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[Sheb]

What's that Varoufake thing?

[martinuzz]

It is a tasteless poem. A poem nonetheless. It rhymes, and it has metric (at least the german original version does).
It should fall completely under the freedom of arts. If this guy gets convicted for this, it's a big loss for the german constitutional state.

It's tasteless nonetheless, and infantile. It deserves a lot of criticism. But no legal action.

[ChairmanPoo]

What's that Varoufake thing?

apparently Bohmermann manipulated/photogram-selected a picture in which Varoufakis seemed to be giving a katapygon "to Germany/EU/(insert target here)".  Turned out to be fake, but not before it was reported around by more mainstream press

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/mar/19/i-faked-the-yanis-varoufakis-middle-finger-video-says-german-tv-presenter


EDIT: or maybe it wasn't faked? http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2015/03/giving-germany-the-middle-finger/388204/

Much confusion. so wow
So apparently a video in which Varoufakis might or might not have been giving the finger to the world was claimed by Bohrman as a fake. Which turned out to be not true. So it was a fake fake fake?

[martinuzz]

Today, the Turkish vice-premier Numan Kurtulmus called the poem a "crime against humanity".

Hear, hear!

The german Justice department has already stated that they are not planning on convicting Böhmermann. If they get the assignment to prosectute from the government, they will only persue that to answer the question if he is guilty, but they will refuse to convict.

[Sergarr]

Hate leaflets calling for killing of Ahmadi Muslims distributed across London.

Leaflets calling for members of the Ahmadi Muslim community to be killed have allegedly been distributed in universities, mosques and shopping centres in London.

Followers of the Muslim Ahmadi sect, which preaches a message of peace and tolerance, have long been subject to violent attacks and persecution in Pakistan, where they are branded worse than apostates by hardliners and forbidden by the state to call themselves Muslims.

Now the wave of persecution appears to have spread to the UK, with a man admitting in a public statement that he killed Ahmadi shopkeeper Asad Shah in Glasgow for disrespecting Islam. The unusual statement coincides with the distribution across London of leaflets calling for followers of the religion to be killed.

The "religion of peace" is so peaceful that a significant portion of its believers consider slightly different Muslims that preach peace and tolerance as worse than apostates and to be killed, if they don't "repent" and convert back to the normal Islam - and they actually do so.

europe is going on a ride

i want to get off mr. bones wild ride

[Helgoland]

The Varoufake thing was only possible due to how damn sloppy our journalists are working, so I say good he exposed that.

Wait, what? They reported on an event of which there was video evidence, and when presented with evidence that suggested it was fake, they reported on that. How is that exposing sloppiness, as opposed to just stright-up lying to get media attention?

It is a tasteless poem. A poem nonetheless. It rhymes, and it has metric (at least the german original version does).
It should fall completely under the freedom of arts. If this guy gets convicted for this, it's a big loss for the german constitutional state.

It's tasteless nonetheless, and infantile. It deserves a lot of criticism. But no legal action.

There is a law against it, and Böhmermann was aware of that. It would be a great loss to the German Rechtsstaat if there was no legal action, because that would mean putting day-to-day politics above the law. Just ask yourself: Would he be getting the same reaction for calling Obama a banana-lving cotton boy?

So apparently a video in which Varoufakis might or might not have been giving the finger to the world was claimed by Bohrman as a fake. Which turned out to be not true. So it was a fake fake fake?

Varoufakis flipped of Germany (not the world, Germany) at some event a couple years back, waaaayyy before he became a minister. This was dug up by some German talkshow, and subsequently overhyped (seriously, go look at the original - it's a triviality). The real kicker is that Varoufakis immediately opted for just straight-up lying to the world, claiming the video was fake and that the events depicted had never happened - and this at the height of German-Greek tension. Böhmermann then faked evidence that showed him/his team faking that middle finger, supposedly exculpating Varoufakis. Said evidence made quite a stir, but was quickly exposed to be false as well.

For some reason this is considered to be a stroke of genius by Böhmermann.

When you persecute literally 2000 people for insulting you, then you deserve to be insulted.

If you kill a lot of people, you deserve to die? Go buy a rifle and hunt down Erdogan, then, because insultng him is not nearly enough.

Flawless logic.

Glad to see you agree with me. Paying back injury with injury is a frightfully primitive impulse.

[Shadowlord]

literally hitter

literally hitter

[Antioch]

The poem is a direct reaction to the severe abuse of the laws to persecute people "insulting" the president by Erdogan.

Obama does not persecute people for insulting him in that way.

Someone a 1000 miles away insulting you does not hurt you. Getting put in jail several years and being abused by security forces for insulting the great leader destroys lives.

[Sonlirain]

Hate leaflets calling for killing of Ahmadi Muslims distributed across London.

Leaflets calling for members of the Ahmadi Muslim community to be killed have allegedly been distributed in universities, mosques and shopping centres in London.

Followers of the Muslim Ahmadi sect, which preaches a message of peace and tolerance, have long been subject to violent attacks and persecution in Pakistan, where they are branded worse than apostates by hardliners and forbidden by the state to call themselves Muslims.

Now the wave of persecution appears to have spread to the UK, with a man admitting in a public statement that he killed Ahmadi shopkeeper Asad Shah in Glasgow for disrespecting Islam. The unusual statement coincides with the distribution across London of leaflets calling for followers of the religion to be killed.

The "religion of peace" is so peaceful that a significant portion of its believers consider slightly different Muslims that preach peace and tolerance as worse than apostates and to be killed, if they don't "repent" and convert back to the normal Islam - and they actually do so.

europe is going on a ride

i want to get off mr. bones wild ride

This is why chaotic evil empires don't exist and collapse on themselves within a generation.
Without dictators regularly telling them to cut out with this crap they just fall into petty infighting over pretty much nothing but a slight difference in worldview.

[Helgoland]

The poem is a direct reaction to the severe abuse of the laws to persecute people "insulting" the president by Erdogan.

Obama does not persecute people for insulting him in that way.

Someone a 1000 miles away insulting you does not hurt you. Getting put in jail several years and being abused by security forces for insulting the great leader destroys lives.

How are Erdogan's policies relevant to the judicial assessment of Böhmermann's case? If I understand you correctly, you want to persecute crimes differently depending on who they hurt. That violates fundamental judicial norms.

[Antioch]

The poem is a direct reaction to the severe abuse of the laws to persecute people "insulting" the president by Erdogan.

Obama does not persecute people for insulting him in that way.

Someone a 1000 miles away insulting you does not hurt you. Getting put in jail several years and being abused by security forces for insulting the great leader destroys lives.

How are Erdogan's policies relevant to the judicial assessment of Böhmermann's case? If I understand you correctly, you want to persecute crimes differently depending on who they hurt. That violates fundamental judicial norms.

persecuting crimes differently depending on who they hurt is actually what Erdogan's policy IS.

[Antsan]

The Varoufake thing was only possible due to how damn sloppy our journalists are working, so I say good he exposed that.

Wait, what? They reported on an event of which there was video evidence, and when presented with evidence that suggested it was fake, they reported on that. How is that exposing sloppiness, as opposed to just stright-up lying to get media attention?

Böhmermann is hardly the only one who's lying to get media attention. That's the whole point – he's first lying and then pointing it out (as opposed to many liars who are never caught), so that maybe one day journalists learn to check their stories before spinning them into the next scandal.

Varoufakis flipped of Germany (not the world, Germany) at some event a couple years back, waaaayyy before he became a minister. This was dug up by some German talkshow, and subsequently overhyped (seriously, go look at the original - it's a triviality). The real kicker is that Varoufakis immediately opted for just straight-up lying to the world, claiming the video was fake and that the events depicted had never happened - and this at the height of German-Greek tension. Böhmermann then faked evidence that showed him/his team faking that middle finger, supposedly exculpating Varoufakis. Said evidence made quite a stir, but was quickly exposed to be false as well.

He did not "flip of Germany", he was making a point about how when Germany will finally be suffering the consequences of their economic misbehavior it will be okay for Greece to not care. Jauch just took the whole thing out of context and just assumed that this was meant to be a middle finger to Germany.
And that's why Böhmermann is completely right in making the whole thing as obviously ridiculous as it was in the first place.

How are Erdogan's policies relevant to the judicial assessment of Böhmermann's case? If I understand you correctly, you want to persecute crimes differently depending on who they hurt. That violates fundamental judicial norms.

I actually believe that persons of public interest who exert vast amounts of power should not be protected against attacks against their personality.

[SirQuiamus]

If I understand you correctly, you want to persecute crimes differently depending on who they hurt. That violates fundamental judicial norms.

would you demand equal punishment for a kid who pushes a classmate during recess and a guy who pushes a frail old lady in a stairwell? ...or someone who distributes genocidal leaflets in a mosque and a guy who insults the ego of megalomaniacal dictator?

your idea of equality before the law is skewed by your conservative catholic liberalism, helgo

[hector13]

If I understand you correctly, you want to persecute crimes differently depending on who they hurt. That violates fundamental judicial norms.

would you demand equal punishment for a kid who pushes a classmate during recess and a guy who pushes a frail old lady in a stairwell? ...or someone who distributes genocidal leaflets in a mosque and a guy who insults the ego of megalomaniacal dictator?

your idea of equality before the law is skewed by your conservative catholic liberalism, helgo

I don't think the things you're equating are quite the the same things.

[SirQuiamus]

I'm not equating them, I'm asking if it's right to equate them

...and it's not.