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[martinuzz]

I agree with you earlier that maybe the guy shouting should have been charged, or probably will from what I know of German laws. I think. So, yeah, I suppose this is looking more like one of those school shooting type things where it's a bullied kid.

Not saying that the shouter should be charged, can't sue a layman for not being professional . Don't think shouting is a crime in itself in Germany.
He could have been sued for racism though, for the rascist terms he used, were it not that the person who he used racist slang against is no longer present amongst the living to be able to press charges.

I was just saying that I think engaging in an obscene shouting contest was not the smartest thing to do in my opinion, and possibly escalated the situation further.

[DJ]

IDK, it doesn't really stack up. Bullied kids go and shoot up their school, or wherever the people who bullied them tend to be, they don't go and shoot up random people at a random location.

[martinuzz]

or wherever the people who bullied them tend to be

McDonalds popular place for school kids. Plus some schools in Germany got metal detectors after the Baden-Württemberg shooting in 2009. Dunno about his particular school though.
Besides, it's hard to find kids in school during school summer vacation. At least I think it's still vacation over there in Germany, German forumites please correct me if I am wrong.

[martinuzz]

Dutch school teachers are developing new courses for history and civics classes during the currently ongoing summer holiday, in response to the Turkey coup aftermath.
Kids will be asked to discuss questions like "can a country ruled by a single person still be a democracy", and "is a president allowed to singlehandedly 'save democracy' if that means ignoring half of your population (that does not agree with you), accusing them of treason, and systematically censor them, while sending the other half into the streets to cheer for you?".
Lol at the headline the newspaper gave it. "Better start getting used to what you learn in school is not the same as what you're told at home"


People are startled and upset at the influence Erdogan exerts on the Turks living in the Netherlands (there's four hundred thousand Turks on a population of 17 million), and the fanatic response of Erdogan followers. Gulen followers have become the victim of many threats. Hell, in my own block 2 cars were burned down overnight because of it.
A Turkish woman interviewed by the newspaper said that Dutch pro-Erdogan Turks have been putting names and private telephone numbers online from those they know as Gulen supporters. She has been getting phonecalls calling her a traitor and a terrorist, and asking her where she is right now. Her WhatsApp is filled with obscenities like 'cancer whore'.
She says "it's all about the art of forming a community now. We really need to start a dialogue with those who threaten us and call us names."

People here still remember Dutch guys ratting on Dutch resistance and Dutch jews. Ratting on your fellow countrymen is still seen by many as synonimous with fascism. So I'm not surprised that teachers are taking action like this.

tl:dr Erdogan is turning Dutch school teachers into Gulen supporters

[smjjames]

Or more like turning Dutch school teachers into supporters of actual democracy, not democracy-in-name-only.

[Loud Whispers]

EDIT: in other news, police reports that the Munich shooter had no ties with IS or terrorism. He was, however, obsessed with US highschool shootings (police found a book on those in his room), and had made statements online glorifying a school shooting in Germany as well.

Well damn. I blame American media for glorifying the shooters all the bloody time.

I agree with OW on this one, bullying = mass shooting revenge was manufactured by the media, coincidentally the media making mass shooting sexy didn't help. For example in the Columbine massacre, Harris was more often bullying other people, was a complete psychopath and Klebold was a manic depressive. Already in the first shooting both shooters had different motives

Dutch school teachers are developing new courses for history and civics classes during the currently ongoing summer holiday, in response to the Turkey coup aftermath.

Academia = not even once

Kids will be asked to discuss questions like "can a country ruled by a single person still be a democracy", and "is a president allowed to singlehandedly 'save democracy' if that means ignoring half of your population (that does not agree with you), accusing them of treason, and systematically censor them, while sending the other half into the streets to cheer for you?".
Lol at the headline the newspaper gave it. "Better start getting used to what you learn in school is not the same as what you're told at home"

Top lel that is a good headline
Also for the sake of contrarianism, countries ruled by one man can still be democracies for as long as they stick to their people's mandate. It's a dangerous line to walk, one defined by success more often than method

People are startled and upset at the influence Erdogan exerts on the Turks living in the Netherlands (there's four hundred thousand Turks on a population of 17 million), and the fanatic response of Erdogan followers. Gulen followers have become the victim of many threats. Hell, in my own block 2 cars were burned down overnight because of it.
A Turkish woman interviewed by the newspaper said that Dutch pro-Erdogan Turks have been putting names and private telephone numbers online from those they know as Gulen supporters. She has been getting phonecalls calling her a traitor and a terrorist, and asking her where she is right now. Her WhatsApp is filled with obscenities like 'cancer whore'.
She says "it's all about the art of forming a community now. We really need to start a dialogue with those who threaten us and call us names."
People here still remember Dutch guys ratting on Dutch resistance and Dutch jews. Ratting on your fellow countrymen is still seen by many as synonimous with fascism. So I'm not surprised that teachers are taking action like this.
tl:dr Erdogan is turning Dutch school teachers into Gulen supporters

Those aren't Turks, those are Dutch of Turkish descent

Or more like turning Dutch school teachers into supporters of actual democracy, not democracy-in-name-only.

[laughing RAF pilots]

[martinuzz]

Those aren't Turks, those are Dutch of Turkish descent

Yes and no. Children born of Turkish parents in the Netherlands get double nationality. One from the Netherlands, one from Turkey. They cannot get rid of the latter, because Turkish law does not recognize voluntary abandonment of nationality.

[Antioch]

Those aren't Turks, those are Dutch of Turkish descent

Yes and no. Children born of Turkish parents in the Netherlands get double nationality. One from the Netherlands, one from Turkey. They cannot get rid of the latter, because Turkish law does not recognize voluntary abandonment of nationality.

IIRC you can give up your Turkish nationality, its Morocco that doesn't allow it.

[martinuzz]

Those aren't Turks, those are Dutch of Turkish descent

Yes and no. Children born of Turkish parents in the Netherlands get double nationality. One from the Netherlands, one from Turkey. They cannot get rid of the latter, because Turkish law does not recognize voluntary abandonment of nationality.

IIRC you can give up your Turkish nationality, its Morocco that doesn't allow it.

Looks like youre right. It's still up to the authorities though if they actually allow your request for denaturalization.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turkish_nationality_law

[Loud Whispers]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Authorities are now blaming this rampage on the killer having played video games (what), being linked with Anders Breivik (not joking), Columbine (hmm), depression (possible). Prosecutors treating it as an apolitical rampage, cos there was no objective besides murder
Tune in next time for next week's happenings
Once again, time to blame the media

[Loud Whispers]

Ah, the 'New media? That must be to blame!' idea that seems to permeate everything in every era.

I know you're being sarcastic but the Daily Mail just linked to 4chan in order to prove that the Iranian was getting revenge for bullying

DANK MEMES CONTROL THE FUTURE

[Rolepgeek]

I've got to be honest

I'm perfectly willing to blame old media too.

And corporations

And politicians

And the poor. It's probably their fault too.

Oh, and foreigners, it's foreigners' fault for ruining their own country.

The internet is also to blame, particularly 4chan's legacy of bullying

And you know what I think I'll also toss in a bit of blaming religion, and blaming a lack of it. Too many people are atheist/pagan these days. We need to get back to the good old days of -200 BC when people understood that the only proper god to worship was Jupiter and co.

EDIT: Wait what the fuck

My second-to-crowning ridiculous blame was actually true?

What the hell, new media?

[Rolepgeek]

Certain types of violence have risen. Other types have fallen. I think it really depends on too many other variables to really say.

[Loud Whispers]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I just clocked
This kid bought 300 bullets

What are Germany's gun laws

[Erkki]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I just clocked
This kid bought 300 bullets

What are Germany's gun laws

The answer to people using illegal firearms is obviously dearming law-abiding citizens. Because guns are evil, and think about the children!

edit: its very difficult to acquire a pistol legally in Germany.