confirmed cases of treason will be punished with imprisonment or death depending on the severity of the crime.
[/s]


The Ministry of Truth will have further actions when more information on the state of Alpland is available.  Remember, a good citizen is a loyal citizen.  And most importantly, don't forget that the revolution is now over.

Fellow ministers, we must seize the state apparatus from the previous government and keep it running before anarchy takes hold across the land.  We will need sources of income, a police force, and an army in short order.

STATUS: Ready.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2016, 03:52:49 pm by Nunzillor »
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DontBanTheMan

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Re: Foundations of Government (IC)
« Reply #3 on: January 14, 2016, 11:31:25 pm »

((Is it assumed that we have facilities and staff?))
(( You have no facilities and staff. You have just executed the King. It is assumed that some things could easily be acquired (move into old gov. center, hire their previous staff, etc.) ))

(( You also have no current wealth. All of the wealth was spent on the war. You could probably take actions to acquire that, too, though (selling old King's belongings). ))
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Dustan Hache

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Re: Foundations of Government (IC)
« Reply #4 on: January 14, 2016, 11:53:00 pm »

first action: attempt to get a general grasp of how many people are somewhat knowledgeable about medicine or first aid.
Second action: Establish a medical services fund, which can go into debt.
Third action: Claim whatever we have that passes for government hospitals. Public owned clinics will remain untouched.


proposal:All employees of the ministries of health, security, defense, and engineering must have basic first-aid training by turn 6, and any employees thereafter must go through training to join. An untrained employee will result in a fine to the ministry responcible for the untrained employee, and the money from the fine will be used to advance medical technology.

Despite our victory against the king, we suffered heavy casualties. Under the previous system, there were few doctors and surgeons available, meaning all the wounded were basically doomed. I intend to change this, and in doing so make our nation safer. The more of our fellow countrymen that can care for each other, the less likely that death or crippling will be a result of a wound, regardless of cause.

READY

I oppose the treason proposal. We are all human, and regardless of previous loyalties, our country is in shambles. Doing a hunt for traitors would only further destabilize the situation, and possibly result in a second civil war.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2016, 02:58:15 pm by Dustan Hache »
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hector13

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Re: Foundations of Government (IC)
« Reply #5 on: January 14, 2016, 11:58:37 pm »

Begin limited printing of the Apland dollar to raise its value.

((I would like to point out that printing more money would have the opposite effect :P but this isn't an economic simulator so... never mind))

Ministry of Criminality

Set up a new police force. Recruit 1,000 police officers from the rebel army, prioritising those that served longest.

Set up a new intelligence service. Recruit 100 intelligence officers from the rebel army, prioritising those that served the longest in commando units

Seize any warehouses from entities that were loyal to the previous regime. Sell all the goods as exports, setting up a fund to pay for the police and intelligence services with the proceeds. Refurbish the warehouses to serve as prisons.

Have the intelligence service quietly sweep the populace for dissidents and those loyal to the previous regime. Keep these people on a watch list for the time being.

We must return the homeland to a peaceful state. We must find those that are still loyal to the king and... convince them that we are better for the people!
« Last Edit: January 15, 2016, 12:00:08 am by hector13 »
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O.Wilde

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Re: Foundations of Government (IC)
« Reply #6 on: January 15, 2016, 12:35:07 am »

"Ladies and gentlemen, it is the dawning of a new age. The next years are going to be hard, and we are going to face many setbacks. As such, I propose we immediately begin gathering resources for the inevitable roadblocks we encounter. As you know, I am the Minister of Agriculture, and in order to keep our heads above water, we need food.

Therefore, I propose that the Agricultural Resource Group be created, and I volunteer to lead the group. The way it will work is this: All bills or proposals effecting the food or water supply must go through the ARG, which will have the power to approve or deny proposals passed through it, as well as create it's own ARG proposals. These ARG proposals are created by the group as a whole, not any individual, and must be designed to effect or improve the agricultural state of the country.

The structure of the ARG is proposed to be the following: Four members, one member designated as the Group Leader. Each member will have 1 vote in group matters. The status of Group Leader gives that member an additional say in group matters. Voting is done by simple majority, and is required to veto a proposal or create a new ARG proposal. In the event of a tie, the group leader decides the outcome. To prevent abuse, the group leader position will rotate, as will the member positions. Thank you for your patience, and glory to our new-found country!"
Spoiler: No Longer Proposed (click to show/hide)
"Dustan Hache, mcclay, hector13, I hope I can count on your support in this. It should be obvious as to why I chose you. Agriculture is a huge issue for health for the obvious reasons, and as starvation and famine attack many of our neighboring countries we can see how agriculture is a security and criminal issue as well.

As for the rest of you, in order for this country to survive we need to have a strong base of agriculture to keep our citizens fed. The ARG will help us to create the basis for life we need to survive. Fellow Ministers, please support me on this proposal, and I am sure that our newly created country will survive. We will not starve!"
« Last Edit: January 15, 2016, 02:39:23 pm by O.Wilde »
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Beneviento

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Re: Foundations of Government (IC)
« Reply #7 on: January 15, 2016, 01:19:38 am »

Ministry of Transportation

The new Transportation Minister gets out of his car in front of the unimpressive building that was the headquarters of the Royal Apland Infrastructure Bureau. Even under the King, the roads and railroads had been disgustingly underfunded, and the war had only torn the fragile veins of the country apart even further. It would be a tall order to fix them, but the Ministry of Transportation was the entity to do it. The Minister needed employees, and sources of cash and labor. Employees wouldn't be a problem, as political reliability was not as important for Transportation workers as it would be for employees of the Security or Criminality Ministries. Even Royalists would want to get the country back on its feet. To find cash, the Minister had a scheme in mind to levy taxes on the railroads. Finally, to find labor to repair damaged transport networks and construct new infrastructure, the Minister had a proposal for the rest of the Government.

Actions:
Hire 50 Infrastructure Scouts, paid $40 each monthly, to assess the situation of the national transport network. Send them out to recon the connections of the capital with other major cities, as well as the general quality of the transport network.
Hire 100 Transport Constables, paid $2.5 each daily, to enforce Ministry ordinances within the capital.
Enact new licencing ordinances to apply to railroad lines and private automobiles in the capital. Private automobiles must pass inspection and receive registration (costing $10 in fees paid to the Transportation Ministry). Locomotives must be inspected and registered as well (costing $100 per locomotive registered), along with railroad cars (registration costs $20).


Proposal:
Allow all Ministries to collect taxes in the form of labor in service of a Ministry. e.g. the Engineering Ministry could waive taxes in return for work done on construction projects, and Transportation could do the same for infrastructure-building work.

proposal:All employees of the ministries of health, security, defense, and engineering must have basic first-aid training by turn 6, and any employees thereafter must go through training to join. An untrained employee will result in a fine to the ministry responcible for the untrained employee, and the money from the fine will be used to advance medical technology.
The Transportation Minister's eyebrows go up as his eyes scan the proposal on his desk. This seemed to him an overreach by the Ministry of Health, a grab for power even. If the mentioned ministries wanted to train their employees, that was their responsibility. He twirled his fountain pen around his hand, and wrote "opposed" at the bottom of the proposal. He would abstain from voting on the other proposals for now.

EDIT: included all Ministries in my proposal.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2016, 04:07:12 am by Beneviento »
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mcclay

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Re: Foundations of Government (IC)
« Reply #8 on: January 15, 2016, 01:23:07 am »

OPPOSE treason proposal
-Didn't we just have a revolution to remove laws like this? Do not be a counter-revlountary friend.

SUPPORT ARG
-Fine by me

SUPPORT FIRST AID TRAINING

SUPPORT TAX COLLECTING

((I'm pretty sure having no money is worse than having money. I think the gods of inflation will forgive us for printing some dollars))
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flazeo25

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Re: Foundations of Government (IC)
« Reply #9 on: January 15, 2016, 01:32:56 am »

"My fellow Ministers, today is a good day after so many years we have overthrown the bloody tyrant of king and established a new government. But this has come at a cost, we have no military to defend our homeland, no police to protect our citizens, our agriculture is set back years and our health and infrastructure has all but fallen apart. I have come today as Minister of Advanced Defence to get to main issue at hand which is simple. We are broke!, so I ask you here to consider my proposal for us to gather tax revenue for us to all to become functioning government. Outlined in the proposal is three taxes which as listed are for Property, Income and VAT, which will generate the revenue for the government and to be distributed to each ministry as budget."

Proposal: Create a new branch of the Code of Government as follows:


Seize any former military bases/ports/airfields, labs and factories of previous regime as it shall be incorporated into Ministry of Advanced Defence.
Sell all goods in each building and begin setting up funds to pay for military and research services with proceeds.

Set up five subdivision to be managed by Ministry of Defence and hire 25 staff to manage the Ministry.
Set up Joints chiefs and hire top experts of former soldiers loyal to previous king and from revolution, they oversee each subdivision and answer to Minister.
Found the basic for the Defence Force subdivision, which will act as this country ground force and hire 150 former soldiers. They will be stationed in barracks around the country which were seized.
Found the basic for the Navy subdivision, which will run the ports and act as the country naval force. Recruit 50 boat engineers and 50 former marines.
Found the basic for the Aircorps subdivison, which will run airbases and act as the country air force. Recruit 50 aviation engineers and 30 pilots.
Found the basic for the Advance Research subdivison, which will run the siezed labs and will be deal with military projects. Hire 30 scientists.
Found the basic for the Development subdivison, which will used siezed factories to produce arms and tech for military. Hire 50 labours.

I support the ARG proposal as Agriculture makes up the backbone of any good country and having steady flow of crops is much needed.
I support the taxation proposal as each department should be capable of taxing.
I Abstain the Medical proposal has many flaws in it and would it not be suited for your ministry to train staff in medical guidelines..
« Last Edit: January 15, 2016, 02:54:54 am by flazeo25 »
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hector13

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Re: Foundations of Government (IC)
« Reply #10 on: January 15, 2016, 02:27:47 am »

proposal:All employees of the ministries of health, security, defense, and engineering must have basic first-aid training by turn 6, and any employees thereafter must go through training to join. An untrained employee will result in a fine to the ministry responcible for the untrained employee, and the money from the fine will be used to advance medical technology.

I take it your ministry will be providing the funds for this training? Considering you could argue my ministry is at least partially responsible for security and defense, I would be most displeased to find you expect my ministry to pay for your proposal. Particularly when you also consider that most the interactions my people will have will be with the criminal element; do you expect my officers to perform first aid on violent criminals?

I would urge a different proposal: Create a health service, and attach a corp of nurses and doctors to all ministries. These nurses and doctors will be trained and paid for by the Ministry of Health.

Proposal: loyalty to the previous government is now illegal.  Confirmed cases of treason will be punished with imprisonment or death depending on the severity of the crime.

Treason is a heinous crime, but remaining loyal to the previous regime is not a crime. We must keep tabs on these people, yes, but to say they should be killed because of their love for the king? Preposterous!

No, a much better idea would be to keep tabs on them, surreptitiously, to make sure any rebellious elements do not act on their feelings. If they do, we can act on them later, perhaps by seizing all their assets for the good of the government, hm?

ARG

0. Definitions: Hereby, when referring to ARG the following terms are defined as follows:  'poll': A list of options presented to the ARG members, who can choose whichever option they prefer by typing the following: ARG Vote: (Insert decision here). When a member does this, they use 1 vote.
1. Four members are to be allowed in the ARG at once. Each member has one vote. One member is to be rotated every six (6) turns based on a poll to decide who will be leaving, however the option is available each poll to keep all current members. Replacement members are decided thru a poll of current members, and if selected can accept or deny the invitation.
2. One group leader is to be designated in the ARG, they hold two (2) supplemental votes, and the power to decided in case of a tie in a poll. The group leader is to be rotated every three (3) turns unless a poll is passed to keep the current leader for another three (3) turn term.
3. The group can veto a proposal by any minister, if it is found by the group through a poll that that proposal would adversely effect the agricultural state of the country.
4. The group can create one (1) special proposal per turn, and this proposal must effect the state of agriculture in the country. This proposal can only be created through consensus during a poll within the group.
5. In order to maintain agricultural integrity, this group is to be separate and unaffected by proposals that do not explicitly effect the group.
6. The first four (4) members of the group are to be as follows: O.Wilde (Minister of Agriculture), hector13 (Minister of Criminality), Dustan Hache (Minister of Health), mcclay (Minister of Security). In addition, the first Group Leader is to be O.Wilde (Minister of Agriculture)

I have a few queries and quandaries regarding your proposal.

1. I think a five member committee would work better to avoid ties, particularly if the members of the board are not allowed to abstain.
2. The group leader should not be given more power than the other members. One vote for each member is more than enough.
3. No veto power, unless the "adverse effects to agriculture" are specified. It is too broad as written.
4. What kind of things did you have in mind here? What would make the proposal "special"?
5. Again, what do you mean here? That we are not allowed to vote on things outside the board?
6. As I mentioned in point 1, I believe it would be better for there to be five members, and those initial five members should also vote their leader from among themselves.

Proposal:
Allow the Engineering, Agriculture, Transportation, and Advanced Defense Ministries to collect taxes in the form of service to the mentioned Ministries. e.g. the Engineering Ministry could waive taxes in return for work done on construction projects, and Transportation could do the same for infrastructure-building work.

What makes these particular ministries so special? Regardless, this is a foolish idea. The money paid to any entity performing a service for any particular ministry will be subect to tax anyway, why take away a possible revenue stream for us when we so badly need money?

Proposal: Create a new branch of the Code of Government as follows:

Taxes Consolidation Act - Citizens of Apland are subject to certain exceptions and exemptions, which may be chargeable on all income arising in state to individuals, corporative bodies and partnerships following these acts.

Property Act:
(1)All land subject to private property are excepted to pay yearly tax sum to government, Public owned land in hands of government are not subjected to this act.
(2)Organizations that are also excused from this act are property owned by various Religions in Apland and organization deemed to be of charity status.
(3)Low bands of tax is set at 5% yearly for low income households, Middle band of tax set at 10% for corporative held land and upper band set at 12.5% for upper income households.

VAT Act:
(1)All goods being sold in Apland are subjected to commission of tax which all citizens are excepted to pay when goods are bought or sold.
(2)Value added tax is set at 10% on goods.

Income Act:
(1)All citizens when either under private or public employment are to excepted to pay income tax which will be deducted from pay by employer and collected by government.
(2)Salaries set in the lower band are to pay out weekly 10% in income tax, middle band are to be required to pay weekly 15% in income tax and in upper band are excepted to pay out weekly in 20% in income tax.
(3)Tax bands for income tax are set out by amount of money employee earns weekly, low pay employees fall into first band while middle income employees fall into second band and upper income employees fall into last band.

These acts set out government role in ensuring taxation to provide to for services to carried out, tax collected is to be distributed between each ministry to help pay for ministries.

((I assume you mean "expected" rather than "excepted". I don't like correcting people too much in regards to spelling on the internet - you could be dyslexic for all I know - but in this instance it's to avoid (my) confusion. "Expected" means "an action that should be performed" and "excepted" means "this doesn't have to happen".))

Regarding the Property Act: religions should not be exempt from this. Churches may pay a discounted rate, but not be exempt. Corporate/Upper Bands of tax should be set at 15%

How is the tax to be distributed among ministries? An equal split?
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Nunzillor

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Re: Foundations of Government (IC)
« Reply #11 on: January 15, 2016, 02:35:46 am »

Ministry of Truth

The ministry rescinds its rather unpopular proposal.  It instead advises that all government employees be on the lookout for pig-dog loyalists, who studies show are 47% more likely to commit heinous crimes.  Without vigilance, the return of the crown is not only possible, it is a certainty.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2016, 02:43:29 am by Nunzillor »
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flazeo25

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Re: Foundations of Government (IC)
« Reply #12 on: January 15, 2016, 02:46:18 am »

Ministry of Advanced Defence:

"Dear Minister of Criminality, the proposed tax act would be distributed equal between all departments, unless if you like we could set up discussion with Minister of Security to put his department in charge of budget management and collecting of tax as it seems his department is most suitable for it and have your department provide security and prosecute offends who go against the law.

As advised we have shuffled the proposal to only offer discount to religious organizations and have raised corporation band from 10% to 15%"

"Dear Minister of Truth, on behalf of Ministry of Advanced defence I would like to request a campaign to improve national spirits to help bolster support for our new government and increase productivity."
« Last Edit: January 15, 2016, 02:50:35 am by flazeo25 »
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Nunzillor

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Re: Foundations of Government (IC)
« Reply #13 on: January 15, 2016, 02:56:15 am »

Ministry of Truth

Dearest Minister of Advanced Defense, after our initial inquiries into the state of the country, in particular its consumption of media, the Ministry will be pleased to accommodate your request.  Did you know that revolutionaries are, on average, 73% less degenerate than their loyalist brethren?
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flazeo25

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Re: Foundations of Government (IC)
« Reply #14 on: January 15, 2016, 03:08:59 am »

Ministry of Advanced Defence:

"Dear Minister of Truth, we are glad that you can accommodate our request, the information about revolution and loyalist intrigue us as well and we look forward to future cooperation between our two departments and would like to ask would you be intreasted in joint budget discussion for sorting out budgets for each department.."

"Dear Minister of Security I would like to request your thoughts on on my department proposal and would be interested in joint discussion between ministers to discuss if we can make a budget for each department."

"Dear Minister of Health about your recent proposal we are inquiring as to why your department would not create specialized medical teams to train staff in each department as we see it as more reasonable solution."

"Dear Ministers of Agriculture and Transport we like to request joint discussion between fellow ministers to set out budgets for each department which we'll earn through general taxation."
« Last Edit: January 15, 2016, 03:12:00 am by flazeo25 »
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