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[Wolfhunter107]

You mean to say that the majority of Muslims believe all of those things?

Yes, a majority of Muslims hold one or more of those beliefs. There are polls of Muslims in Europe that show it. Am typing on phone so I can't get the data right this moment.

Those polls in Europe would only poll those IN Europe, you'd have to get polls of Muslims from MANY different countries to get a real picture of it.

Also, this needs to be bulldozed into the religion thread.

Since we're talking about Muslims in Europe, I'm not really sure how relevant those of Muslims outside Europe would be, unless they're from a country that has a lot of people going to europe.

[smjjames]

You mean to say that the majority of Muslims believe all of those things?

Yes, a majority of Muslims hold one or more of those beliefs. There are polls of Muslims in Europe that show it. Am typing on phone so I can't get the data right this moment.

Those polls in Europe would only poll those IN Europe, you'd have to get polls of Muslims from MANY different countries to get a real picture of it.

Also, this needs to be bulldozed into the religion thread.

Since we're talking about Muslims in Europe, I'm not really sure how relevant those of Muslims outside Europe would be, unless they're from a country that has a lot of people going to europe.

All I'm saying is that a poll of Muslims in Europe only gives opinions of those in Europe. If you want a whole picture, you should poll from all over the world. And I mean in addition to the Middle East, Muslims don't ONLY live in the Middle Eeast ya know.

Take it this way, if you do a poll of Christians in Europe, does that make it representative of ALL Christians?

[Pwnzerfaust]

You mean to say that the majority of Muslims believe all of those things?

Yes, a majority of Muslims hold one or more of those beliefs. There are polls of Muslims in Europe that show it. Am typing on phone so I can't get the data right this moment.

Those polls in Europe would only poll those IN Europe, you'd have to get polls of Muslims from MANY different countries to get a real picture of it.

Also, this needs to be bulldozed into the religion thread.

Since we're talking about Muslims in Europe, I'm not really sure how relevant those of Muslims outside Europe would be, unless they're from a country that has a lot of people going to europe.

All I'm saying is that a poll of Muslims in Europe only gives opinions of those in Europe. If you want a whole picture, you should poll from all over the world. And I mean in addition to the Middle East, Muslims don't ONLY live in the Middle Eeast ya know.

Take it this way, if you do a poll of Christians in Europe, does that make it representative of ALL Christians?

It makes it representative of all Christians relevant to a discussion about Europe.

Oh, and here's a source for my earlier claim about fundamentalist beliefs being a majority among Muslims in Europe: link

[Sergarr]

It makes it representative of all Christians relevant to a discussion about Europe.

Oh, and here's a source for my earlier claim about fundamentalist beliefs being a majority among Muslims in Europe: link

And why is that a problem, anyway? If they start to try and overthrow the European laws in favor of Sharia, wouldn't it be very easy to deal with them until they stop?

[Sheb]

Oh, and here's a source for my earlier claim about fundamentalist beliefs being a majority among Muslims in Europe: link

That poll doesn't talk about those beliefs at all (at least not on the first few pages).

Anyway, yay! Wilders in the wilderness, sanity in the government.

[Erkki]

Didnt social democrats and the other government party together still lose like half of their seats?

I mean, the "anti-populist victory" here is that Wilders' didnt win as much as was feared, ainnit?

[Sheb]

Didnt social democrats and the other government party together still lose like half of their seats?

I mean, the "anti-populist victory" here is that Wilders' didnt win as much as was feared, ainnit?

After 2016, we'll take what we can.

[martinuzz]

Elections sucked balls. Samo old neocon party that has been destroying our country for 30 years can still call dibs on government formation. Here's to another 4 years of fuck the less fortunate.

[Loud Whispers]

It makes it representative of all Christians relevant to a discussion about Europe.

Oh, and here's a source for my earlier claim about fundamentalist beliefs being a majority among Muslims in Europe: link

And why is that a problem, anyway? If they start to try and overthrow the European laws in favor of Sharia, wouldn't it be very easy to deal with them until they stop?

Short answer, no it wouldn't

When millions of people reject your rule of law then shit hits the fan very quickly, becoming somewhat difficult to deal with

Judaism, Christianity, Islam... same god, mostly the same tradition. Same religion really.
Whatever improbable things one believes in (and I'm including secular ones) doesn't make one civilised or barbaric. Among other things, how one deals with deeply held beliefs and those who disagree does.

Not the same God, not the same traditions, not the same religion

The differences in doctrine and belief are pretty fundamental

Elections sucked balls. Samo old neocon party that has been destroying our country for 30 years can still call dibs on government formation. Here's to another 4 years of fuck the less fortunate.

I feel you, looking at the Netherlands you guys don't have many good choices left to make

[Sheb]

Didnt social democrats and the other government party together still lose like half of their seats?

I mean, the "anti-populist victory" here is that Wilders' didnt win as much as was feared, ainnit?

Indeed. It's not quite the result I was hoping for, but with the current PM losing a bunch of seats and Wilders gaining five to edge into second place (just beating CDA and D66 according to the last result I saw), it's not terrible either. I'm surprised that Sheb would term the largest opposition party 'in the wilderness', but hey, whatever works for you.

Elections sucked balls. Samo old neocon party that has been destroying our country for 30 years can still call dibs on government formation. Here's to another 4 years of fuck the less fortunate.

I suppose that's one of the of the problems with having so many parties as opposed to a FPTP system or one more like the French one. It's hard to organize opposition to a 'Not calamitous but kinda shitty' ruling party. There are probably a whole bunch of people who didn't want Rutte to be PM anymore, but they split themselves between Geert, GL, D66, etc.

Not that I'm saying FPTP is a better system.

Well, yeah, not in the wilderness. But when you brace for the worse, pretty bad feels actually good. As for the Dutch, well, the issue is that Wilders has made himself toxic enough that no one wants to work with him, so the opposition is split between the PVV and the rest. The others could try a coalition. Having some sort of minimum share to get into parliament would help make coalitions easier though.

[TempAcc]

Judaism, Christianity, Islam... same god, mostly the same tradition. Same religion really.
Whatever improbable things one believes in (and I'm including secular ones) doesn't make one civilised or barbaric. Among other things, how one deals with deeply held beliefs and those who disagree does.

Sorry bruva, doesn't work that way. There's a huge ideological, historical and cultural abyss between the three, and a reductionistic and generalizing view of it doesn't get you anywhere, apart from being kinda just a lazy and feeble attempt at avoiding dealing with the issues at hand.

Its kinda like saying 3 different guys that happen to come from the same general region of the world are completely identical just because they came from the same general region.

Anyways, looks like there's no paradigm change for the nether regions just yet. Sad, but all things considered, it could've been worse?

[Sheb]

Depends wether you think saying mean stuff about long-dead historical figure is the one quality a leader need or not.

[Pwnzerfaust]

Oh, and here's a source for my earlier claim about fundamentalist beliefs being a majority among Muslims in Europe: link

That poll doesn't talk about those beliefs at all (at least not on the first few pages).

Not those specific ones, but I never claimed my list was exhaustive. Also did you miss the PDF article embedded in the page?

[Lord_lemonpie]

Judaism, Christianity, Islam... same god, mostly the same tradition. Same religion really.
Whatever improbable things one believes in (and I'm including secular ones) doesn't make one civilised or barbaric. Among other things, how one deals with deeply held beliefs and those who disagree does.

I feel like you're completely out of touch with reality. Regards, someone who's harassed by homophobic muslims on a nigh daily basis.

You mean to say that the majority of Muslims believe all of those things?

Yes, a majority of Muslims hold one or more of those beliefs. There are polls of Muslims in Europe that show it. Am typing on phone so I can't get the data right this moment.

Those polls in Europe would only poll those IN Europe, you'd have to get polls of Muslims from MANY different countries to get a real picture of it.

Also, this needs to be bulldozed into the religion thread.

I don't think muslims outside of Europe are less fundamentalist than those within.

[TempAcc]

There's no religion thread. Unless you mean the railgun thread, the one in which we don't actualy discuss religion in, its actualy just a covert discussion on railguns so nobody can steal our data.